What the 2025 State of Rehab Therapy Report Reveals

WEBVTT

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You're listening to the PT Pinecast,

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where smart people in healthcare come to

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make noise.

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Here's your host, Jimmy McKay.

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Thanks, Voice Guy.

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Big thanks to Sarah Health,

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the remote care platform helping clinics

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I like this about them too.

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They automate daily patient check-ins via

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text.

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Because if I got to download one more

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And then no more app means no more

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login, which is also good.

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A simple way to meet RTM requirements,

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improve follow-through,

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and actually get reimbursed for care

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between visits.

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Easy to set up, simple to use,

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and patients, they seem to love it.

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SarahHealth.com, S-A-R-A-Health.com.

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I know people named Sarah are very

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particular.

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Sarah, Sarah with an H.

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s-a-r-a health.com our guest today not new

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to this show not new to the audience

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she's been here i think she was like

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episode twelve or twenty like something in

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the first twenty um and she's been part

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of the profession for a long time since

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this show is still finding its footing i

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don't know if we've found it yet but

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we're still working on it um and we've

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told her origin story before clinician

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founder builder leader but today isn't

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about really how she started today's about

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And what you want to know,

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where are we now?

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And the big we is you listening or

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watching, looking at you,

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but also like the profession.

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So her organization has been doing this

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state of rehab therapy report,

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which was just a really good idea,

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still is.

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But I remember thinking about it and

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saying, yes,

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you have access to all these people who

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have similar problems.

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And let's figure out,

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not just by like sort of figuring out

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which way the wind is blowing,

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like actually asking them questions, data.

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to clearly paint a picture, clinicians,

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leaders,

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might be experiencing two very different

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realities inside the same clinics today.

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Maybe burnout isn't the full story.

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Maybe misalignment is.

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Ooh, is that foreshadowing?

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Yes, it's always foreshadowing.

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So she's back, friend of the show,

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co-founder of WebPT,

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and someone who's never been afraid to

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challenge this profession to do better.

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Heidi Jananga,

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welcome back for I don't even know how

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many times to the show,

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to the PT podcast, Heidi Jananga.

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I stopped counting,

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but it's always a pleasure.

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Thank you so much for having me.

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I watched a recent episode of Saturday

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Night Live.

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I think it's the Five Timers Club.

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I know, it ain't a jacket.

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They get a jacket.

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It's a smoking jacket.

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Steve Martin, Martin Short,

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Justin Timberlake.

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When you see who's in the Five Timers

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Club, it's pretty legit.

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You have to be well beyond.

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The jacket's in the mail.

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I'll get my assistant.

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I think you should do some sort of

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mug.

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You are the pint cast, right?

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It needs to be some kind of cool

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mug.

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That's what it is.

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Just throwing it out there.

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All right, good.

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All right, so let's get to this data,

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right?

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So you guys,

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how long have you been doing this,

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the state of therapy rehab report?

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You guys have been doing this for a

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while now.

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Yeah,

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I want to say this is like year

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twelve that we've actually done it and

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pulled it together,

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created this beautiful report and

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published it for all of our members,

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but also to the public to really access

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this information and data.

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It really shows, I mean,

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even for twelve years where it used to

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be twenty five years ago.

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I don't know.

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I'm making numbers up.

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If you had information,

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the goal was hoard it.

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And if you wanted it,

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you had to join.

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And then all of a sudden somewhere because

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of these things, smartphones,

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it then became the absolute opposite,

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which is the more you give away like

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a boomerang, things come back.

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And it's like a bell curve, right?

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You got people who are never going to

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buy from you or use you.

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You got people who are already buying from

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you and who are lifers who are always

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going to buy from you.

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And then you're just thinking it's the

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middle.

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The middle is a jump ball.

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What can I give to that middle to

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get them to go, huh,

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let me see me in a different light.

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And you guys chose sort of the state

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of the union report for PT and give

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it away.

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Yeah.

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Selfishly,

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it was really for us to understand the

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industry a little bit better because a lot

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of where the data lay,

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was behind firewalls, right?

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That you had to have either an APTA

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membership, which I do,

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but a lot of people don't.

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And so how do you get this information?

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And frankly, we were one of the

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the earliest organizations to really start

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talking more about the business side of PT

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and really how to run your business more

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efficiently and not just only about the

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clinical information,

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clinical data that's going on with patient

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care.

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Okay.

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All right.

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So for someone who hasn't read it yet,

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and we'll put the link in the show

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notes and how they can get it.

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What are things that now you, I mean,

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you can now look at a report like

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this and see similarities and differences.

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What are a couple findings that pop up

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that should make clinic owners pause?

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What is the signal in the noise for

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this twenty twenty five report that just

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came out?

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Well,

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you did sort of drop some breadcrumbs at

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your intro here.

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We are hearing a lot about burnout in

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the industry,

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and we know that there have been a

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lot of clinicians that have left patient

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care.

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They may still carry their license,

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but they're not actually treating

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patients,

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or they may have left the industry as

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a whole.

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And so this year,

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we really kind of wanted to dig a

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little bit deeper into what are the

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underlying causes of that.

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And we found a couple of things that

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were fairly glaring.

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And you mentioned it,

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like the audience that were able to take

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this survey were leaders.

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They were clinicians.

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And in that clinician bucket,

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there were more newer grads versus some

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seasoned individuals.

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And I think, you know,

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maybe top three sort of things that stood

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out was the sort of gap or as

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you as you called it and we called

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it this this malalignment between

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leadership and, if you will,

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the working class.

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Right.

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And I think for the most part.

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we became physical therapists.

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You go to school to become a physical

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therapist because you want to treat

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patients.

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Um, and you know,

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providers really cite the work itself,

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like getting my hands dirty,

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getting my patients, uh,

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expressing my abilities and my, uh,

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ability to treat patients, um,

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is really what their top motivator is.

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While, um,

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Clinic leadership thinks a lot of the

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burnout is that they're treating too many

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patients and that they are really

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underestimating the providers really want

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to treat patients.

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It's just the how they're having to treat

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patients at this point in time.

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And that's a huge gap.

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It's like by a factor of forty six

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percent where clinic leadership is

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underestimating the importance of the work

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itself.

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Whereas the providers are saying, no, no,

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this remains my top motivator.

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It's not salary.

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It's not these other things.

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This still remains my top motivator.

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So that was the first thing.

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And then the second is really in the

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salary misconception.

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So owners and clinic leaders are

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consistently over indexing on salary as

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the demotivator.

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Oh,

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we can't we just can't pay people enough.

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And yet what clinicians and staff are

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reporting is that.

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while salary still remains important it's

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not our number one thing our number one

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thing is about the bureaucracy in a

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practice or the lack of decision making

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the poor working condition poor working

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conditions and in their eyes meaning a

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little bit about work-life balance um

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And also just do they have what they're

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seeing out there or experiencing and

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seeing at CSM, you know,

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some of the latest and greatest in

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technology?

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Or are they still, you know,

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very small percentage,

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but are you still documenting on pen and

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paper, right?

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Some of these really obscure sort of

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working conditions that you wouldn't

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necessarily think still exist,

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but it is out there.

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The private equity funds that have come

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into the industry over the last ten years,

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we have a lot of practices that are

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trying to scale,

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trying to get multiple clinics and even

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going from multiple clinics to a large

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number of practices.

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And so as as clinics try and do

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scale,

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the administrative complexity often grows,

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which can lead to.

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even higher levels of burnout in a decline

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in patient experience if it's not done

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well uh and so i think you know

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what we're seeing is this uh unfortunate

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you know coming together of

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companies wanting to grow which which you

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know costs money to do at the same

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time as you've got uh uh reimbursements

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continuing to decline and so you know when

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margins are are are lower it's it's harder

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to grow but you have this mandate to

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grow uh and so

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you're going to push forward with what

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you're poised to do.

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But oftentimes,

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leaving in the wake are some of the

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feel-good things that are necessary,

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I can think at this moment,

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from a retention standpoint,

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clinician experience,

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as well as patient experience.

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Yeah,

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so let's go into that a little bit.

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There were a few presentations that were

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actually at CSM about generations.

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And I'm always interested in this,

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and we should always be interested in

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this,

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because

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these kids today i feel like you could

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put that on a t-shirt and in one

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minute you're the kid that that's saying

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these kids today the next minute you're

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the person saying these kids today as the

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world changes generations change and

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what's important to those genera different

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generations is going to continually change

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so the report showing clinicians are

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motivated by things like purpose autonomy

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meaning and meaningful work.

00:10:30.885 --> 00:10:33.806
Yet sometimes leaders might assume,

00:10:33.966 --> 00:10:34.386
and again,

00:10:34.446 --> 00:10:36.007
we have this misalignment of an assumption

00:10:36.047 --> 00:10:36.687
or reality,

00:10:37.127 --> 00:10:38.988
that compensation might be their primary

00:10:39.028 --> 00:10:39.368
driver.

00:10:39.448 --> 00:10:40.449
Listen, we all want to get paid.

00:10:40.469 --> 00:10:41.369
We want to make sure we can pay

00:10:41.389 --> 00:10:42.430
rent and buy cornflakes.

00:10:42.670 --> 00:10:43.110
Important.

00:10:44.170 --> 00:10:44.911
So why does that

00:10:46.074 --> 00:10:48.615
disconnect persists and why is someone who

00:10:48.715 --> 00:10:50.616
understands it and reads this report and

00:10:50.756 --> 00:10:52.597
acts on it going to have a better

00:10:53.137 --> 00:10:56.098
position or going to going to probably do

00:10:56.178 --> 00:10:58.999
well in in twenty twenty six and beyond

00:11:00.960 --> 00:11:02.761
yeah so this is this is the inflection

00:11:02.801 --> 00:11:05.482
point that we talk about right when you

00:11:05.642 --> 00:11:09.564
if you don't truly understand what's

00:11:09.604 --> 00:11:11.965
happening right now and the pressures that

00:11:12.265 --> 00:11:14.286
practices are under from a financial

00:11:14.306 --> 00:11:14.926
standpoint

00:11:15.827 --> 00:11:17.689
And so you have the cost of living,

00:11:18.490 --> 00:11:20.131
cost of everything going up,

00:11:20.691 --> 00:11:23.174
while our reimbursement,

00:11:23.254 --> 00:11:25.376
if you're utilizing insurance,

00:11:26.637 --> 00:11:28.438
has significantly gone down over the

00:11:28.479 --> 00:11:28.599
years.

00:11:28.639 --> 00:11:29.760
We talk about this every year.

00:11:29.780 --> 00:11:31.421
We had another two point eight percent

00:11:32.162 --> 00:11:34.324
reduction in our overall Medicare

00:11:34.484 --> 00:11:35.385
reimbursement this year,

00:11:35.405 --> 00:11:38.407
which trickles down to all insurances.

00:11:39.508 --> 00:11:42.091
We continue to have practices that

00:11:42.758 --> 00:11:46.381
sign contracts to get paid less than what

00:11:46.861 --> 00:11:48.602
it costs to do business.

00:11:49.963 --> 00:11:54.767
And so we're sort of shooting ourselves in

00:11:54.787 --> 00:11:58.630
the foot when now the only option that

00:11:58.670 --> 00:12:02.453
you have is to increase volume in order

00:12:02.493 --> 00:12:05.335
to offset and meet demands that you might

00:12:05.375 --> 00:12:09.198
have from a revenue and a bottom line

00:12:09.238 --> 00:12:09.838
standpoint.

00:12:10.759 --> 00:12:11.920
And then you've got

00:12:12.823 --> 00:12:15.524
your generation that this generation who

00:12:15.564 --> 00:12:18.245
is looking for uh you know an autonomy

00:12:18.305 --> 00:12:20.006
is earned let me let's just let's just

00:12:20.126 --> 00:12:22.667
start there right so but you're coming

00:12:22.787 --> 00:12:24.428
into a place where there's not a lot

00:12:24.468 --> 00:12:28.170
of time to do mentorship because you're

00:12:28.230 --> 00:12:30.591
having to treat a boatload of patients so

00:12:31.071 --> 00:12:32.932
you know the the mentorship component that

00:12:32.972 --> 00:12:35.253
people are looking for uh isn't always

00:12:35.293 --> 00:12:38.654
there um and so what do we do

00:12:38.734 --> 00:12:40.315
you have a lot of practices that are

00:12:40.355 --> 00:12:42.136
now moving to more cash-based

00:12:42.776 --> 00:12:47.099
uh practice or which is great moving to

00:12:47.139 --> 00:12:49.681
towards technology to help offset some of

00:12:49.721 --> 00:12:52.843
those administrative burden issues where

00:12:52.863 --> 00:12:55.445
this is really where we're going again a

00:12:55.485 --> 00:12:57.547
little bit of misalignment because

00:12:57.747 --> 00:12:59.788
although this generation is very in tune

00:12:59.808 --> 00:13:00.629
with technology

00:13:01.421 --> 00:13:04.282
they still don't want to lose that patient

00:13:04.322 --> 00:13:05.642
provider interaction.

00:13:05.662 --> 00:13:09.323
And this is where hopefully AI is really,

00:13:09.423 --> 00:13:10.644
and it's showing now,

00:13:11.044 --> 00:13:13.464
showing up in a lot of different platforms

00:13:14.385 --> 00:13:16.225
to hopefully solve some of that problem

00:13:16.265 --> 00:13:17.605
where you've got the ambient,

00:13:17.625 --> 00:13:20.186
you've got other types of technology that

00:13:20.226 --> 00:13:23.227
are coming in to hopefully reduce the

00:13:23.267 --> 00:13:24.347
administrative burden,

00:13:24.467 --> 00:13:26.568
but still allow us to have that

00:13:27.698 --> 00:13:29.799
secret sauce of us as physical therapists

00:13:29.819 --> 00:13:31.219
that we get to do so much better

00:13:31.239 --> 00:13:33.720
than everyone else is put hands on

00:13:33.760 --> 00:13:35.841
patients, have that interaction,

00:13:35.881 --> 00:13:39.242
that human interaction that both patients

00:13:39.422 --> 00:13:40.602
and clinicians are craving.

00:13:41.102 --> 00:13:41.642
Yeah.

00:13:41.723 --> 00:13:43.383
A lot of the people in,

00:13:44.783 --> 00:13:46.004
we'll call them pundits, right?

00:13:46.044 --> 00:13:47.784
The Gary V's of the world are saying

00:13:48.365 --> 00:13:49.685
the pendulum only swings two different

00:13:49.705 --> 00:13:51.306
ways, right?

00:13:51.326 --> 00:13:52.626
Bell-bottoms are

00:13:52.934 --> 00:13:53.714
were super cool.

00:13:54.374 --> 00:13:55.335
And then they were not.

00:13:55.815 --> 00:13:56.855
And then they were cool again.

00:13:56.955 --> 00:13:58.355
And then guess what happened after that?

00:13:58.395 --> 00:13:59.616
Then they were not, right?

00:13:59.656 --> 00:14:01.116
So we went real, we had to,

00:14:01.136 --> 00:14:03.617
the world had to go digital everything out

00:14:03.697 --> 00:14:04.917
of necessity.

00:14:05.637 --> 00:14:06.977
Guess what's going to happen next?

00:14:06.997 --> 00:14:09.318
We're going to crave that other thing.

00:14:09.978 --> 00:14:10.958
And it sounds like you're saying,

00:14:11.018 --> 00:14:13.919
how can we keep the efficiencies of a

00:14:13.999 --> 00:14:16.400
scribe or some of this technology without

00:14:16.460 --> 00:14:19.300
losing this other stuff as I rub my

00:14:19.340 --> 00:14:21.081
hands together on a podcast to show you

00:14:21.101 --> 00:14:21.361
that

00:14:21.981 --> 00:14:23.882
That humanity part that we like to sort

00:14:23.902 --> 00:14:25.063
of plant our flag in.

00:14:25.824 --> 00:14:28.105
And so how do we gain without losing?

00:14:28.305 --> 00:14:29.666
Which is a good way to think about

00:14:29.726 --> 00:14:29.826
it.

00:14:30.607 --> 00:14:33.409
So do you think with the disconnect

00:14:33.429 --> 00:14:36.191
between clinicians and leaders,

00:14:36.791 --> 00:14:37.952
it's probably a little bit all three,

00:14:37.992 --> 00:14:38.172
right?

00:14:38.192 --> 00:14:39.793
So it always, it depends, right?

00:14:39.813 --> 00:14:40.593
It's always in the middle.

00:14:40.613 --> 00:14:41.654
Is it communication?

00:14:42.074 --> 00:14:43.375
Is it incentive structure?

00:14:44.056 --> 00:14:45.517
Is it just plain generational?

00:14:46.037 --> 00:14:47.858
Is it, are we talking past each other?

00:14:48.379 --> 00:14:50.460
Like where can someone capitalize?

00:14:50.480 --> 00:14:51.661
Like this information is good.

00:14:52.794 --> 00:14:53.895
But if you were to wave a wand,

00:14:53.915 --> 00:14:55.536
if you weren't working where you are,

00:14:55.556 --> 00:14:56.777
if you weren't sitting where you are and

00:14:56.817 --> 00:14:57.798
you were running a clinic,

00:14:58.158 --> 00:15:00.620
how would you operationalize this

00:15:00.660 --> 00:15:01.160
information?

00:15:01.180 --> 00:15:03.322
What would you do with it?

00:15:03.402 --> 00:15:03.762
Well,

00:15:03.962 --> 00:15:05.924
the first step is to take a moment

00:15:06.304 --> 00:15:07.605
to listen, right?

00:15:08.425 --> 00:15:12.288
And not just be autocratic and think that

00:15:12.308 --> 00:15:13.189
you know everything.

00:15:14.038 --> 00:15:15.500
everything that this is how you're going

00:15:15.520 --> 00:15:17.402
to do it in your practice out of

00:15:17.422 --> 00:15:17.763
the gate.

00:15:18.384 --> 00:15:20.466
Really, at this point in time, you know,

00:15:20.506 --> 00:15:22.849
clinicians and which are, you know,

00:15:23.070 --> 00:15:25.453
mostly in the younger generation or the

00:15:25.653 --> 00:15:27.155
generation below leaders.

00:15:29.737 --> 00:15:31.058
You've got to take time to listen.

00:15:31.098 --> 00:15:32.539
It can't be command and control.

00:15:34.099 --> 00:15:36.700
That autonomy, wanting autonomy is real.

00:15:37.121 --> 00:15:41.402
Coming to the table with good ideas is

00:15:41.703 --> 00:15:42.803
definitely happening,

00:15:42.863 --> 00:15:45.104
but you've got to take time to listen

00:15:45.524 --> 00:15:46.565
before you're acting.

00:15:47.465 --> 00:15:50.907
So having more of a distributed leadership

00:15:50.947 --> 00:15:52.307
sort of model, if you will,

00:15:52.367 --> 00:15:55.388
to where you want people to feel like

00:15:55.449 --> 00:15:56.789
they have...

00:15:59.150 --> 00:16:02.073
some options to provide ideas like they

00:16:02.193 --> 00:16:03.274
are in it with you,

00:16:04.496 --> 00:16:06.097
not just working for you.

00:16:07.018 --> 00:16:11.282
And so that sort of shared decision making

00:16:11.322 --> 00:16:13.244
when it comes to, you know,

00:16:13.304 --> 00:16:15.226
different possibilities in a practice,

00:16:15.286 --> 00:16:16.868
I think is really important at this point

00:16:16.908 --> 00:16:17.348
in time.

00:16:17.388 --> 00:16:19.310
And that sort of bridges that generational

00:16:19.350 --> 00:16:19.650
gap.

00:16:19.991 --> 00:16:22.273
And then also every individual is

00:16:22.373 --> 00:16:23.354
motivated differently.

00:16:23.614 --> 00:16:24.714
And we can't forget that.

00:16:24.794 --> 00:16:26.675
It's not just a blanket thing where all

00:16:26.715 --> 00:16:27.635
PT is just one.

00:16:27.655 --> 00:16:28.315
And this is, I think,

00:16:28.335 --> 00:16:31.616
part of the the model alignment is that,

00:16:31.776 --> 00:16:34.456
you know, perhaps in in our day,

00:16:34.496 --> 00:16:36.757
like salary was was the thing.

00:16:38.577 --> 00:16:39.758
And I will also say,

00:16:39.838 --> 00:16:42.858
how did we get more salary in the

00:16:42.878 --> 00:16:44.699
past was you had to move into the

00:16:44.779 --> 00:16:46.079
administrative roles, right?

00:16:47.525 --> 00:16:49.887
And what we're seeing in this report is

00:16:50.267 --> 00:16:51.608
they love treating patients.

00:16:51.648 --> 00:16:54.010
They don't want to have to only move

00:16:54.050 --> 00:16:56.111
to administration and away from patient

00:16:56.151 --> 00:16:57.112
care to earn more money.

00:16:57.172 --> 00:16:59.393
So how do we create, you know,

00:17:00.574 --> 00:17:03.196
a better compensation model around being

00:17:03.216 --> 00:17:06.038
just an excellent, excellent clinician?

00:17:07.295 --> 00:17:09.277
um and you know there's a there's a

00:17:09.317 --> 00:17:11.498
lot of issues that are swirling around

00:17:11.538 --> 00:17:13.880
that how this can be done um and

00:17:13.960 --> 00:17:16.162
also why it's very difficult to be done

00:17:16.682 --> 00:17:18.423
mainly because of the cost of education

00:17:18.483 --> 00:17:19.945
right now people are coming out with

00:17:20.065 --> 00:17:22.827
higher debt than ever before and they're

00:17:23.047 --> 00:17:25.789
they are looking for paths and avenues to

00:17:26.229 --> 00:17:28.911
be able to uh make more money right

00:17:29.371 --> 00:17:31.453
and right now that's just really hard to

00:17:31.493 --> 00:17:32.654
do when you're

00:17:33.461 --> 00:17:35.962
reimbursement is not changing as a matter

00:17:35.982 --> 00:17:38.323
of fact in the wrong direction right so

00:17:38.683 --> 00:17:41.905
being creative in ways that you can uh

00:17:42.085 --> 00:17:45.126
reward uh and allow people to become

00:17:45.246 --> 00:17:47.567
better clinicians and at the same time

00:17:47.627 --> 00:17:50.148
like we have got to continue to advocate

00:17:50.288 --> 00:17:52.049
not just for more pay but how do

00:17:52.069 --> 00:17:56.251
we change uh compensation with regard like

00:17:57.691 --> 00:18:00.552
why do people get residency program or go

00:18:00.572 --> 00:18:01.673
through a residency program

00:18:03.073 --> 00:18:04.235
You're not making more money.

00:18:05.436 --> 00:18:06.979
Somebody who's residency trained

00:18:07.039 --> 00:18:09.462
definitely is not making any more money in

00:18:09.482 --> 00:18:11.846
the eyes of an insurance company, right?

00:18:12.445 --> 00:18:15.807
And so how do we change our model

00:18:15.948 --> 00:18:19.530
to actually improve and advocate for

00:18:21.071 --> 00:18:22.172
outcomes, right?

00:18:22.512 --> 00:18:23.873
If you're going through residency,

00:18:23.913 --> 00:18:25.534
the thought process should be that you

00:18:25.774 --> 00:18:27.496
actually could treat patients better,

00:18:27.536 --> 00:18:29.297
whether it's more efficiently or with

00:18:29.337 --> 00:18:30.098
better outcomes.

00:18:30.578 --> 00:18:31.719
How do we get to a place where

00:18:31.759 --> 00:18:35.321
we're actually compensated for, you know,

00:18:35.341 --> 00:18:36.862
the outcomes that we're actually having

00:18:36.882 --> 00:18:39.064
with patients rather than just

00:18:40.110 --> 00:18:41.491
Everybody gets paid the same,

00:18:41.631 --> 00:18:44.313
no matter what level of PT you are.

00:18:44.813 --> 00:18:44.893
Oh,

00:18:45.333 --> 00:18:47.154
I had a post on LinkedIn last week

00:18:47.194 --> 00:18:48.195
that said this.

00:18:48.535 --> 00:18:48.915
And of course,

00:18:48.935 --> 00:18:49.876
I like to poke the bear.

00:18:50.216 --> 00:18:51.357
My job is not to be right.

00:18:51.417 --> 00:18:53.198
My job is to ask people questions and

00:18:53.238 --> 00:18:54.899
have them let's discuss,

00:18:55.059 --> 00:18:56.860
as they did on a great Saturday Night

00:18:56.880 --> 00:19:00.783
Live skit with Mike Myers, coffee talk.

00:19:01.403 --> 00:19:03.304
And the thing that I was shining a

00:19:03.344 --> 00:19:05.325
light on was you could give poor care

00:19:05.345 --> 00:19:06.426
or great care and you get paid the

00:19:06.466 --> 00:19:06.606
same.

00:19:06.646 --> 00:19:08.247
And that's dot, dot, dot.

00:19:08.427 --> 00:19:09.348
And that's not fair.

00:19:10.445 --> 00:19:11.165
And that sucks.

00:19:11.986 --> 00:19:13.647
One thing I'll say that I think I've

00:19:13.707 --> 00:19:14.587
noticed is,

00:19:15.888 --> 00:19:17.529
I think if I were to ask someone

00:19:17.789 --> 00:19:18.789
early in their career,

00:19:21.011 --> 00:19:22.771
describe or give me like a line,

00:19:23.712 --> 00:19:24.332
a great leader.

00:19:24.933 --> 00:19:26.313
And I think how I would have described

00:19:26.353 --> 00:19:27.834
a great boss, fifteen years ago,

00:19:27.854 --> 00:19:29.295
would have been, they're a great leader,

00:19:29.555 --> 00:19:30.616
they're very knowledgeable,

00:19:30.756 --> 00:19:32.757
and all those things still should be true.

00:19:33.217 --> 00:19:34.618
What I hear more often is,

00:19:34.998 --> 00:19:35.778
I feel like they get it.

00:19:36.419 --> 00:19:37.839
And that sounds like a dumbing down of

00:19:37.859 --> 00:19:38.400
a compliment,

00:19:39.464 --> 00:19:40.806
But what I hear is that they get,

00:19:41.367 --> 00:19:42.630
when someone says they get it,

00:19:43.010 --> 00:19:43.551
what they mean,

00:19:43.571 --> 00:19:44.994
what I take that for meaning is they

00:19:45.034 --> 00:19:45.455
get me.

00:19:46.429 --> 00:19:47.709
like when you sit down with a really

00:19:47.749 --> 00:19:49.170
good leader and you walk out, you're like,

00:19:49.210 --> 00:19:49.650
they get it.

00:19:49.910 --> 00:19:51.730
It's like, whatever, whatever I said,

00:19:51.810 --> 00:19:53.710
they heard me, they understand it.

00:19:54.011 --> 00:19:55.111
Then hopefully they're going to

00:19:55.131 --> 00:19:56.111
operationalize that.

00:19:56.411 --> 00:19:57.571
And that's when people buy in.

00:19:57.591 --> 00:19:59.232
That's when people feel like I don't need

00:19:59.812 --> 00:20:00.612
autonomy.

00:20:01.012 --> 00:20:02.972
I want autonomy in my little sphere,

00:20:03.092 --> 00:20:04.973
like with my patients or my tasks.

00:20:05.593 --> 00:20:07.053
I want to feel like whatever I'm doing

00:20:07.153 --> 00:20:08.554
matters to the ship too.

00:20:09.094 --> 00:20:09.274
Right.

00:20:09.334 --> 00:20:10.354
Or where the ship is going in a

00:20:10.374 --> 00:20:11.614
direction I'd like to go into.

00:20:11.854 --> 00:20:12.694
We're on the rise here.

00:20:12.714 --> 00:20:13.675
We go in the right direction.

00:20:13.955 --> 00:20:15.435
So when I hear, when I hear,

00:20:16.580 --> 00:20:17.900
They get it, right?

00:20:17.960 --> 00:20:19.181
Like, why do you like your CEO,

00:20:19.221 --> 00:20:20.681
your clinic director or your manager,

00:20:20.721 --> 00:20:21.821
anybody, your coworker?

00:20:21.982 --> 00:20:22.482
They get it.

00:20:23.162 --> 00:20:25.483
Like that says that's a two way thing

00:20:25.503 --> 00:20:26.143
and not a one way.

00:20:26.243 --> 00:20:27.603
They're a great leader is great for the

00:20:27.643 --> 00:20:28.243
organization.

00:20:28.523 --> 00:20:29.924
They get it is great for both of

00:20:30.004 --> 00:20:30.184
us.

00:20:30.344 --> 00:20:32.024
And I think that's what it sounds like.

00:20:32.044 --> 00:20:33.425
That's what people are looking for.

00:20:33.805 --> 00:20:34.605
And they stick around.

00:20:34.685 --> 00:20:35.985
I don't know what the data I would

00:20:36.025 --> 00:20:36.186
bet.

00:20:37.726 --> 00:20:39.126
We could have a whole gambling thing

00:20:39.146 --> 00:20:39.767
before this, Heidi.

00:20:39.787 --> 00:20:40.927
This could be like an inside thing.

00:20:40.947 --> 00:20:41.807
We'll bet what the data is.

00:20:42.107 --> 00:20:44.468
I bet that people who feel that stay

00:20:44.508 --> 00:20:44.768
longer.

00:20:48.980 --> 00:20:49.300
Oh yeah.

00:20:49.461 --> 00:20:50.081
Clinic, uh,

00:20:50.462 --> 00:20:53.286
clinician retention for sure has so much

00:20:53.326 --> 00:20:56.590
to do with your liking people that you

00:20:56.630 --> 00:20:57.051
work with.

00:20:57.957 --> 00:21:00.880
That's been a staple in all of these

00:21:00.900 --> 00:21:03.423
different surveys for a long time with

00:21:03.463 --> 00:21:07.448
regard to why you stay in a position.

00:21:07.648 --> 00:21:10.572
You may even take less money on a

00:21:10.612 --> 00:21:13.455
salary basis if you really feel rewarded

00:21:14.476 --> 00:21:16.418
in the work that you're doing and the

00:21:16.459 --> 00:21:17.620
people that you're doing it with.

00:21:18.287 --> 00:21:20.209
And so when you ask, you know,

00:21:20.229 --> 00:21:21.370
what should owners be doing?

00:21:21.631 --> 00:21:22.492
And I think at this point,

00:21:22.532 --> 00:21:23.853
it's stop assuming and just start

00:21:23.893 --> 00:21:24.334
listening.

00:21:26.476 --> 00:21:29.119
And each individual person that's in the

00:21:29.179 --> 00:21:31.321
practice might be motivated in a slightly

00:21:31.361 --> 00:21:31.942
different way.

00:21:32.022 --> 00:21:33.904
And, you know, as a leader,

00:21:33.924 --> 00:21:36.547
we need to be thinking about people as

00:21:36.587 --> 00:21:39.210
individuals and not necessarily just as a

00:21:39.430 --> 00:21:40.431
customer in a group.

00:21:41.043 --> 00:21:41.243
I mean,

00:21:41.944 --> 00:21:43.665
I'm nodding along almost to the point

00:21:43.685 --> 00:21:45.246
where I'm hurting my neck because when I

00:21:45.266 --> 00:21:46.006
was in radio,

00:21:46.486 --> 00:21:47.807
there were people at the radio station

00:21:47.827 --> 00:21:51.229
that sold ad time and they drove BMWs.

00:21:51.709 --> 00:21:52.350
And I didn't.

00:21:52.930 --> 00:21:54.011
But I got to go to work every

00:21:54.031 --> 00:21:55.752
day and play rock music loud and give

00:21:55.772 --> 00:21:56.893
away beer and concert tickets.

00:21:57.233 --> 00:22:01.015
And I was elated to do so.

00:22:01.075 --> 00:22:02.656
I would have crawled through a mile of

00:22:02.676 --> 00:22:05.998
broken glass to keep doing that because

00:22:06.058 --> 00:22:07.839
the different things mattered to different

00:22:07.879 --> 00:22:08.219
people.

00:22:08.620 --> 00:22:10.041
And the people that pay attention to

00:22:10.081 --> 00:22:10.421
those...

00:22:10.921 --> 00:22:12.683
we'll keep the better people and better

00:22:12.723 --> 00:22:15.065
meaning a better fit for you and them

00:22:15.145 --> 00:22:17.587
when it's a two-way street man and i

00:22:17.627 --> 00:22:19.989
never realized this i ran a radio station

00:22:20.009 --> 00:22:21.750
i was just a radio guy how much

00:22:21.810 --> 00:22:24.072
replacing someone costs because where i

00:22:24.112 --> 00:22:26.854
worked i had fifty people outside that

00:22:26.874 --> 00:22:28.476
would have again crawled through broken

00:22:28.516 --> 00:22:30.417
class to take the job for less money

00:22:31.118 --> 00:22:32.839
but that's not always the case i never

00:22:32.940 --> 00:22:35.061
understood that until i came to healthcare

00:22:35.101 --> 00:22:36.663
and realized what replacing

00:22:37.715 --> 00:22:41.506
a good or bad employee actually costs and

00:22:41.526 --> 00:22:43.833
how that can hurt an organization or a

00:22:43.873 --> 00:22:44.375
business.

00:22:45.008 --> 00:22:45.728
Absolutely.

00:22:45.768 --> 00:22:46.968
Especially in our,

00:22:47.168 --> 00:22:49.109
our world of relationships, right?

00:22:49.129 --> 00:22:50.849
So somebody who's been with you,

00:22:50.889 --> 00:22:52.630
it has physician relationships,

00:22:52.670 --> 00:22:54.810
have community relationships,

00:22:54.870 --> 00:22:55.910
those types of things.

00:22:56.430 --> 00:22:59.131
If they go away and also they,

00:22:59.271 --> 00:22:59.491
I mean,

00:22:59.831 --> 00:23:01.251
I'm not saying that you have to retain

00:23:01.291 --> 00:23:03.772
people just because they are, you know,

00:23:03.832 --> 00:23:05.372
the, the rainmaker in your,

00:23:06.012 --> 00:23:08.253
in your organization, especially if,

00:23:08.433 --> 00:23:09.113
you know, they're not,

00:23:09.193 --> 00:23:11.293
they somehow they're not all of those

00:23:11.854 --> 00:23:12.014
things.

00:23:12.034 --> 00:23:13.874
I'm definitely not saying that, but

00:23:14.374 --> 00:23:15.455
For sure, you know,

00:23:16.517 --> 00:23:18.219
those things need to be rewarded.

00:23:18.359 --> 00:23:22.223
And again, reward is very personal.

00:23:22.704 --> 00:23:25.147
And one of the things that I've been

00:23:25.227 --> 00:23:27.349
really talking about is looking at when we

00:23:27.389 --> 00:23:27.890
talk about

00:23:28.500 --> 00:23:31.422
compensation which includes salary you

00:23:31.442 --> 00:23:34.044
look at the total compensation and this is

00:23:34.104 --> 00:23:38.486
an education for new grads and early uh

00:23:38.526 --> 00:23:41.288
you know uh recent grads as well getting

00:23:41.328 --> 00:23:44.330
their first jobs that it's it's not yes

00:23:44.370 --> 00:23:45.991
you might motivate it for salary and you

00:23:46.051 --> 00:23:47.892
definitely need to look at that when you

00:23:47.932 --> 00:23:49.533
have a student debt you have to pay

00:23:49.613 --> 00:23:51.314
off i i get it like you're looking

00:23:51.375 --> 00:23:53.176
at how much cash is coming in right

00:23:53.796 --> 00:23:55.017
and so if that's true

00:23:56.048 --> 00:23:58.614
You also need to say, okay, well,

00:23:58.714 --> 00:24:00.238
if they're gonna pay me upfront,

00:24:01.661 --> 00:24:04.006
I need to also recognize that maybe some

00:24:04.046 --> 00:24:05.289
of these other benefits

00:24:07.482 --> 00:24:09.103
Health care is important.

00:24:09.243 --> 00:24:09.503
Right.

00:24:09.543 --> 00:24:11.924
But maybe you're not going to get the

00:24:11.944 --> 00:24:13.525
health care that you only have a twenty

00:24:13.545 --> 00:24:16.066
five dollar copay.

00:24:16.287 --> 00:24:16.547
Right.

00:24:16.607 --> 00:24:17.607
Maybe you're going to have to pay a

00:24:17.647 --> 00:24:19.768
little bit more on the deductible side.

00:24:21.349 --> 00:24:24.010
You know, your your your PTO,

00:24:24.611 --> 00:24:25.851
everybody needs PTO,

00:24:25.971 --> 00:24:26.192
but

00:24:27.721 --> 00:24:29.302
Those are some things that might be

00:24:29.362 --> 00:24:30.343
negotiable as well.

00:24:31.604 --> 00:24:32.985
CEUs, right?

00:24:33.025 --> 00:24:34.066
If we're going to pay you a bunch

00:24:34.086 --> 00:24:34.887
of cash up front,

00:24:34.947 --> 00:24:36.288
maybe we're not going to pay you as

00:24:36.348 --> 00:24:38.470
much for the number of CEUs.

00:24:39.210 --> 00:24:41.792
The full compensation package has to be

00:24:41.852 --> 00:24:42.453
looked at.

00:24:43.273 --> 00:24:46.136
And those are things for me that you're

00:24:46.256 --> 00:24:48.537
able to sort of dial up or change.

00:24:49.038 --> 00:24:50.279
I like the a la carte method.

00:24:50.739 --> 00:24:50.999
Right.

00:24:51.019 --> 00:24:52.580
There's obviously some bottom line,

00:24:52.600 --> 00:24:54.300
baseline things like health care, I think,

00:24:54.920 --> 00:24:57.201
is really important for everyone to have

00:24:57.221 --> 00:24:57.661
the option.

00:24:57.701 --> 00:24:59.361
And it's mandatory most of the time at

00:24:59.381 --> 00:25:01.002
a certain size of the business.

00:25:01.042 --> 00:25:05.863
But you can dial things up and down

00:25:05.943 --> 00:25:07.083
across a line.

00:25:07.183 --> 00:25:07.484
Right.

00:25:07.924 --> 00:25:08.964
When you're thinking about,

00:25:09.044 --> 00:25:10.644
let's just say, you know,

00:25:10.724 --> 00:25:12.205
eighty five thousand dollars of total

00:25:12.225 --> 00:25:12.845
compensation.

00:25:14.723 --> 00:25:16.484
Maybe that equals a higher number of

00:25:16.924 --> 00:25:17.764
salary up front.

00:25:17.944 --> 00:25:19.845
And maybe it means a little bit less

00:25:20.005 --> 00:25:22.205
of CEU funds on the backside of that.

00:25:22.545 --> 00:25:24.626
Maybe in two years when you have paid

00:25:24.646 --> 00:25:27.227
down your debt and you're much more about

00:25:27.287 --> 00:25:30.248
trying to be a specialized clinician,

00:25:30.728 --> 00:25:33.629
maybe those CEU dollars mean a lot more

00:25:33.649 --> 00:25:34.709
to you, right?

00:25:34.749 --> 00:25:37.870
So maybe we add more there rather than

00:25:38.150 --> 00:25:39.470
just upping your salary.

00:25:39.670 --> 00:25:40.411
Does that make sense?

00:25:40.871 --> 00:25:41.411
Yeah.

00:25:41.951 --> 00:25:45.512
so anyway i'm just i think owners need

00:25:45.552 --> 00:25:46.992
to be a little bit more creative when

00:25:47.012 --> 00:25:48.793
they think about total compensation you

00:25:48.813 --> 00:25:50.713
just can't throw everything at people

00:25:50.773 --> 00:25:53.574
because a um you know the research on

00:25:53.634 --> 00:25:55.175
choice like when you give people too many

00:25:55.215 --> 00:26:01.256
choices they're like and so and they're

00:26:01.276 --> 00:26:02.777
going to over dig index on wanting

00:26:02.837 --> 00:26:03.317
everything

00:26:03.801 --> 00:26:04.881
Sure.

00:26:05.202 --> 00:26:06.222
I guess this goes into...

00:26:07.342 --> 00:26:08.243
As a business owner,

00:26:09.203 --> 00:26:11.044
and Marcus Limonis is someone I found

00:26:11.104 --> 00:26:11.824
later in life.

00:26:12.444 --> 00:26:13.665
He's like, if you don't know your numbers,

00:26:13.805 --> 00:26:15.045
I won't work with you.

00:26:15.065 --> 00:26:16.486
Because if you don't know what it costs

00:26:16.566 --> 00:26:17.946
to do all these things,

00:26:18.646 --> 00:26:20.127
you can't have that conversation that

00:26:20.147 --> 00:26:21.828
Heidi's talking about, which is okay.

00:26:22.268 --> 00:26:22.368
So...

00:26:23.168 --> 00:26:24.768
You value flexibility.

00:26:24.828 --> 00:26:26.689
You can't work with me unless I'm flexible

00:26:26.729 --> 00:26:28.209
because of your family situation.

00:26:28.549 --> 00:26:28.830
Okay.

00:26:29.290 --> 00:26:31.610
But you understand that now you working

00:26:31.850 --> 00:26:32.951
less hours for me,

00:26:33.231 --> 00:26:34.631
you're willing to take less salary.

00:26:35.351 --> 00:26:36.712
If the answer is yes,

00:26:37.032 --> 00:26:38.472
you have to know your numbers of what

00:26:38.572 --> 00:26:40.093
each one of those hours is worth.

00:26:40.373 --> 00:26:41.433
So you both win.

00:26:41.913 --> 00:26:44.234
So you're able to cover that person's cost

00:26:44.714 --> 00:26:47.275
and still make margin because the line

00:26:47.295 --> 00:26:49.416
that I stole from someone else is usually

00:26:49.936 --> 00:26:51.197
it's designed for nonprofits,

00:26:51.257 --> 00:26:52.077
but it's for everything.

00:26:52.517 --> 00:26:53.578
No margin, no mission.

00:26:54.641 --> 00:26:56.862
If there's no money coming in above what

00:26:56.902 --> 00:26:57.962
it costs to operate,

00:26:58.222 --> 00:27:00.003
there's no lights or internet.

00:27:00.303 --> 00:27:01.524
I promise I paid my internet.

00:27:01.564 --> 00:27:02.564
It was just a power outage when I

00:27:02.584 --> 00:27:02.944
cut out there.

00:27:03.224 --> 00:27:04.865
But if there is no margin,

00:27:04.885 --> 00:27:05.925
there is no mission.

00:27:06.025 --> 00:27:07.886
So you have to be smart about this

00:27:07.986 --> 00:27:08.446
data,

00:27:08.526 --> 00:27:09.907
which is almost full circle to what we're

00:27:09.947 --> 00:27:12.008
talking about is you could have a hundred

00:27:12.028 --> 00:27:14.729
and fifty KPIs,

00:27:14.769 --> 00:27:16.989
but that doesn't make them very K anymore.

00:27:17.009 --> 00:27:17.470
It's not very,

00:27:17.710 --> 00:27:18.870
you can't have a hundred and fifty keys.

00:27:18.930 --> 00:27:19.650
That's a bad key.

00:27:19.670 --> 00:27:20.531
That's a bad key ring.

00:27:21.091 --> 00:27:21.731
Understanding,

00:27:21.791 --> 00:27:23.632
knowing your numbers has to be step one.

00:27:26.267 --> 00:27:26.668
Yeah.

00:27:26.688 --> 00:27:26.768
Yeah.

00:27:26.788 --> 00:27:28.070
And I'll just say on the flip side

00:27:28.110 --> 00:27:28.932
of that, you know,

00:27:29.373 --> 00:27:32.418
the new grads and the clinicians who just

00:27:32.458 --> 00:27:34.421
want to jump to the next place because

00:27:34.441 --> 00:27:35.884
they're willing to pay you, you know,

00:27:35.904 --> 00:27:38.288
five dollars more an hour costs you.

00:27:39.410 --> 00:27:40.410
It does cost you.

00:27:40.530 --> 00:27:41.691
It costs you as an employer,

00:27:41.711 --> 00:27:43.231
but it also is going to cost you

00:27:43.351 --> 00:27:46.452
as a provider because there are tradeoffs

00:27:46.752 --> 00:27:48.473
for that extra five bucks an hour.

00:27:48.673 --> 00:27:49.973
Maybe you're going to see an extra three

00:27:50.013 --> 00:27:51.954
patients, three patients in a day.

00:27:52.474 --> 00:27:52.674
Right.

00:27:52.874 --> 00:27:55.115
So really understanding what motivates you

00:27:55.155 --> 00:27:57.255
coming to the table with with your truth.

00:27:57.295 --> 00:27:58.576
Like, hey, these are the things.

00:27:59.056 --> 00:28:00.316
Are we a good match?

00:28:01.757 --> 00:28:04.378
But but not in recognition of, hey,

00:28:04.498 --> 00:28:06.238
if I want to see less patients in

00:28:06.298 --> 00:28:06.758
a day,

00:28:07.018 --> 00:28:08.219
I'm going to have to do some sort

00:28:08.259 --> 00:28:08.899
of tradeoff.

00:28:09.799 --> 00:28:12.942
on what my total competition might be.

00:28:12.962 --> 00:28:13.122
Yeah.

00:28:13.162 --> 00:28:15.143
You said that technology used to feel like

00:28:15.163 --> 00:28:18.505
a trade-off, efficiency versus human.

00:28:19.226 --> 00:28:22.208
And I feel like we're not there anymore.

00:28:22.248 --> 00:28:23.569
You've said it's no longer true.

00:28:24.209 --> 00:28:25.730
Feels like these things are now pointed in

00:28:25.750 --> 00:28:26.551
the same direction,

00:28:26.651 --> 00:28:27.712
not against each other.

00:28:28.072 --> 00:28:29.713
What changed to get us here?

00:28:30.306 --> 00:28:31.427
Well, that's the promise.

00:28:31.447 --> 00:28:32.947
And that's what we're starting to see

00:28:33.067 --> 00:28:36.129
early with as as AI is starting to

00:28:36.169 --> 00:28:37.309
mature and, you know,

00:28:37.609 --> 00:28:40.731
more platforms and more technology is

00:28:40.771 --> 00:28:42.771
coming into the health care space.

00:28:43.572 --> 00:28:45.553
And it's looking more like at least it's

00:28:45.713 --> 00:28:46.973
I think the hope is.

00:28:47.353 --> 00:28:48.754
And I think we're in, like I said,

00:28:48.794 --> 00:28:50.275
in the early sort of going,

00:28:50.315 --> 00:28:52.216
it's starting to show this as a relief

00:28:52.256 --> 00:28:52.556
valve.

00:28:53.416 --> 00:28:56.177
uh for some of the documentation some of

00:28:56.197 --> 00:28:58.438
the coding compliance burdens that you

00:28:58.458 --> 00:29:01.159
know were so manual or still had to

00:29:01.179 --> 00:29:03.940
be you know embedded in but still a

00:29:04.000 --> 00:29:06.681
lot of manual process involved in it um

00:29:06.761 --> 00:29:09.622
even scheduling today is getting a little

00:29:09.642 --> 00:29:10.663
bit easier i think that's

00:29:11.897 --> 00:29:13.398
I know everybody wants the auto

00:29:13.438 --> 00:29:14.818
scheduling, but as we know,

00:29:14.958 --> 00:29:17.019
especially if you are taking insurances,

00:29:17.059 --> 00:29:18.459
how complicated that can be,

00:29:18.639 --> 00:29:20.339
especially with multiple therapists in a

00:29:20.379 --> 00:29:22.980
practice with specialty on each one.

00:29:23.040 --> 00:29:23.800
But, you know,

00:29:24.200 --> 00:29:26.501
these are the types of things that we're

00:29:26.541 --> 00:29:30.562
looking to AI to really start to relieve

00:29:31.222 --> 00:29:33.263
ourselves of the percentage of time that

00:29:33.303 --> 00:29:35.764
we're spending on this administrative work

00:29:36.124 --> 00:29:38.324
and allowing us to have more time for

00:29:38.504 --> 00:29:40.265
actual patient care.

00:29:42.465 --> 00:29:43.405
Yeah.

00:29:44.005 --> 00:29:45.226
It's always a trade-off.

00:29:46.346 --> 00:29:48.247
What's the pain that you're alleviating,

00:29:48.667 --> 00:29:48.987
right?

00:29:49.188 --> 00:29:50.988
I mean, Glenn Gary,

00:29:51.008 --> 00:29:53.409
Glenn Ross taught us that someone's being

00:29:53.489 --> 00:29:54.770
sold in any conversation.

00:29:54.930 --> 00:29:56.531
You're either selling them or they're

00:29:56.551 --> 00:29:57.771
selling you one while you're not.

00:29:58.212 --> 00:29:59.172
And I think when you try to

00:29:59.392 --> 00:30:00.453
overcomplicate,

00:30:00.713 --> 00:30:02.854
and it's not to minimize everything to a

00:30:02.954 --> 00:30:03.374
sale,

00:30:04.034 --> 00:30:05.115
but are you helping me

00:30:05.915 --> 00:30:09.116
better faster or cheaper because better

00:30:09.136 --> 00:30:10.856
faster and cheaper can make things easier

00:30:10.896 --> 00:30:12.337
for me i can do more or do

00:30:12.497 --> 00:30:15.878
or do less in certain situations and it

00:30:15.918 --> 00:30:17.738
feels like i got a palm i got

00:30:17.758 --> 00:30:19.379
a palm pilot when i was in college

00:30:20.059 --> 00:30:21.799
and i realized how many little clicks with

00:30:21.819 --> 00:30:23.160
the little fake pen it took me to

00:30:23.500 --> 00:30:25.220
put someone's phone number in a book i

00:30:25.240 --> 00:30:27.041
was like i can write this down with

00:30:27.121 --> 00:30:29.562
a pen faster or the famous story about

00:30:29.622 --> 00:30:30.462
how the americans

00:30:31.342 --> 00:30:32.644
tried to figure out how to make a

00:30:32.704 --> 00:30:34.907
pen work in space and they're like to

00:30:34.927 --> 00:30:36.268
the russians like how'd you figure it out

00:30:36.288 --> 00:30:37.650
and they're like we used a pencil and

00:30:37.670 --> 00:30:39.472
they were like oh yeah like we over

00:30:39.512 --> 00:30:41.755
complicated that it feels like the tech

00:30:42.876 --> 00:30:45.279
isn't a pen in space anymore it's even

00:30:45.419 --> 00:30:47.582
simpler than the pencil now and that's

00:30:47.622 --> 00:30:48.803
when we start working in the scene i

00:30:48.823 --> 00:30:50.265
don't work for the tech the tech works

00:30:50.305 --> 00:30:50.846
for me now

00:30:52.667 --> 00:30:54.229
yeah i mean that's where we're we're

00:30:54.249 --> 00:30:56.631
headed i think it's it's definitely um

00:30:56.931 --> 00:31:00.595
it's happening um and it's learning uh and

00:31:01.035 --> 00:31:02.597
i i think what you're gonna see in

00:31:02.617 --> 00:31:06.521
the next eighteen months or so is is

00:31:06.541 --> 00:31:11.666
a real shift in our ability uh to

00:31:13.167 --> 00:31:15.289
be a little more hands-off of the computer

00:31:15.409 --> 00:31:15.890
itself

00:31:16.686 --> 00:31:18.488
um and a lot of things will be

00:31:18.528 --> 00:31:21.871
happening where you're in edit mode um and

00:31:21.891 --> 00:31:23.953
you're in review and assessment mode

00:31:24.533 --> 00:31:28.777
versus having to do the the subjective the

00:31:28.857 --> 00:31:32.460
the objective uh inputs um those will be

00:31:32.880 --> 00:31:36.123
collected as you're doing them um and then

00:31:36.223 --> 00:31:36.844
your where

00:31:37.524 --> 00:31:39.245
our brains really need to be functioning

00:31:39.325 --> 00:31:41.407
at the highest levels in the assessment

00:31:43.088 --> 00:31:44.729
and even plan for this particular

00:31:44.769 --> 00:31:46.109
individual and patient who's sitting in

00:31:46.149 --> 00:31:46.690
front of you.

00:31:49.271 --> 00:31:51.513
Even the concepts of clinical decision

00:31:51.533 --> 00:31:52.553
support, right?

00:31:52.653 --> 00:31:55.055
In learning how you do things with this

00:31:55.095 --> 00:31:57.776
particular diagnosis and this patient's

00:31:57.816 --> 00:31:58.757
past medical history.

00:31:58.777 --> 00:31:59.077
I mean,

00:31:59.557 --> 00:32:01.959
it's really going to be really freaking

00:32:01.999 --> 00:32:02.179
cool.

00:32:02.199 --> 00:32:04.040
Some of the things that are going to

00:32:04.060 --> 00:32:04.100
be

00:32:04.480 --> 00:32:07.781
out here and already starting to show up

00:32:08.341 --> 00:32:10.602
in EMRs and other platforms today.

00:32:11.162 --> 00:32:13.962
I agree.

00:32:14.142 --> 00:32:17.083
It feels like it's the Wild West.

00:32:17.143 --> 00:32:18.764
It's like the Oklahoma Sooners out there

00:32:19.164 --> 00:32:20.164
staking claims, right?

00:32:20.184 --> 00:32:23.585
The minute really AI became operational,

00:32:23.625 --> 00:32:24.665
there was a hundred and fifty

00:32:25.895 --> 00:32:26.836
Everybody was doing it, right?

00:32:26.896 --> 00:32:27.977
Here's this scribe, this scribe,

00:32:28.017 --> 00:32:29.719
this scribe, just focusing on scribe.

00:32:30.580 --> 00:32:31.821
And I said,

00:32:32.021 --> 00:32:33.543
I remember talking to someone who wasn't

00:32:33.563 --> 00:32:34.544
in healthcare and they said, well,

00:32:34.584 --> 00:32:36.346
how will this change how people do things?

00:32:36.926 --> 00:32:37.227
And I said,

00:32:37.307 --> 00:32:39.249
I think probably pretty minimally,

00:32:39.569 --> 00:32:40.590
because I think we're already thinking

00:32:40.610 --> 00:32:41.331
about these things.

00:32:41.731 --> 00:32:42.631
They're already in our head.

00:32:43.092 --> 00:32:44.472
Then we need to breathe and then type

00:32:44.512 --> 00:32:44.853
them out.

00:32:44.993 --> 00:32:46.013
Now we necessarily don't.

00:32:46.053 --> 00:32:47.494
I said the only way I could see

00:32:47.554 --> 00:32:48.875
it is you need to be more of

00:32:48.895 --> 00:32:49.955
a verbal processor.

00:32:50.575 --> 00:32:51.856
So now instead of having to sit down

00:32:51.876 --> 00:32:52.556
and type it out,

00:32:52.957 --> 00:32:54.497
if you're verbally processing while it's

00:32:54.517 --> 00:32:54.918
going on,

00:32:55.038 --> 00:32:57.399
you don't have to do that initial first

00:32:57.439 --> 00:32:57.759
pass.

00:32:58.019 --> 00:32:58.920
You are doing it.

00:32:59.420 --> 00:33:02.421
You're doing it without your hands.

00:33:02.541 --> 00:33:03.002
Right.

00:33:03.022 --> 00:33:03.342
And Jimmy,

00:33:03.362 --> 00:33:04.723
there's going to be growing pains.

00:33:04.763 --> 00:33:07.344
Don't get me wrong because, you know,

00:33:08.008 --> 00:33:09.269
People will want to,

00:33:09.349 --> 00:33:11.810
and we see this already happening in

00:33:11.970 --> 00:33:13.931
colleges and high schools and such,

00:33:13.971 --> 00:33:16.412
where people want to be completely

00:33:16.432 --> 00:33:19.994
hands-off and allow the AI to write things

00:33:20.034 --> 00:33:21.975
for them and to do things for them.

00:33:22.035 --> 00:33:24.096
And it's going to make mistakes.

00:33:24.396 --> 00:33:25.397
It's not perfect.

00:33:25.537 --> 00:33:27.558
And it is still a computer without

00:33:27.578 --> 00:33:29.899
feelings and without empathy.

00:33:30.439 --> 00:33:35.442
And so really making sure that we continue

00:33:35.522 --> 00:33:35.802
to

00:33:36.865 --> 00:33:39.668
be a part of the plan be a

00:33:39.768 --> 00:33:42.831
part of and really exercise our knowledge

00:33:42.891 --> 00:33:46.514
into that assessment um and you know just

00:33:46.554 --> 00:33:48.716
like anything else bad inputs equal bad

00:33:48.776 --> 00:33:50.778
outputs and so if you're not getting the

00:33:50.818 --> 00:33:55.042
front end correct um those things are are

00:33:55.062 --> 00:33:55.783
are going to spit out

00:33:56.728 --> 00:33:58.069
bad things on the other side.

00:33:58.169 --> 00:34:00.450
So there's going to be some learning that

00:34:00.931 --> 00:34:02.412
as we move through this process,

00:34:02.452 --> 00:34:05.213
but it looks very promising in terms of

00:34:05.674 --> 00:34:07.575
that relief valve as people are looking at

00:34:07.635 --> 00:34:09.396
it from an administrative burden side.

00:34:10.236 --> 00:34:11.037
So let's flip.

00:34:11.517 --> 00:34:13.138
So a minute ago, we talked about, hey,

00:34:13.178 --> 00:34:13.899
if you're a leader,

00:34:14.439 --> 00:34:15.660
you said your advice would be listen.

00:34:16.995 --> 00:34:20.057
If you're a clinician working with

00:34:20.117 --> 00:34:20.658
someone,

00:34:21.138 --> 00:34:23.079
what would your advice for them be who

00:34:23.139 --> 00:34:26.121
maybe you feel that unheard disconnected

00:34:26.161 --> 00:34:26.921
from leadership?

00:34:27.462 --> 00:34:29.183
What would your advice be for them?

00:34:29.243 --> 00:34:31.064
If the advice for the leader is listen,

00:34:31.104 --> 00:34:32.645
what's the advice for the clinician?

00:34:33.465 --> 00:34:34.366
Yeah, for the clinician,

00:34:34.406 --> 00:34:38.708
it's really formulate and understand what

00:34:38.749 --> 00:34:41.130
your motivation factors are and what is

00:34:41.170 --> 00:34:43.091
important to you to articulate.

00:34:43.171 --> 00:34:44.312
It's not to complain.

00:34:45.672 --> 00:34:48.813
Like it's action in a way that means

00:34:48.853 --> 00:34:49.793
that, hey,

00:34:50.533 --> 00:34:51.993
here's the things that motivate me.

00:34:52.113 --> 00:34:53.213
Here's what I want.

00:34:53.233 --> 00:34:55.114
Because I think that when you think about

00:34:55.614 --> 00:34:58.954
the goal of what both the clinic leader

00:34:59.194 --> 00:35:01.195
and a clinician at the end of the

00:35:01.215 --> 00:35:01.435
day,

00:35:01.475 --> 00:35:02.795
we want to treat patients and we want

00:35:02.815 --> 00:35:03.655
to get people better.

00:35:04.255 --> 00:35:08.776
Like those two things, you know,

00:35:08.876 --> 00:35:11.597
while I think the clinic owner has to

00:35:11.677 --> 00:35:13.997
always also think about financial issues.

00:35:14.545 --> 00:35:16.627
um and i want to make money doing

00:35:16.687 --> 00:35:19.049
it right which is what's fine we're

00:35:19.349 --> 00:35:21.051
majority of us work in for-profit

00:35:21.071 --> 00:35:25.234
companies um the thing i would say about

00:35:25.274 --> 00:35:27.496
from the clinician side is is understand

00:35:27.536 --> 00:35:29.277
be able to articulate what motivates you

00:35:29.337 --> 00:35:32.680
but also understand what you don't know

00:35:33.501 --> 00:35:35.342
and when you don't know and you don't

00:35:35.422 --> 00:35:37.624
understand the business side take the time

00:35:37.704 --> 00:35:40.326
to to spend some time with that clinic

00:35:40.406 --> 00:35:42.068
owner to really understand

00:35:43.245 --> 00:35:44.846
what it takes to run a business in

00:35:44.886 --> 00:35:45.686
today's market.

00:35:46.246 --> 00:35:47.487
It is not freaking easy.

00:35:47.527 --> 00:35:52.429
And so while you may understand and all

00:35:52.469 --> 00:35:54.489
of the student debt and all the things

00:35:54.509 --> 00:35:56.610
that are happening on the clinician side

00:35:56.630 --> 00:35:57.551
and new grad side,

00:35:58.171 --> 00:36:00.512
just take a pause to really understand and

00:36:00.572 --> 00:36:01.212
respect

00:36:01.976 --> 00:36:04.260
what has transpired and allowed this

00:36:04.300 --> 00:36:05.662
clinic owner to be in business,

00:36:05.702 --> 00:36:07.986
to have had success over time,

00:36:08.006 --> 00:36:09.688
but understand that the market forces

00:36:09.728 --> 00:36:12.493
today and the constraints that we're under

00:36:12.573 --> 00:36:15.217
are significantly different and causing a

00:36:15.237 --> 00:36:15.958
lot of stress, right?

00:36:17.351 --> 00:36:18.692
I'll give a nod to one of the

00:36:18.712 --> 00:36:20.553
organizations I used to work for because

00:36:20.713 --> 00:36:22.575
we just assume if it's a big company,

00:36:23.115 --> 00:36:24.856
the people at the top are swimming around

00:36:24.936 --> 00:36:27.578
Scrooge McDuck style in pools of money.

00:36:27.618 --> 00:36:27.998
And I'm like,

00:36:28.159 --> 00:36:29.099
I got to be honest with you, man.

00:36:29.439 --> 00:36:30.340
That ain't it.

00:36:31.541 --> 00:36:33.402
I worked for Fox Rehab for a while

00:36:33.482 --> 00:36:35.163
and I was communications,

00:36:35.624 --> 00:36:38.486
but they were overly transparent

00:36:39.106 --> 00:36:41.688
in my viewpoint in how do we decide

00:36:41.728 --> 00:36:42.509
what to pay you?

00:36:42.609 --> 00:36:43.769
The goal is not to pay you as

00:36:43.789 --> 00:36:44.690
little as possible.

00:36:45.050 --> 00:36:46.411
The goal is pay you as much as

00:36:46.471 --> 00:36:48.653
possible so we can still support this.

00:36:49.253 --> 00:36:52.256
And they would show when the dollar comes

00:36:52.376 --> 00:36:52.556
in,

00:36:52.896 --> 00:36:54.197
how many different ways does it need to

00:36:54.217 --> 00:36:56.238
be sliced before we get to you?

00:36:57.179 --> 00:36:58.960
And having, I think,

00:36:59.060 --> 00:37:03.804
more of that transparency and explanation

00:37:04.164 --> 00:37:06.025
kept the right people around.

00:37:06.346 --> 00:37:08.007
If you're not willing to understand that,

00:37:08.733 --> 00:37:08.878
Um,

00:37:09.737 --> 00:37:11.458
I can't make more money fall out unless

00:37:11.538 --> 00:37:12.539
more money is falling in.

00:37:12.579 --> 00:37:13.279
And let me show you.

00:37:13.339 --> 00:37:14.260
I know if you're like,

00:37:14.280 --> 00:37:15.741
but these are millions of dollars.

00:37:15.761 --> 00:37:16.762
I'm like, yes, yes, yes.

00:37:17.462 --> 00:37:19.383
Divided by how many different things or

00:37:19.423 --> 00:37:19.784
people.

00:37:19.804 --> 00:37:21.245
When you say you want a new laptop

00:37:21.285 --> 00:37:21.765
every year,

00:37:22.065 --> 00:37:23.786
it's a new laptop times a thousand

00:37:23.826 --> 00:37:24.407
clinicians.

00:37:24.927 --> 00:37:27.729
Or when you hit a certain level,

00:37:27.809 --> 00:37:30.170
now your administration has to get wider

00:37:30.210 --> 00:37:31.491
and why that costs something.

00:37:31.892 --> 00:37:33.172
And these are simple things,

00:37:33.252 --> 00:37:34.974
but not easy to understand.

00:37:35.514 --> 00:37:37.115
But when you can start to understand them,

00:37:37.695 --> 00:37:38.396
I think the people...

00:37:42.324 --> 00:37:43.987
And this isn't a communication principle.

00:37:44.609 --> 00:37:46.091
When there's no information,

00:37:47.149 --> 00:37:48.710
we fill it in with bad information.

00:37:49.390 --> 00:37:50.790
Well, then there's something nefarious,

00:37:51.230 --> 00:37:51.450
right?

00:37:51.931 --> 00:37:53.651
When you over-communicate,

00:37:54.111 --> 00:37:55.472
those are the people who are better

00:37:55.512 --> 00:37:55.812
leaders.

00:37:55.892 --> 00:37:57.332
They're not actually better or worse.

00:37:57.513 --> 00:37:59.853
They understand that no information breeds

00:37:59.893 --> 00:38:00.514
contempt.

00:38:01.814 --> 00:38:02.974
Somebody gave me a statistic.

00:38:03.074 --> 00:38:04.975
Most mid-size organizations

00:38:05.495 --> 00:38:08.236
under-communicate by a factor of four

00:38:08.336 --> 00:38:09.196
hundred percent.

00:38:09.417 --> 00:38:10.777
So when you think you've said it,

00:38:11.217 --> 00:38:13.618
you're still four hundred percent behind.

00:38:14.458 --> 00:38:16.199
When you think it's been understood,

00:38:16.799 --> 00:38:18.101
we know how it is, you know,

00:38:18.121 --> 00:38:19.542
like you're hearing it is not

00:38:19.603 --> 00:38:20.283
understanding.

00:38:20.644 --> 00:38:21.124
So I think,

00:38:21.965 --> 00:38:23.107
I think from the leader side,

00:38:23.127 --> 00:38:24.048
it's over communicate,

00:38:24.068 --> 00:38:26.271
but from the clinician or the employee

00:38:26.311 --> 00:38:28.413
side, it's ask, show up,

00:38:29.114 --> 00:38:30.296
lean in to understand.

00:38:30.736 --> 00:38:32.678
And then magically those people just wind

00:38:32.739 --> 00:38:33.780
up doing in the magical,

00:38:33.820 --> 00:38:35.942
those people wind up doing better in their

00:38:35.962 --> 00:38:36.243
roles.

00:38:37.172 --> 00:38:37.752
Absolutely.

00:38:37.772 --> 00:38:38.713
And they feel connected.

00:38:39.093 --> 00:38:40.353
They feel like they understand.

00:38:40.393 --> 00:38:41.914
They know where the business is going.

00:38:41.954 --> 00:38:43.595
They understand what the pain points are.

00:38:43.655 --> 00:38:44.916
So you're all in it together.

00:38:45.796 --> 00:38:48.017
It's a we, not just an I. Right.

00:38:48.197 --> 00:38:51.418
And so when you when you actually have

00:38:51.458 --> 00:38:53.339
that type of culture and you do get

00:38:53.379 --> 00:38:54.400
that transparency now,

00:38:54.520 --> 00:38:56.301
I will say you made a good point

00:38:56.341 --> 00:38:56.841
that it's.

00:38:57.221 --> 00:39:00.283
It's not just transparency because in the

00:39:00.343 --> 00:39:03.004
presence of too much information that is

00:39:03.424 --> 00:39:05.986
not understood, that can also,

00:39:06.026 --> 00:39:07.486
when you see these millions of dollars,

00:39:07.526 --> 00:39:09.528
then you can make assumptions about things

00:39:09.548 --> 00:39:10.608
because you don't understand.

00:39:10.648 --> 00:39:11.969
Well, if you look at the bottom line,

00:39:12.369 --> 00:39:14.090
post all of those expenses.

00:39:15.060 --> 00:39:15.480
Well,

00:39:15.960 --> 00:39:17.301
maybe that number is not in the millions

00:39:17.361 --> 00:39:17.761
anymore.

00:39:17.781 --> 00:39:22.443
And then, yeah,

00:39:22.543 --> 00:39:24.584
it's really important to also provide that

00:39:24.664 --> 00:39:27.185
education in the spirit of transparency

00:39:27.225 --> 00:39:28.425
comes education as well.

00:39:29.886 --> 00:39:30.126
Yep.

00:39:30.486 --> 00:39:31.787
Final question that we'll do.

00:39:31.847 --> 00:39:32.767
We'll do parting shot.

00:39:32.827 --> 00:39:33.067
Right.

00:39:33.127 --> 00:39:33.948
So parting shot.

00:39:34.068 --> 00:39:35.208
I'll set you up for this one.

00:39:35.248 --> 00:39:36.749
I won't just leave you open ended.

00:39:37.489 --> 00:39:38.990
You said the profession is really at an

00:39:39.030 --> 00:39:39.830
inflection point.

00:39:41.463 --> 00:39:44.164
You don't do these reports just to look

00:39:44.224 --> 00:39:44.985
back, right?

00:39:45.025 --> 00:39:46.225
That's nice to have.

00:39:46.505 --> 00:39:48.806
You do them so we understand now and

00:39:48.866 --> 00:39:49.847
five years from now.

00:39:49.987 --> 00:39:52.368
So I'll just pick an arbitrary point in

00:39:52.388 --> 00:39:52.688
the future.

00:39:52.748 --> 00:39:53.528
Five years from now,

00:39:54.149 --> 00:39:57.910
what decisions are we making today that

00:39:57.930 --> 00:39:58.771
will actually help us

00:39:59.873 --> 00:40:01.914
whether the profession becomes more human

00:40:01.994 --> 00:40:04.014
centered or more commoditized.

00:40:04.074 --> 00:40:04.294
I mean,

00:40:04.594 --> 00:40:06.255
where you sit has never really been at

00:40:06.275 --> 00:40:06.955
a company level.

00:40:06.995 --> 00:40:08.315
You've always sort of looked at it from

00:40:08.375 --> 00:40:09.956
professional level because where it goes,

00:40:10.216 --> 00:40:11.316
where the profession goes,

00:40:12.256 --> 00:40:13.497
we all goes right.

00:40:13.757 --> 00:40:14.057
So what,

00:40:14.157 --> 00:40:16.457
what is the decision or decisions that we

00:40:16.497 --> 00:40:19.238
can start to make now that can make

00:40:19.258 --> 00:40:20.498
that we, we,

00:40:20.538 --> 00:40:22.259
the future is more human and less a

00:40:22.299 --> 00:40:22.799
commodity.

00:40:25.480 --> 00:40:25.620
Well,

00:40:25.640 --> 00:40:28.582
let's just start first on producing

00:40:28.762 --> 00:40:29.462
providers.

00:40:30.103 --> 00:40:32.864
We know we have a shortage and we

00:40:32.904 --> 00:40:35.726
have the lowest amount of applicants to

00:40:35.786 --> 00:40:37.547
our PT programs that we ever had.

00:40:38.887 --> 00:40:43.910
And we must make sure that we are

00:40:43.950 --> 00:40:47.912
continuing to have the highest level of

00:40:47.992 --> 00:40:52.094
expectation of our educational system for

00:40:52.335 --> 00:40:54.736
the DPT program that we can have.

00:40:55.687 --> 00:40:57.970
That means that people are getting

00:40:58.150 --> 00:41:00.173
educated to be able to come out and

00:41:00.333 --> 00:41:02.215
immediately start treating patients and

00:41:02.295 --> 00:41:05.118
not believe that they still need to go

00:41:05.158 --> 00:41:08.222
to residency program or, you know,

00:41:08.242 --> 00:41:10.945
have additional education opportunities.

00:41:11.926 --> 00:41:13.067
And granted,

00:41:13.167 --> 00:41:14.588
everybody needs to continue to learn.

00:41:14.628 --> 00:41:15.408
I'm not saying that.

00:41:15.448 --> 00:41:16.989
But you should be able to come out

00:41:17.069 --> 00:41:20.050
and feel confident in being able to

00:41:20.110 --> 00:41:23.132
practice in an environment where you can

00:41:23.192 --> 00:41:26.053
have your own caseload out of school.

00:41:26.414 --> 00:41:26.674
Right.

00:41:28.135 --> 00:41:31.036
And have high expectations for those

00:41:31.076 --> 00:41:35.879
clinical affiliations and leaders that can

00:41:35.939 --> 00:41:36.619
see eyes.

00:41:37.459 --> 00:41:39.741
that are treating or that are teaching

00:41:40.061 --> 00:41:41.522
right at the highest level.

00:41:41.602 --> 00:41:44.364
So first and foremost, like, you know,

00:41:44.384 --> 00:41:45.144
cost of education,

00:41:45.164 --> 00:41:46.605
there's a lot of things going on in

00:41:46.645 --> 00:41:47.305
the front end.

00:41:48.546 --> 00:41:50.447
We're reaching lower and lower into the

00:41:50.507 --> 00:41:53.509
applicant pool with people, you know,

00:41:53.789 --> 00:41:55.290
having difficulty graduating,

00:41:55.370 --> 00:41:58.892
having difficulty passing the licensure

00:41:58.932 --> 00:41:59.993
exam that first time.

00:42:00.053 --> 00:42:02.935
So we've got to really focus on the

00:42:02.975 --> 00:42:04.316
front end of the clinicians that we're

00:42:04.356 --> 00:42:04.836
producing.

00:42:05.440 --> 00:42:07.461
in order to offset the shortage and also

00:42:07.521 --> 00:42:09.983
maintain the level of expectation that not

00:42:10.023 --> 00:42:10.944
only patients have,

00:42:11.384 --> 00:42:14.546
but we should have for therapists coming

00:42:15.066 --> 00:42:15.867
into the profession.

00:42:16.327 --> 00:42:17.007
So that's first.

00:42:17.628 --> 00:42:20.089
Second,

00:42:20.330 --> 00:42:24.352
the decisions we're making to move into a

00:42:24.392 --> 00:42:25.393
world of technology

00:42:26.219 --> 00:42:28.461
because we want to offset the

00:42:28.501 --> 00:42:29.602
administrative burden,

00:42:30.062 --> 00:42:33.125
we have to make sure that we don't

00:42:33.285 --> 00:42:37.168
lose that human centered care that we are

00:42:37.649 --> 00:42:39.170
absolutely, you know,

00:42:39.470 --> 00:42:43.113
still the best provider at giving where we

00:42:43.374 --> 00:42:44.995
are able to see the patient for,

00:42:45.135 --> 00:42:46.436
you know, multiple visits.

00:42:46.476 --> 00:42:48.698
We develop those types of relationships.

00:42:49.339 --> 00:42:52.101
If we go down the digital first,

00:42:52.701 --> 00:42:54.463
you know, or, you know,

00:42:56.198 --> 00:42:59.682
PTs as a human are only augmenting the

00:42:59.722 --> 00:43:01.443
care of a digital first,

00:43:02.484 --> 00:43:03.405
I think that's wrong.

00:43:03.966 --> 00:43:06.008
We're going to lose ourselves and become a

00:43:06.048 --> 00:43:09.211
commodity in a very short period of time.

00:43:09.812 --> 00:43:11.374
You've got the

00:43:12.394 --> 00:43:15.076
hinges and the swords and all of these

00:43:15.196 --> 00:43:17.838
that are putting digital first and we're

00:43:17.858 --> 00:43:20.980
just an adjunct to the AI,

00:43:21.661 --> 00:43:23.542
we're going to lose our ability to

00:43:24.002 --> 00:43:27.705
maintain ourselves as a primary physician.

00:43:28.944 --> 00:43:31.566
On the positive side of us,

00:43:32.026 --> 00:43:35.989
I do really believe in us putting a

00:43:36.049 --> 00:43:39.431
lot more emphasis on being primary care

00:43:39.631 --> 00:43:42.293
clinicians in the MSK world,

00:43:42.413 --> 00:43:43.674
and I think we need to be doubling

00:43:43.714 --> 00:43:44.395
down on that.

00:43:45.976 --> 00:43:49.218
Similarly to us having a shortage of DPTs,

00:43:49.902 --> 00:43:51.183
Primary care is also,

00:43:51.223 --> 00:43:52.784
there is a dearth of primary care

00:43:52.824 --> 00:43:53.324
providers,

00:43:53.425 --> 00:43:55.106
and we need to be filling that gap

00:43:56.186 --> 00:43:59.209
and elevating ourselves to be able to meet

00:43:59.529 --> 00:44:01.790
those demands of what is happening.

00:44:02.231 --> 00:44:04.452
More people want our services,

00:44:04.632 --> 00:44:05.993
and yet we just don't have enough

00:44:06.013 --> 00:44:08.035
clinicians right now to be able to do

00:44:08.075 --> 00:44:08.295
that.

00:44:08.355 --> 00:44:09.336
So by elevating,

00:44:09.636 --> 00:44:11.617
trying to elevate ourselves to get those

00:44:11.977 --> 00:44:15.060
patients cared for quicker,

00:44:15.840 --> 00:44:16.901
I think is really important.

00:44:19.284 --> 00:44:21.585
And then just on the final side,

00:44:21.605 --> 00:44:23.385
I mean, I do believe, you know,

00:44:24.926 --> 00:44:28.727
the adoption of the AI models and the

00:44:28.787 --> 00:44:32.127
transformation of EMRs into like WebPT,

00:44:32.287 --> 00:44:33.288
you know,

00:44:33.328 --> 00:44:35.928
bringing in AI to alleviate the

00:44:35.968 --> 00:44:38.229
administrative burden is going to allow us

00:44:38.269 --> 00:44:40.249
to have more time for patients,

00:44:40.669 --> 00:44:42.910
that more human-centered care that is so

00:44:42.950 --> 00:44:44.050
critical to our profession.

00:44:44.814 --> 00:44:46.955
So those are decisions I think we're

00:44:46.995 --> 00:44:49.436
making all in the right direction at the

00:44:49.456 --> 00:44:49.756
moment.

00:44:50.556 --> 00:44:50.636
Yeah,

00:44:50.696 --> 00:44:57.098
and they need to be decisions we're

00:44:57.138 --> 00:44:58.059
consciously making.

00:44:58.179 --> 00:44:59.279
These can't be nice to have.

00:44:59.319 --> 00:45:00.860
These are to be directions we're moving

00:45:00.920 --> 00:45:01.000
in.

00:45:01.840 --> 00:45:03.681
You cannot leave until you at least give

00:45:03.701 --> 00:45:05.762
a nod about Rising Tide.

00:45:06.362 --> 00:45:07.242
More people need to know about it.

00:45:07.262 --> 00:45:08.323
So let's talk about that for a hot

00:45:08.363 --> 00:45:09.303
second before we let you get out of

00:45:09.343 --> 00:45:09.483
here.

00:45:09.903 --> 00:45:11.065
Yeah, thanks, Jimmy.

00:45:11.686 --> 00:45:14.070
It's a foundation I started six years ago

00:45:14.130 --> 00:45:14.330
now.

00:45:14.510 --> 00:45:16.093
It's actually pretty incredible.

00:45:16.173 --> 00:45:18.877
I know we've had ninety three scholars go

00:45:18.917 --> 00:45:19.758
through our program.

00:45:19.798 --> 00:45:21.901
We've deployed one point two million

00:45:21.941 --> 00:45:23.684
dollars in scholarship funding.

00:45:25.346 --> 00:45:28.129
we had such a blast at csm recently

00:45:28.189 --> 00:45:31.333
where um we got to to see a

00:45:31.393 --> 00:45:33.355
lot of our scholars in person not only

00:45:33.395 --> 00:45:35.337
that but they are shining stars in our

00:45:35.377 --> 00:45:37.800
profession up on stage i think if you

00:45:37.840 --> 00:45:41.604
saw the uh the generation um uh

00:45:41.945 --> 00:45:44.207
presentation then you saw two of our

00:45:44.247 --> 00:45:46.289
scholars holly brown and um

00:45:47.170 --> 00:45:49.392
Devin Morris up there on stage doing an

00:45:49.432 --> 00:45:50.993
incredible job presenting.

00:45:51.053 --> 00:45:53.735
So I could not be prouder and feel

00:45:53.775 --> 00:45:54.916
more rewarded, um,

00:45:55.036 --> 00:45:56.997
in this sort of give back era of,

00:45:57.137 --> 00:45:59.499
of my, uh, professional life, uh,

00:45:59.519 --> 00:46:01.800
as a physical therapist.

00:46:01.881 --> 00:46:04.042
Um, and anyone, yeah, sorry.

00:46:04.102 --> 00:46:05.403
And anybody, uh, you know, we're,

00:46:05.803 --> 00:46:08.125
we're growing, um, we have, uh,

00:46:08.145 --> 00:46:10.407
we're offering scholarships per year for

00:46:10.447 --> 00:46:12.928
DPT students and five scholarships a year

00:46:12.988 --> 00:46:13.709
for, um,

00:46:14.470 --> 00:46:17.071
for residency students and so we're

00:46:17.171 --> 00:46:18.991
obviously always looking to partner with

00:46:19.891 --> 00:46:23.272
anyone and everyone who is um you know

00:46:23.452 --> 00:46:25.432
on this wants to join in this mission

00:46:25.812 --> 00:46:27.553
help build our community whether it's

00:46:27.593 --> 00:46:29.713
through donation or or sponsorship where

00:46:29.833 --> 00:46:32.254
we're always looking for for more folks to

00:46:32.274 --> 00:46:35.114
to join in uh uh to support the

00:46:35.134 --> 00:46:37.295
mission so thanks for the opportunity

00:46:37.495 --> 00:46:40.275
who's the right person to apply for rising

00:46:40.335 --> 00:46:42.196
tide like who are you who who who's

00:46:42.216 --> 00:46:42.836
a great fit

00:46:44.063 --> 00:46:44.283
Yeah,

00:46:44.303 --> 00:46:48.106
so any DPT student from an

00:46:48.146 --> 00:46:50.467
underrepresented background who is a first

00:46:50.527 --> 00:46:52.429
year or you're about to start your first

00:46:52.469 --> 00:46:53.730
year in DPT school,

00:46:53.750 --> 00:46:56.852
you've been accepted to a DPT program or

00:46:56.952 --> 00:46:58.293
a rising second year.

00:46:59.314 --> 00:47:01.175
Our application cycle for our CRUS

00:47:01.195 --> 00:47:01.815
scholarship,

00:47:01.855 --> 00:47:04.077
which is worth up to fourteen thousand

00:47:04.117 --> 00:47:05.358
dollars per year,

00:47:05.498 --> 00:47:06.819
up to the two to three years that

00:47:06.839 --> 00:47:07.979
you're in your program,

00:47:08.320 --> 00:47:10.641
will open on April first and close at

00:47:10.661 --> 00:47:11.362
the end of May.

00:47:12.533 --> 00:47:13.153
Okay.

00:47:13.213 --> 00:47:15.454
And then who's the...

00:47:15.694 --> 00:47:17.775
Are you teaming with programs like you

00:47:17.815 --> 00:47:22.137
just mentioned for tuition remission or

00:47:22.237 --> 00:47:24.118
donations or both or...

00:47:25.753 --> 00:47:25.953
Yeah,

00:47:26.033 --> 00:47:29.415
so we actually provide scholarships for

00:47:29.515 --> 00:47:32.976
those that win our scholarships through a

00:47:33.436 --> 00:47:34.597
selection process.

00:47:35.978 --> 00:47:39.139
And it doesn't matter what program you're

00:47:39.159 --> 00:47:41.200
in as long as it's an accredited DPT

00:47:41.240 --> 00:47:41.840
program.

00:47:43.261 --> 00:47:48.583
And so we actually scholarship the student

00:47:48.623 --> 00:47:50.284
to the program.

00:47:52.046 --> 00:47:52.687
And, you know,

00:47:52.768 --> 00:47:55.151
obviously always working with programs to

00:47:55.191 --> 00:47:56.213
share our information,

00:47:56.233 --> 00:47:58.577
share our data and feedback that we get

00:47:58.597 --> 00:48:00.660
from our students to help them understand

00:48:00.700 --> 00:48:02.664
the burden of the cost of education.

00:48:04.578 --> 00:48:04.918
But, yeah,

00:48:04.998 --> 00:48:07.040
we we actually just are we provide

00:48:07.060 --> 00:48:07.481
scholarships.

00:48:07.521 --> 00:48:09.402
And I don't want to say the word

00:48:09.422 --> 00:48:11.404
just because we're so much more than that.

00:48:11.904 --> 00:48:15.107
Even those that everyone who applies into

00:48:15.147 --> 00:48:15.888
our program.

00:48:16.028 --> 00:48:17.049
And even if you don't win,

00:48:17.069 --> 00:48:18.871
the scholarship becomes part of our

00:48:18.931 --> 00:48:19.511
community.

00:48:19.851 --> 00:48:21.813
We just launched a platform called we call

00:48:21.853 --> 00:48:22.754
our tide pool program.

00:48:23.534 --> 00:48:26.475
which is essentially a technology platform

00:48:26.515 --> 00:48:27.855
that allows people to network.

00:48:27.915 --> 00:48:29.195
It has all of our resources.

00:48:29.235 --> 00:48:31.476
We provide monthly webinars on all kinds

00:48:31.516 --> 00:48:32.176
of fun things,

00:48:32.616 --> 00:48:33.776
like what you just talked about.

00:48:33.816 --> 00:48:34.056
Actually,

00:48:34.076 --> 00:48:36.137
our next webinar is with Jean Shirakabad

00:48:36.157 --> 00:48:36.557
and I,

00:48:37.117 --> 00:48:41.197
and we are doing a webinar on the

00:48:41.237 --> 00:48:42.438
life cycle of a dollar.

00:48:42.678 --> 00:48:44.638
So exactly what we just talked about,

00:48:44.718 --> 00:48:46.659
we are helping to educate our students at

00:48:46.679 --> 00:48:48.899
an early time in their career

00:48:49.579 --> 00:48:51.980
uh, to understand how does this work?

00:48:52.020 --> 00:48:53.360
How do you actually get paid?

00:48:53.420 --> 00:48:54.980
Where did those dollars come from along

00:48:55.020 --> 00:48:55.400
the way?

00:48:56.040 --> 00:48:58.041
And what does it really, uh, mean to,

00:48:58.081 --> 00:49:00.601
or how do you actually talk about,

00:49:00.681 --> 00:49:03.042
you know, your salary and, and, uh,

00:49:03.082 --> 00:49:04.202
where that actually comes from?

00:49:04.822 --> 00:49:05.222
Perfect.

00:49:05.482 --> 00:49:05.862
Excellent.

00:49:06.342 --> 00:49:06.382
Uh,

00:49:06.402 --> 00:49:08.283
we'll put the information for rising tide,

00:49:08.583 --> 00:49:08.663
uh,

00:49:08.703 --> 00:49:09.803
as well as the report in the show

00:49:09.823 --> 00:49:10.263
notes for this.

00:49:10.303 --> 00:49:10.503
Heidi,

00:49:10.543 --> 00:49:11.783
thanks so much for coming back on for

00:49:11.823 --> 00:49:12.223
doing this,

00:49:12.243 --> 00:49:13.884
for doing the heavy lift around the

00:49:13.924 --> 00:49:15.544
profession and then for coming on here to

00:49:15.564 --> 00:49:16.164
talk about it with us.

00:49:17.505 --> 00:49:18.826
Always, always a pleasure, Jimmy.

00:49:18.866 --> 00:49:20.588
Thanks so much for everything that you're

00:49:20.628 --> 00:49:22.570
doing to elevate our profession in so many

00:49:22.610 --> 00:49:23.330
different avenues.

00:49:23.370 --> 00:49:24.892
So really appreciate the time.

00:49:25.052 --> 00:49:26.053
Thanks.

00:49:27.510 --> 00:49:28.571
That's it for this one,

00:49:28.851 --> 00:49:30.512
but we're just getting warmed up.

00:49:30.993 --> 00:49:32.894
Smash follow, send it to a friend,

00:49:33.114 --> 00:49:34.776
or crank up the next episode.

00:49:35.296 --> 00:49:36.217
Want to go deeper?

00:49:36.657 --> 00:49:40.700
Hit us at pgpinecast.com or find us on

00:49:40.760 --> 00:49:43.302
YouTube and socials at pgpinecast.

00:49:43.722 --> 00:49:46.004
And legally, none of this was advice.

00:49:46.064 --> 00:49:47.845
It's for entertainment purposes only.

00:49:47.885 --> 00:49:49.447
Bulls**t!

00:49:49.487 --> 00:49:50.067
See, Keith?

00:49:50.287 --> 00:49:51.348
We read the script.

00:49:51.648 --> 00:49:52.289
Happy now?