Your Clinic’s Marketing Is Broken. Here’s Why.

WEBVTT

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You're listening to the PT Pinecast,

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where smart people in healthcare come to

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make noise.

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Here's your host, Jimmy McKay.

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Here's the thing.

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AI isn't replacing clinicians,

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but it is quietly changing the room before

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clinicians ever walk in.

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Andrea is with me again.

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Welcome to Marketing Doesn't Work,

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which is the best marketing for a podcast

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segment, which is...

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We either were confirming what people

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think and they're like, yeah,

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and they can't wait to come here and

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listen to all the ways we agree.

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They agree with us.

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And then they get here and they're like,

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oh,

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it doesn't work when you do it poorly.

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You wrote some words on the LinkedIn post.

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And you said, you know, you asked Claude,

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want me to help you draft what to

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say in your upcoming doctor's appointment

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to get what you need?

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I think health care, myself included,

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needs to pay attention to the fact that,

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yes, ascribes,

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if you're not researching it,

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I'm very sorry.

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You are behind by a lot.

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Not too late to catch up.

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I think our blind spot is we are

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very focused on ourselves in terms of

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healthcare and not thinking.

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Somebody had a statistic,

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like three percent of all chat GPT

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searches were related to, is this cancer?

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What's this thing on my foot?

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Upload an image.

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And that is not going to shrink.

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That is going to get better.

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larger and larger.

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So you had written on LinkedIn about this.

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Here's the thing, to get what you need.

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Not to challenge your provider,

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not to prove you're smarter,

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but you want to arrive clearer,

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more prepared, more confident.

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We've been in those rooms before.

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By the time you leave, you're like,

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I didn't ask the three things I wanted.

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You didn't write them down.

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You thought you were going to have...

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Thirty minutes with your what?

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That's not happening.

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So where's the big blind spot here in

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terms of what are what are we in

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terms of health care not seeing, you know,

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patients or, you know,

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have Googled symptoms forever?

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What's what?

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What's new is AI is helping them frame

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the questions, priorities, goals.

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What comes next?

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How's that change the dynamic in the room

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more than just raw information ever,

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ever did before?

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Yeah, so I think it's not new, right?

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So I was an early user of WebMD.

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It's like, I have these symptoms.

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What is wrong with me?

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It's always, you're always dying for sure.

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And Google.

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And so people, it's not new.

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What is new, I think, like you said,

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is I sort of went to Claude with

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some ongoing thing that like I have going

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on and was trying to get some updated

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information based on like labs and that

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sort of thing.

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And then Claude said,

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do you want me to help you come

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up with these questions?

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And I think what changed is so a

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few things.

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I think like you said,

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healthcare providers are focused on the

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operational like me side.

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How can I use AI to help me

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be more efficient, that sort of thing.

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I don't know if it's a blind spot.

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I think at one point maybe it was

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a blind spot,

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but I think part of it is like

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a lot of providers don't want to accept

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that this is the patient behavior because

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patients go to them because they are the

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expert.

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That is not changing.

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And so I think if providers can come

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at it from a place of,

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not from a place of ego,

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but from a place of how can I

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meet them where they are and answer

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questions they may still have and like

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validate them,

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I feel like it would be a healthier

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dynamic because what happens is patients

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are feeling,

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scared, confused.

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They're going in,

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they're not feeling heard.

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We know like you get seven minutes or

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something with your doctor and you're not

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getting good answers or they're

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gaslighting you or like whatever it is

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coming from the perspective of a female

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that has tried to get answers from

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providers.

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So I think it's just providers need to

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be ready for this.

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And maybe it's a blind spot,

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but maybe it's just,

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we don't want to accept that a patient's

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coming in with information from the

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internet and they are challenging what we

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are saying.

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Here's the thing.

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I had this experience yesterday where I

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was the second person involved,

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just like this situation.

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I play old man beer league hockey.

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One of my defensemen,

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has now figured out, I know some stuff.

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I don't tell people I'm a physical

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therapist because all of a sudden their

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shoulder or their back or their knee hurts

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immediately.

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But he was like, hey man, did this.

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And I just asked him three questions.

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Probably the first three questions most

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physical therapists would ask.

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I said,

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does it hurt when you do this?

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Or how about this?

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How about this?

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And he wrote back, yeah, yeah, yeah.

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AI asked me that already.

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I was validating the AI.

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Do you know what I mean?

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He was like, oh, Jimmy is smart.

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Because he asked the same things that the

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computer asked me.

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That checks out.

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Not the other way around.

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So we are past that.

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He just wanted a human to sort of

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validate that,

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which is kind of funny if you think

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about it.

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Because it's got all the collective...

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worldwide knowledge of of you know patella

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for moral pain in hockey players and we

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ultimately decide he ultimately decided it

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was probably not a great idea to play

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last night and he didn't play i think

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if i hadn't answered the text message

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fifty fifty shot i don't know you don't

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know right

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So something similar but not the same,

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people ask me to do stuff for them,

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as you do too,

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as somebody who's fractional in marketing,

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whatever.

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Whatever it is that Andrea does.

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Andrea's a hired gun.

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She's like, yeah, you need this?

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Great.

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I was like, put in a list.

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Because we discussed,

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this is an organization,

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a large organization.

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We put in a list.

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I was like,

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I could do a hundred things.

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but I can't do a hundred things.

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I could do a hundred.

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Let's say I can do three.

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Well, put in a list of,

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out of all those things I just threw

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at you, go back,

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you meet with your team,

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which always takes a while.

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Come back to me with what you want

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me to do.

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This is for an in-person event.

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The lead up, onsite,

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and then what we do with it after.

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Put in a giant list.

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And again,

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finances have not been discussed.

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And I said, for shits and gigs,

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Hey, man, just so we're clear,

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I can't do this for free.

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I'm going to have to fly somewhere.

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As soon as I get off my couch,

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the meter's sort of running, right?

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Someone was aghast the other day because

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I'm in the New York City area.

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And they were like,

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you put three hundred dollars down for

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parking.

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I'm like,

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you have me coming to your place for

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six days.

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It's forty five dollars a day in parking.

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More than that.

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Sorry, man.

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Yeah.

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Sorry.

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That's parking.

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That's for me to get.

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Anyway.

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So I said, I'm telling you,

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this has something to do with what we're

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talking about.

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I said,

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just copy paste what you just asked me

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to do into whatever you want and then

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just say,

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what do you think this would what do

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you think this would cost?

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The answer was, huh,

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a lot more than I thought that would

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cost.

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And I go,

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I won't even charge you that,

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but I can't charge you zero.

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Right.

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Somewhere between.

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I can't lose money on this.

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So my point is people are using this

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in different ways.

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My point and how I used it,

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I forced it back on them.

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I didn't say I put it in AI

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and it said it costs this.

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I said, you do it.

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You use it.

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So when are we going to see,

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instead of a chat bot trying to schedule

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someone,

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which in my opinion is operationally

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important but should be solved already,

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I can get a haircut.

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I can figure out when my boy Rod

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is ready for a haircut.

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Lickety split, but not a provider,

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which still confuses me in twenty twenty

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six.

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But when are we going to start to

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see some front facing?

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AI either.

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I mean,

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is it even going to be on a

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provider's homepage or is it going to be

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a web?

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When's WebMD going to be?

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I'm web doctor.

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I don't know.

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It's an opportunity I think people are

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probably working on.

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And there's a lot of opportunity there.

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And I think part of it is,

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you know, people are nervous about risk.

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Like I remember way back before this was

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probably fifteen years or something.

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And I was working with a health care

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organization and

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And someone wanted to put chat,

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just like literally just a chat on the

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website.

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And we had to go through.

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So I was kind of like,

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I don't even know if we should be

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doing this.

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Right.

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Like we need so many disclaimers.

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And if this is a medical emergency and

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like don't come to it.

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So that being said,

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I think we've advanced and I think people

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are working on it.

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And there's huge opportunity like for

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providers to be able to do that or

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someone to do that.

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And then providers will try to figure out

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they'll scramble and go like,

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how do we get in on that?

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Yeah,

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we'll be a day late and five million

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dollars short and then be confused how we

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got left behind.

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Right.

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And here's, in my opinion,

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why we rely on

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degrees.

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Well, I've earned this.

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Therefore, I am.

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And that's how it used to work.

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Thirty years ago.

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I mean, gosh,

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I remember my grandmother talking about

00:09:08.671 --> 00:09:09.711
like if a doctor said,

00:09:09.772 --> 00:09:11.514
hop on your right foot three times and

00:09:11.553 --> 00:09:13.556
take the pill, you hopped on your foot,

00:09:13.797 --> 00:09:14.456
your right foot.

00:09:14.557 --> 00:09:15.177
Now you're left.

00:09:15.619 --> 00:09:16.019
You're right.

00:09:16.339 --> 00:09:17.441
Three times you took the pill.

00:09:18.774 --> 00:09:19.755
It was the word of God.

00:09:19.956 --> 00:09:21.097
And now it's like,

00:09:21.118 --> 00:09:22.519
I'm going to question everything,

00:09:23.059 --> 00:09:25.022
which is fine, which is fine.

00:09:25.221 --> 00:09:26.604
But the providers are now saying, well,

00:09:26.624 --> 00:09:27.884
I have to justify everything.

00:09:29.005 --> 00:09:29.307
Yeah.

00:09:29.346 --> 00:09:30.587
Have you seen the world?

00:09:31.328 --> 00:09:31.509
Yes.

00:09:31.528 --> 00:09:33.010
You have to justify everything.

00:09:33.571 --> 00:09:36.073
Providers are already in a tough spot for

00:09:36.094 --> 00:09:36.955
a lot of reasons.

00:09:37.014 --> 00:09:38.756
So this is like one more thing.

00:09:39.817 --> 00:09:40.558
But it's not new,

00:09:40.698 --> 00:09:41.940
but it is like you said, you know,

00:09:41.980 --> 00:09:43.381
they said jump on your foot and you're

00:09:43.461 --> 00:09:44.081
jumping on your foot,

00:09:44.222 --> 00:09:45.003
hopping on your foot.

00:09:45.803 --> 00:09:46.144
Recently,

00:09:46.183 --> 00:09:47.625
I wrote on LinkedIn and maybe you saw,

00:09:48.226 --> 00:09:51.009
I think it was another AI post when

00:09:51.230 --> 00:09:53.932
maybe chat GPT health was coming up.

00:09:54.773 --> 00:09:55.614
Many years ago,

00:09:55.673 --> 00:09:58.277
I was auditing patient experience as part

00:09:58.297 --> 00:09:58.616
of like,

00:09:59.017 --> 00:10:01.418
larger marketing work for a multi-site

00:10:01.577 --> 00:10:03.558
organization and I walked in and this is

00:10:03.619 --> 00:10:05.580
true story one of the providers had like

00:10:05.620 --> 00:10:10.143
a framed sign that said your Google search

00:10:10.342 --> 00:10:12.264
my my medical degree is worth more than

00:10:12.283 --> 00:10:15.004
your Google search and I was like hey

00:10:15.164 --> 00:10:17.346
don't disagree sir but you need to take

00:10:17.385 --> 00:10:22.448
that down not what patients want to see

00:10:22.769 --> 00:10:27.331
um then there's also the statistic of

00:10:29.866 --> 00:10:33.168
litigation and i'll find the statistic

00:10:33.369 --> 00:10:35.649
again verify i'll use ai it'll find me

00:10:35.669 --> 00:10:38.291
for me fast which is you could have

00:10:39.211 --> 00:10:44.212
two people provide the same error but the

00:10:44.254 --> 00:10:46.514
physician or the provider who had better

00:10:46.534 --> 00:10:48.575
rapport with the patient was less likely

00:10:48.595 --> 00:10:50.635
to be sued so it's like what are

00:10:50.796 --> 00:10:52.636
what are you actually this is where like

00:10:52.736 --> 00:10:55.759
andrea and jimmy get people hate us in

00:10:55.818 --> 00:10:58.039
rooms because we keep asking why

00:10:58.802 --> 00:11:00.384
We need a chat bot on the website.

00:11:00.644 --> 00:11:00.984
Awesome.

00:11:01.563 --> 00:11:01.923
Why?

00:11:02.945 --> 00:11:03.945
We want to do this.

00:11:04.585 --> 00:11:04.784
Well,

00:11:04.965 --> 00:11:07.346
the car salesman down the street has one.

00:11:07.866 --> 00:11:08.206
Okay.

00:11:08.807 --> 00:11:11.148
We're not doing that, but also why?

00:11:12.107 --> 00:11:15.269
So why are people coming to see you

00:11:15.610 --> 00:11:16.250
is changing.

00:11:17.682 --> 00:11:18.823
I think this is a good thing.

00:11:18.844 --> 00:11:20.904
We've argued on our PT Breakfast Club.

00:11:21.485 --> 00:11:22.145
This is a good thing.

00:11:22.986 --> 00:11:25.207
Get the people who don't need to be

00:11:25.248 --> 00:11:27.950
there the answer and then don't bring them

00:11:28.029 --> 00:11:28.169
in.

00:11:28.370 --> 00:11:30.171
I don't want someone in front of me,

00:11:30.591 --> 00:11:31.451
if I own a clinic,

00:11:32.231 --> 00:11:33.753
if they don't need to be there.

00:11:34.714 --> 00:11:36.134
Unless they need a little reassurance.

00:11:36.195 --> 00:11:37.255
Hey, listen, man, you're good.

00:11:37.395 --> 00:11:37.816
Look at me.

00:11:38.436 --> 00:11:38.956
You're good.

00:11:39.537 --> 00:11:41.398
And that does something to a human because

00:11:41.418 --> 00:11:43.119
we have brains, right?

00:11:44.259 --> 00:11:44.659
I don't know.

00:11:44.760 --> 00:11:45.841
I see this as...

00:11:47.955 --> 00:11:48.716
As all things,

00:11:49.155 --> 00:11:51.017
it will be an advantage to the people

00:11:51.057 --> 00:11:52.639
who use it right.

00:11:53.339 --> 00:11:55.120
And it will run people over.

00:11:56.000 --> 00:11:56.922
I had a post the other day,

00:11:56.981 --> 00:11:57.763
nothing to do with this.

00:11:57.802 --> 00:11:58.964
And my post was a public service

00:11:58.984 --> 00:11:59.423
announcement.

00:11:59.543 --> 00:12:03.246
It was, do not, under any circumstance,

00:12:03.667 --> 00:12:07.389
try to fix your snowblower with your hand.

00:12:07.890 --> 00:12:08.370
Why?

00:12:08.671 --> 00:12:09.312
It's real quick.

00:12:10.292 --> 00:12:11.734
Guy across the street when I was growing

00:12:11.793 --> 00:12:13.434
up, my dad walked outside,

00:12:13.554 --> 00:12:14.475
bunch of red snow.

00:12:14.576 --> 00:12:15.677
And my dad was like, oh,

00:12:15.697 --> 00:12:16.216
that's not good.

00:12:16.417 --> 00:12:17.278
Yeah, he cut his hand off.

00:12:18.359 --> 00:12:20.921
But this, this, that's what AI is.

00:12:21.041 --> 00:12:21.721
It's a thousand,

00:12:21.741 --> 00:12:23.823
it's a hundred million snowblowers.

00:12:24.043 --> 00:12:25.225
And if you're not using it,

00:12:25.325 --> 00:12:26.726
you're shoveling and that's okay.

00:12:27.407 --> 00:12:29.109
But you're getting the snow move slowly

00:12:29.269 --> 00:12:30.389
and it might blow your back out.

00:12:31.291 --> 00:12:33.413
You could also use it improperly and cut

00:12:33.432 --> 00:12:34.734
your hand off.

00:12:34.813 --> 00:12:35.934
And I think they're not looking at it

00:12:36.294 --> 00:12:36.916
from both sides.

00:12:37.394 --> 00:12:37.595
Right.

00:12:37.735 --> 00:12:38.576
I think we need to look at it

00:12:38.596 --> 00:12:39.115
from both sides.

00:12:39.155 --> 00:12:41.057
And I think it's exactly like you said,

00:12:41.076 --> 00:12:43.557
the people who want to the people who

00:12:43.638 --> 00:12:45.259
need to be there will get the information

00:12:45.298 --> 00:12:46.279
they need and they'll be there.

00:12:46.700 --> 00:12:47.841
Some people just need validation.

00:12:47.860 --> 00:12:48.341
That's fine.

00:12:48.380 --> 00:12:48.740
But it's like,

00:12:48.760 --> 00:12:54.484
how do we put guardrails around usage of

00:12:54.543 --> 00:12:54.683
it?

00:12:54.783 --> 00:12:57.905
And that's on people who are creating the

00:12:57.946 --> 00:13:00.506
technology and that's on people who are

00:13:00.586 --> 00:13:01.967
creating the content that feeds the

00:13:01.988 --> 00:13:02.808
technology.

00:13:03.068 --> 00:13:03.469
Yeah.

00:13:04.056 --> 00:13:04.777
Ben,

00:13:04.876 --> 00:13:06.017
if I could have ten people in my

00:13:06.057 --> 00:13:07.739
waiting room who truly want and need me

00:13:07.778 --> 00:13:08.859
versus a hundred who don't,

00:13:08.919 --> 00:13:10.701
he would take the ten any day and

00:13:10.821 --> 00:13:12.601
operationalize around the ten any day.

00:13:13.283 --> 00:13:13.543
Yes.

00:13:16.384 --> 00:13:18.206
And those ninety that you said,

00:13:18.245 --> 00:13:19.067
you're good, bro,

00:13:19.706 --> 00:13:22.990
feel something and we'll go tell five

00:13:23.009 --> 00:13:23.590
people each.

00:13:23.669 --> 00:13:24.250
That's the guy.

00:13:24.291 --> 00:13:25.951
He's going to do you right.

00:13:27.818 --> 00:13:29.159
Here's the big problem, though,

00:13:29.179 --> 00:13:31.461
that people are probably screaming at the

00:13:31.501 --> 00:13:32.282
speaker, and I agree.

00:13:32.682 --> 00:13:34.083
Our system is not set up to be

00:13:34.323 --> 00:13:34.764
that guy.

00:13:35.105 --> 00:13:36.485
Your system is set up to get a

00:13:36.525 --> 00:13:38.868
hundred people in because we can find

00:13:38.947 --> 00:13:39.368
something.

00:13:39.868 --> 00:13:42.490
And I don't want to do – I

00:13:42.529 --> 00:13:43.530
wouldn't want to be in that.

00:13:43.971 --> 00:13:44.812
I don't want to be that guy.

00:13:45.152 --> 00:13:45.972
I don't want to be that guy.

00:13:46.774 --> 00:13:47.433
I don't want to be that guy.

00:13:47.453 --> 00:13:48.075
Right.

00:13:49.176 --> 00:13:50.976
The system is set up against you to

00:13:51.197 --> 00:13:51.456
like, well,

00:13:51.496 --> 00:13:52.597
I got to get something or else we

00:13:52.618 --> 00:13:54.619
don't pay lights or salaries or health

00:13:54.639 --> 00:13:54.999
benefits.

00:13:55.058 --> 00:13:56.100
I wonder,

00:13:56.519 --> 00:13:58.760
I would love someone to do some research

00:13:59.062 --> 00:14:00.783
on compliance.

00:14:00.802 --> 00:14:03.083
So compliance in patients.

00:14:05.264 --> 00:14:06.345
Someone who can do this.

00:14:06.404 --> 00:14:08.385
So people who come in,

00:14:08.446 --> 00:14:11.047
who use AI responsibly and they come in

00:14:11.086 --> 00:14:12.207
informed and they're like,

00:14:12.227 --> 00:14:13.207
here's what I found out.

00:14:13.268 --> 00:14:14.548
Here's what I sort of need from you.

00:14:15.089 --> 00:14:17.068
They come back and they continue the

00:14:17.109 --> 00:14:18.730
course of care through their twelve visits

00:14:18.769 --> 00:14:19.610
or whatever it is.

00:14:21.171 --> 00:14:24.392
We like those people versus, you know,

00:14:24.412 --> 00:14:26.173
we have like ten who want to be

00:14:26.192 --> 00:14:26.452
there,

00:14:26.613 --> 00:14:28.173
ninety who don't like the ninety who

00:14:28.214 --> 00:14:28.533
don't.

00:14:29.053 --> 00:14:30.114
Where do they drop off?

00:14:30.274 --> 00:14:32.315
And like then we have to get anyway.

00:14:32.394 --> 00:14:34.155
So like is someone paying attention to

00:14:34.176 --> 00:14:34.336
this?

00:14:34.971 --> 00:14:35.451
I think so.

00:14:35.511 --> 00:14:35.753
Yeah.

00:14:35.793 --> 00:14:37.333
This is the billion dollar question.

00:14:37.693 --> 00:14:39.575
And we love this is where this would

00:14:39.595 --> 00:14:42.857
be a great Oxford debate category or

00:14:43.118 --> 00:14:43.577
prompt,

00:14:43.638 --> 00:14:47.541
which is like patient not compliant,

00:14:47.881 --> 00:14:48.682
noncompliance.

00:14:49.182 --> 00:14:49.623
Like, dude.

00:14:51.297 --> 00:14:52.278
If you told me I had to bring

00:14:52.317 --> 00:14:53.879
my car in three times,

00:14:54.379 --> 00:14:56.282
and in between time two and three,

00:14:56.601 --> 00:14:58.062
I was having beers on my back deck,

00:14:58.102 --> 00:14:59.745
and my buddy who's sort of mechanical is

00:14:59.764 --> 00:15:00.164
like,

00:15:00.225 --> 00:15:01.647
what are you bringing it back the third

00:15:01.687 --> 00:15:02.126
time for?

00:15:02.147 --> 00:15:03.769
I'm like, well, they said it needs three.

00:15:03.788 --> 00:15:04.789
It needs three.

00:15:05.691 --> 00:15:06.230
He's like, what?

00:15:08.052 --> 00:15:10.115
But what didn't the first two do?

00:15:10.634 --> 00:15:11.755
And you're like, three?

00:15:12.697 --> 00:15:12.996
It needs...

00:15:13.856 --> 00:15:16.201
We've done two, but it needs three.

00:15:16.400 --> 00:15:17.722
And he's like, why?

00:15:18.303 --> 00:15:19.225
And you're like, I don't know.

00:15:19.245 --> 00:15:20.066
And he's like, I don't know, man,

00:15:20.126 --> 00:15:21.568
I'd save ninety bucks and not go.

00:15:21.989 --> 00:15:22.870
And I'm like, oh, yeah,

00:15:23.971 --> 00:15:25.654
is this because keep in mind,

00:15:25.855 --> 00:15:27.758
Jimmy has a lens of communication, right?

00:15:28.058 --> 00:15:29.139
Is it an expectation?

00:15:30.328 --> 00:15:31.289
But if you were like, no,

00:15:31.330 --> 00:15:32.551
we can't do one.

00:15:33.270 --> 00:15:34.432
I'm making words.

00:15:34.932 --> 00:15:36.173
We're fixing your axle.

00:15:36.192 --> 00:15:37.995
We can't do it all at once because

00:15:38.054 --> 00:15:39.014
of flanges.

00:15:39.034 --> 00:15:40.495
And I'm like, oh, flanges.

00:15:40.515 --> 00:15:41.017
That makes sense.

00:15:41.417 --> 00:15:42.498
I'd be more apt to be like, oh,

00:15:42.518 --> 00:15:43.597
hey, buddy, it's flanges.

00:15:43.618 --> 00:15:45.879
They don't have the flanges yet.

00:15:45.960 --> 00:15:46.860
It's a flange issue.

00:15:47.461 --> 00:15:49.241
even know what flanges are but like i'd

00:15:49.261 --> 00:15:51.023
be like got it that and my buddy

00:15:51.102 --> 00:15:52.124
if that was a real thing if i

00:15:52.163 --> 00:15:53.705
wasn't getting hosed would be like oh no

00:15:53.725 --> 00:15:56.167
that's a thing sorry i had a friend

00:15:56.187 --> 00:15:58.187
the other day sold something on facebook

00:15:58.227 --> 00:16:00.288
marketplace and then she comes to me

00:16:00.908 --> 00:16:03.191
because i'm the guy i know enough here's

00:16:03.211 --> 00:16:04.792
the problem i know enough about technology

00:16:04.812 --> 00:16:06.232
to be the guy people go to i

00:16:06.253 --> 00:16:08.254
can use technology but when something goes

00:16:08.274 --> 00:16:10.514
wrong i call someone anyway she sold

00:16:10.534 --> 00:16:12.476
something on facebook marketplace overseas

00:16:13.393 --> 00:16:14.413
She shipped the thing.

00:16:14.793 --> 00:16:15.355
And then she's like,

00:16:15.554 --> 00:16:16.655
it's supposed to pay me three thousand

00:16:16.676 --> 00:16:16.995
dollars.

00:16:17.015 --> 00:16:18.017
She said she has to pay me five

00:16:18.037 --> 00:16:18.977
hundred dollars at a time.

00:16:19.337 --> 00:16:21.840
And I go, are you using Zelle?

00:16:21.940 --> 00:16:22.679
And she goes, yeah.

00:16:22.700 --> 00:16:22.980
And I go,

00:16:23.000 --> 00:16:24.422
did you just connect with this person on

00:16:24.481 --> 00:16:24.741
Zelle?

00:16:24.782 --> 00:16:25.263
And she's like, yeah.

00:16:25.283 --> 00:16:26.143
I go, no, that's a thing.

00:16:26.764 --> 00:16:27.804
That's all you're looking for.

00:16:27.924 --> 00:16:28.784
Oh, no, that's a thing.

00:16:28.924 --> 00:16:29.765
Because again,

00:16:30.206 --> 00:16:31.488
why do you go back three times?

00:16:31.528 --> 00:16:32.467
Because this, oh, no,

00:16:32.488 --> 00:16:33.369
that's actually a thing.

00:16:33.889 --> 00:16:34.950
It's missed expectation.

00:16:34.970 --> 00:16:37.172
It's just misaligned explanation.

00:16:37.753 --> 00:16:38.153
I don't know.

00:16:38.212 --> 00:16:39.974
Remembering back all the prerequisites I

00:16:39.994 --> 00:16:41.375
took to get into PT school.

00:16:42.235 --> 00:16:44.015
none of them are communications classes,

00:16:44.177 --> 00:16:44.657
like none.

00:16:44.937 --> 00:16:46.057
I did a poll on LinkedIn the other

00:16:46.076 --> 00:16:46.216
day,

00:16:46.476 --> 00:16:51.197
how many people actively teach and assess

00:16:51.577 --> 00:16:53.558
and provide feedback to communication?

00:16:53.578 --> 00:16:54.119
A lot of people were like,

00:16:54.219 --> 00:16:56.139
all the time, all the time.

00:16:56.200 --> 00:16:59.740
And I'm like, I don't remember that.

00:16:59.880 --> 00:17:00.701
It was ten years ago,

00:17:00.780 --> 00:17:01.321
I could be wrong.

00:17:03.393 --> 00:17:04.212
But not really.

00:17:04.792 --> 00:17:05.534
I don't remember it.

00:17:05.594 --> 00:17:06.834
Like I would need show me then.

00:17:07.394 --> 00:17:08.355
I'd love to take the course.

00:17:08.375 --> 00:17:11.096
Can I audit your communication course in

00:17:11.135 --> 00:17:11.776
PT school?

00:17:12.675 --> 00:17:13.876
Because I don't remember it.

00:17:13.896 --> 00:17:18.117
It's not right there.

00:17:19.499 --> 00:17:21.419
I always enjoy Jimmy Rantz.

00:17:21.798 --> 00:17:23.140
Tony's the kind of guy who's like,

00:17:23.279 --> 00:17:24.279
I don't want you in my clinic if

00:17:24.299 --> 00:17:25.140
you're not the right fit.

00:17:25.180 --> 00:17:27.980
Like, no, no, like not right.

00:17:28.000 --> 00:17:29.442
It's a waste of everyone's time.

00:17:31.040 --> 00:17:31.121
Yeah,

00:17:31.141 --> 00:17:32.642
and it takes a spot for someone who

00:17:32.701 --> 00:17:33.702
it's better for.

00:17:33.962 --> 00:17:34.544
But I get it.

00:17:34.564 --> 00:17:35.765
If you're just starting a clinic,

00:17:36.085 --> 00:17:36.664
who will you take?

00:17:37.246 --> 00:17:38.426
Do you have a pulse?

00:17:38.846 --> 00:17:39.228
Yes.

00:17:39.587 --> 00:17:40.127
Come on in.

00:17:40.147 --> 00:17:41.048
We can find something.

00:17:41.068 --> 00:17:41.368
I mean,

00:17:41.388 --> 00:17:42.730
this goes back to what we talked about

00:17:42.750 --> 00:17:44.412
with like your ICP and your persona,

00:17:44.471 --> 00:17:44.771
right?

00:17:44.811 --> 00:17:47.513
Like you want this person,

00:17:47.634 --> 00:17:48.454
not all of the people.

00:17:49.154 --> 00:17:50.836
Correct.

00:17:50.856 --> 00:17:53.057
You've talked about working in healthcare

00:17:53.137 --> 00:17:54.440
with CEOs, right?

00:17:57.179 --> 00:17:58.720
CEOs are not all the same.

00:17:58.941 --> 00:18:01.122
They just have just a job title,

00:18:01.201 --> 00:18:03.823
not a persona per se.

00:18:03.863 --> 00:18:06.005
But you've talked about a frustration that

00:18:06.184 --> 00:18:06.684
I've felt.

00:18:06.825 --> 00:18:10.106
It's when you get to a certain level

00:18:10.146 --> 00:18:11.008
of organization.

00:18:11.208 --> 00:18:11.468
Again,

00:18:11.788 --> 00:18:13.028
I didn't really understand this until I

00:18:13.088 --> 00:18:13.769
saw it firsthand.

00:18:14.049 --> 00:18:15.250
But the people who are doing a million

00:18:15.289 --> 00:18:17.152
dollars a year versus ten million dollars

00:18:17.172 --> 00:18:19.093
a year versus one hundred dollars a year,

00:18:19.113 --> 00:18:20.673
they are they have different problems.

00:18:21.411 --> 00:18:22.951
They are facing different things.

00:18:23.031 --> 00:18:24.231
They're just operationally different.

00:18:24.711 --> 00:18:25.613
You've talked about,

00:18:25.752 --> 00:18:27.113
and I think my comment was,

00:18:29.153 --> 00:18:33.195
the CEO that will hire an Andrea and

00:18:33.236 --> 00:18:36.196
then make Andrea get everything that she's

00:18:36.237 --> 00:18:37.317
doing approved,

00:18:37.356 --> 00:18:38.998
which slows everything down,

00:18:40.097 --> 00:18:43.180
or the CEO's fingerprints are now over

00:18:43.319 --> 00:18:43.880
everything.

00:18:43.940 --> 00:18:45.000
And then six months later,

00:18:45.039 --> 00:18:46.040
marketing doesn't work.

00:18:46.580 --> 00:18:48.761
And I think my comment was something like,

00:18:49.723 --> 00:18:50.084
Well,

00:18:50.284 --> 00:18:51.605
if you're going to have to approve

00:18:51.644 --> 00:18:53.144
everything that comes out of the kitchen,

00:18:54.286 --> 00:18:56.205
don't be surprised when the soup tastes

00:18:56.246 --> 00:18:58.287
like fingers if you keep touching it.

00:18:59.586 --> 00:19:01.807
That's got to be a huge hindrance and

00:19:02.048 --> 00:19:03.169
it's tainting everything.

00:19:03.288 --> 00:19:04.669
Imagine your clinic director had to

00:19:04.689 --> 00:19:05.628
approve everything you did.

00:19:05.828 --> 00:19:06.869
Everything you did.

00:19:08.450 --> 00:19:09.691
That would slow everything down and

00:19:09.730 --> 00:19:10.010
change.

00:19:10.651 --> 00:19:11.810
I call it a Frankenstein.

00:19:12.811 --> 00:19:14.271
When you have to appease the boardroom,

00:19:14.751 --> 00:19:16.232
by the time the idea walks out,

00:19:16.292 --> 00:19:17.053
it looks like a man,

00:19:17.093 --> 00:19:17.853
walks like a man,

00:19:17.932 --> 00:19:18.614
but it ain't a man.

00:19:18.653 --> 00:19:19.433
It's a Frankenstein.

00:19:19.784 --> 00:19:20.925
It's exactly, you know,

00:19:20.945 --> 00:19:22.689
you see like a homepage and you can

00:19:22.729 --> 00:19:24.452
tell it was a Frankenstein homepage

00:19:24.492 --> 00:19:25.595
because the CEO wants to,

00:19:25.815 --> 00:19:28.199
like everyone has their input until it's

00:19:28.239 --> 00:19:30.222
watered down and it doesn't say anything

00:19:30.624 --> 00:19:31.665
or it looks like a lot of things.

00:19:33.277 --> 00:19:35.440
And we've talked about this before.

00:19:36.059 --> 00:19:38.442
Usually one of the biggest voices in the

00:19:38.502 --> 00:19:40.905
room when talking about social media is

00:19:41.086 --> 00:19:43.409
usually the CEO's sixteen-year-old niece.

00:19:44.329 --> 00:19:46.252
My sixteen-year-old niece is big on

00:19:46.333 --> 00:19:46.952
Instagram.

00:19:47.914 --> 00:19:49.215
And I'm like, tell me more.

00:19:50.396 --> 00:19:51.017
In healthcare?

00:19:51.057 --> 00:19:53.218
Like in this or in something else?

00:19:53.698 --> 00:19:55.558
No, she says our Instagram sucks.

00:19:55.759 --> 00:19:56.979
And I'm like, well,

00:19:57.479 --> 00:19:58.880
it probably does because we use that

00:19:58.920 --> 00:20:01.441
consulting firm that charged a lot of

00:20:01.520 --> 00:20:03.500
money and did the same thing,

00:20:03.601 --> 00:20:06.961
nine other practices that are just like us

00:20:07.001 --> 00:20:07.462
is doing.

00:20:07.982 --> 00:20:09.762
But yeah, let's go this way.

00:20:09.962 --> 00:20:12.084
Is she going to get a job?

00:20:12.163 --> 00:20:13.163
Is this an internship?

00:20:13.304 --> 00:20:14.785
Is she in front of behind the camera?

00:20:14.805 --> 00:20:15.184
Yeah.

00:20:15.444 --> 00:20:17.105
how do you deal with that like how

00:20:17.125 --> 00:20:19.048
do you deal with that not well Jimmy

00:20:19.468 --> 00:20:21.109
um how do you deal with it so

00:20:22.309 --> 00:20:24.211
so every and there's been many times so

00:20:24.271 --> 00:20:26.453
every time this has happened my question

00:20:26.594 --> 00:20:31.297
is is that person our Target audience

00:20:31.337 --> 00:20:33.199
maybe they are I don't know like but

00:20:33.259 --> 00:20:34.720
what's their background and what's their

00:20:34.779 --> 00:20:37.142
reasoning for this and let's walk through

00:20:37.182 --> 00:20:38.942
like why we've done what we've done what

00:20:38.962 --> 00:20:39.503
we've done

00:20:41.017 --> 00:20:41.356
And sure,

00:20:41.376 --> 00:20:43.117
if you have a very valid reason and

00:20:43.137 --> 00:20:44.657
we decide, hey, this makes sense to do,

00:20:44.678 --> 00:20:45.458
let's try to do it.

00:20:45.518 --> 00:20:48.759
But your sixteen year old who who consumes

00:20:48.878 --> 00:20:50.999
social media but has never developed a

00:20:51.038 --> 00:20:52.598
social media strategy probably isn't the

00:20:52.659 --> 00:20:53.700
person to do it for us.

00:20:54.240 --> 00:20:54.500
Yeah.

00:20:54.859 --> 00:20:56.920
But how do you have that?

00:20:57.019 --> 00:20:59.421
I think I also asked a question because

00:20:59.441 --> 00:21:01.800
your posts on LinkedIn wind up blowing up

00:21:01.941 --> 00:21:03.101
and I'm like in the comments,

00:21:03.320 --> 00:21:04.902
even my comments got a lot of traffic.

00:21:07.405 --> 00:21:10.490
What percentage of your time is spent

00:21:10.609 --> 00:21:14.634
doing marketing versus defending what

00:21:14.654 --> 00:21:15.335
you're doing?

00:21:15.415 --> 00:21:15.715
It's like,

00:21:16.036 --> 00:21:17.999
if you stop asking me and just let

00:21:18.019 --> 00:21:18.839
me do the thing,

00:21:19.480 --> 00:21:21.282
I'd get a lot more done than defending

00:21:21.462 --> 00:21:23.965
all the decisions you hired me to make.

00:21:24.625 --> 00:21:24.904
Yes.

00:21:24.944 --> 00:21:26.506
So this was and I think my response

00:21:26.566 --> 00:21:28.166
was a mean girl image that said the

00:21:28.227 --> 00:21:29.166
limit does not exist.

00:21:29.207 --> 00:21:31.989
So you spend a lot of time defending

00:21:32.189 --> 00:21:33.589
what you are doing in marketing.

00:21:34.009 --> 00:21:36.550
And I've realized that's whether you're

00:21:36.590 --> 00:21:37.571
really good at what you do,

00:21:37.652 --> 00:21:38.231
not really good.

00:21:38.251 --> 00:21:39.913
Like you just spend a lot of time

00:21:40.012 --> 00:21:41.532
and this does not happen in other

00:21:41.594 --> 00:21:42.173
functions.

00:21:42.773 --> 00:21:46.316
Marketing is this really weird because

00:21:46.355 --> 00:21:48.277
people consume marketing.

00:21:48.636 --> 00:21:50.337
They are marketing experts.

00:21:51.098 --> 00:21:51.659
Say that again.

00:21:51.798 --> 00:21:52.318
Say that again.

00:21:52.699 --> 00:21:54.519
Because people consume marketing,

00:21:54.640 --> 00:21:57.019
they think they are marketing experts.

00:21:57.601 --> 00:21:59.980
No one brings in the accounting guy

00:22:00.221 --> 00:22:02.201
because we're not consuming a lot of

00:22:02.241 --> 00:22:02.761
accounting going,

00:22:02.821 --> 00:22:04.662
why are you using double ledger?

00:22:05.182 --> 00:22:06.182
I'm making up terms now.

00:22:06.462 --> 00:22:09.442
Why are you using double ledger PEMDAS

00:22:09.804 --> 00:22:11.483
method versus this method?

00:22:11.523 --> 00:22:12.263
And like, well,

00:22:13.805 --> 00:22:15.345
I think we need to be all more

00:22:15.384 --> 00:22:17.424
be like, what's the guy, Jerome Powell?

00:22:18.306 --> 00:22:19.246
Do you ever see him in a press

00:22:19.286 --> 00:22:19.685
conference?

00:22:21.859 --> 00:22:23.040
They ask him a question like, yeah,

00:22:23.060 --> 00:22:23.980
are you worried about this?

00:22:24.000 --> 00:22:24.422
And he's, no.

00:22:24.442 --> 00:22:24.561
No.

00:22:24.582 --> 00:22:29.505
Yes, exactly.

00:22:29.605 --> 00:22:30.545
Why are you doing this?

00:22:30.805 --> 00:22:31.945
It's the best idea.

00:22:32.125 --> 00:22:34.647
It was the best possible route to take

00:22:35.167 --> 00:22:37.068
in the situation we were in with the

00:22:37.108 --> 00:22:39.451
resources you gave me with the goal I

00:22:39.471 --> 00:22:40.851
was assigned to hit.

00:22:40.951 --> 00:22:41.531
End story.

00:22:41.912 --> 00:22:43.792
I wind up explaining because it's a

00:22:43.873 --> 00:22:45.374
marriage of like, here's the problem.

00:22:45.653 --> 00:22:46.815
This is a telephone game.

00:22:47.194 --> 00:22:47.935
There are humans.

00:22:49.211 --> 00:22:51.413
trying to send a message through time and

00:22:51.472 --> 00:22:52.952
space, but not through time and space,

00:22:53.272 --> 00:22:56.733
through a medium of pictures, sounds,

00:22:56.854 --> 00:23:01.575
videos, or words to hit another human.

00:23:02.214 --> 00:23:03.454
Somebody asked in a meeting,

00:23:03.714 --> 00:23:05.236
I did answer like Jerome Powell in this

00:23:05.256 --> 00:23:07.596
meeting, if we start doing this,

00:23:08.096 --> 00:23:10.336
how many views can you guarantee us in

00:23:10.356 --> 00:23:10.717
a year?

00:23:10.836 --> 00:23:11.217
And I went,

00:23:12.798 --> 00:23:14.759
None.

00:23:14.878 --> 00:23:16.299
I can say that this is best practice

00:23:16.339 --> 00:23:16.720
right now,

00:23:17.099 --> 00:23:18.619
but I will guarantee you nothing.

00:23:18.740 --> 00:23:19.861
And she was like stunned.

00:23:19.941 --> 00:23:20.881
I think she was waiting for me to

00:23:20.980 --> 00:23:21.840
bullshit an answer.

00:23:22.181 --> 00:23:22.580
And I was like,

00:23:22.881 --> 00:23:24.481
I will give you the truest of answers.

00:23:25.122 --> 00:23:25.442
None.

00:23:25.741 --> 00:23:27.402
You might have crappy content.

00:23:28.422 --> 00:23:30.823
I'm the person trying to polish the turd

00:23:31.222 --> 00:23:32.022
or the brilliance.

00:23:32.103 --> 00:23:33.284
I'm very sorry for you,

00:23:33.344 --> 00:23:35.163
but this does not guarantee that.

00:23:36.211 --> 00:23:36.471
Right.

00:23:36.551 --> 00:23:36.751
I mean,

00:23:36.771 --> 00:23:38.133
that's the hard thing about marketing.

00:23:38.192 --> 00:23:40.794
And that's so marketers are never like I

00:23:41.034 --> 00:23:42.615
recently, two years ago,

00:23:42.734 --> 00:23:47.336
launched this CEO, CMO leadership reset,

00:23:47.355 --> 00:23:49.277
which is essentially marriage counseling.

00:23:49.297 --> 00:23:50.278
I think we talked about this is a

00:23:50.417 --> 00:23:51.778
brilliant idea, by the way.

00:23:52.397 --> 00:23:55.359
And because this relationship, I,

00:23:56.980 --> 00:23:59.121
you know, you give me ten marketers,

00:23:59.580 --> 00:24:01.061
nine of them have

00:24:02.219 --> 00:24:03.240
I don't want to say toxic,

00:24:03.400 --> 00:24:05.441
but not healthy relationships with their

00:24:06.060 --> 00:24:06.442
leader.

00:24:07.082 --> 00:24:08.363
And it's not because the marketers don't

00:24:08.383 --> 00:24:09.022
know what they're doing.

00:24:09.042 --> 00:24:11.023
It's not because the CEO is awful.

00:24:11.183 --> 00:24:13.105
It's just the dynamic because everyone

00:24:13.125 --> 00:24:15.007
thinks, you know, marketing CEO,

00:24:15.027 --> 00:24:16.587
like it's the thing you think you can

00:24:16.627 --> 00:24:18.429
control to grow your business,

00:24:18.489 --> 00:24:19.549
but you sort of have to let go

00:24:19.589 --> 00:24:20.230
of control, right.

00:24:20.250 --> 00:24:20.950
To grow your business.

00:24:21.590 --> 00:24:24.673
And marketers end up in this position

00:24:24.692 --> 00:24:25.153
where like,

00:24:26.040 --> 00:24:26.240
you know,

00:24:26.260 --> 00:24:27.642
what you were talking about press

00:24:27.682 --> 00:24:27.982
conference,

00:24:28.002 --> 00:24:29.523
I'm thinking of like Bill Belichick or

00:24:29.564 --> 00:24:31.065
something like that's the attitude.

00:24:31.085 --> 00:24:32.266
We all get to the place where we're

00:24:32.286 --> 00:24:33.686
just like, you know,

00:24:33.727 --> 00:24:34.827
we just did our best.

00:24:34.847 --> 00:24:34.968
Yeah.

00:24:36.489 --> 00:24:36.969
But like,

00:24:37.009 --> 00:24:38.569
you're never going to win that game.

00:24:38.990 --> 00:24:39.851
Why'd you do that?

00:24:39.891 --> 00:24:40.172
Why?

00:24:40.791 --> 00:24:42.053
We need more leads.

00:24:42.133 --> 00:24:43.394
And I'm like, well, two weeks ago,

00:24:43.433 --> 00:24:44.734
your goal was this.

00:24:44.894 --> 00:24:45.675
Now it's more lead.

00:24:45.715 --> 00:24:48.278
We can't turn that battleship.

00:24:48.337 --> 00:24:49.419
This is not a switch.

00:24:49.618 --> 00:24:50.980
I am not gatekeeping good.

00:24:51.712 --> 00:24:53.853
And I think because marketing is so,

00:24:53.932 --> 00:24:55.773
it's not black and white and that's not

00:24:55.794 --> 00:24:56.493
a good answer.

00:24:56.894 --> 00:24:58.094
But what happens is like,

00:24:58.114 --> 00:24:59.515
they'll hone in and they'll go like, oh,

00:24:59.555 --> 00:25:01.515
we did some Google ads and that seemed

00:25:01.535 --> 00:25:01.855
to work.

00:25:01.894 --> 00:25:03.214
Turn off everything else.

00:25:03.494 --> 00:25:04.296
And as the marketer,

00:25:04.655 --> 00:25:06.796
you have the responsibility to go like,

00:25:06.816 --> 00:25:07.296
well, no, no, no,

00:25:07.316 --> 00:25:08.215
that's not how it works.

00:25:08.615 --> 00:25:10.096
And then they don't like to hear that.

00:25:10.176 --> 00:25:10.957
And that's, again,

00:25:10.997 --> 00:25:14.798
not knocking the CEOs or CFOs who control

00:25:14.817 --> 00:25:15.258
the budget.

00:25:15.798 --> 00:25:18.617
It's just a really hard position to be

00:25:18.678 --> 00:25:18.738
in.

00:25:18.798 --> 00:25:19.278
Yeah.

00:25:20.439 --> 00:25:21.199
Why do we do it then?

00:25:22.351 --> 00:25:23.771
Nobody told us this, Jimmy.

00:25:23.912 --> 00:25:26.733
I didn't learn this in college.

00:25:28.556 --> 00:25:31.018
This is where in my marketing or

00:25:31.057 --> 00:25:32.199
broadcasting days,

00:25:32.479 --> 00:25:34.961
I was actively trying not to get promoted.

00:25:35.622 --> 00:25:37.603
Because I saw the different problems that

00:25:37.623 --> 00:25:41.026
the person above me was dealing with.

00:25:41.165 --> 00:25:44.088
And I was like, those problems suck.

00:25:44.848 --> 00:25:46.310
And I don't want to solve those problems.

00:25:46.351 --> 00:25:47.932
I want to solve these problems first.

00:25:49.640 --> 00:25:51.500
I just we just always get taught.

00:25:51.540 --> 00:25:52.980
Well, what comes after ninth grade?

00:25:53.000 --> 00:25:53.580
It's tenth grade.

00:25:53.601 --> 00:25:54.201
You get promoted.

00:25:54.221 --> 00:25:54.801
You get promoted.

00:25:54.882 --> 00:25:56.201
So like your job is get promoted.

00:25:56.622 --> 00:25:57.561
I remember talking to my dad.

00:25:57.582 --> 00:26:00.002
It was a firefighter was like because he

00:26:00.022 --> 00:26:01.563
was a lieutenant and he was like,

00:26:01.683 --> 00:26:02.384
I'd be a captain.

00:26:02.423 --> 00:26:03.284
And we're like, then chief.

00:26:03.304 --> 00:26:03.983
He's like, no.

00:26:04.304 --> 00:26:04.624
And I'm like,

00:26:04.683 --> 00:26:06.125
do you not want to be in charge?

00:26:06.164 --> 00:26:07.525
He's like different problems.

00:26:07.785 --> 00:26:08.746
I don't want I want to be in

00:26:08.806 --> 00:26:09.246
fires.

00:26:09.665 --> 00:26:10.266
I don't want to be.

00:26:11.758 --> 00:26:12.397
in an office.

00:26:12.679 --> 00:26:13.118
My dad's like,

00:26:13.179 --> 00:26:14.980
I don't even like to use a typewriter.

00:26:15.180 --> 00:26:16.381
Never mind a computer.

00:26:16.520 --> 00:26:17.942
He's like, get me the hell away.

00:26:18.182 --> 00:26:20.063
He's like, give me an ax.

00:26:20.163 --> 00:26:20.963
I want to hold an ax.

00:26:21.763 --> 00:26:22.424
That's the same.

00:26:22.664 --> 00:26:25.846
This is a similar discussion with a great

00:26:25.866 --> 00:26:28.189
clinician becomes a clinic director.

00:26:28.489 --> 00:26:29.429
That makes sense.

00:26:30.329 --> 00:26:31.411
Two different jobs.

00:26:31.691 --> 00:26:32.711
And then we also just go,

00:26:32.912 --> 00:26:33.771
they'll figure it out.

00:26:33.811 --> 00:26:35.472
They figured out back pain.

00:26:35.532 --> 00:26:36.614
How hard can a clinic be?

00:26:36.973 --> 00:26:38.855
And I go, totally different thing.

00:26:39.076 --> 00:26:40.296
You could have a clinic director who's not

00:26:40.336 --> 00:26:41.076
even a clinician.

00:26:42.946 --> 00:26:45.769
I ran a country radio station, Andrea.

00:26:46.548 --> 00:26:48.430
A country radio station.

00:26:48.691 --> 00:26:49.691
That was the second station.

00:26:49.871 --> 00:26:50.932
I'm a rock guy.

00:26:51.352 --> 00:26:52.432
So I ran a rock station.

00:26:52.452 --> 00:26:54.134
I don't know if I ever told you

00:26:54.153 --> 00:26:54.614
this story.

00:26:55.434 --> 00:26:55.755
No.

00:26:55.775 --> 00:26:57.296
Four radio stations in one building.

00:26:57.316 --> 00:26:59.576
It was a very large nationwide radio

00:26:59.616 --> 00:26:59.836
company.

00:26:59.877 --> 00:27:01.679
Four radio stations in our market.

00:27:02.058 --> 00:27:02.818
I ran one of them.

00:27:03.038 --> 00:27:06.161
I was the chief of that station.

00:27:06.961 --> 00:27:07.082
Well,

00:27:07.102 --> 00:27:08.083
they came to me one day and they

00:27:08.103 --> 00:27:08.942
were like, you have to fight.

00:27:08.962 --> 00:27:10.163
You have to let somebody go because

00:27:10.183 --> 00:27:11.163
there's budget cuts and you have the

00:27:11.183 --> 00:27:11.724
largest staff.

00:27:12.184 --> 00:27:13.605
Nobody on my team did anything wrong.

00:27:13.746 --> 00:27:15.787
We were doing well in comparison with the

00:27:15.807 --> 00:27:16.287
other stations.

00:27:16.307 --> 00:27:17.528
We were probably overperforming,

00:27:18.167 --> 00:27:18.909
but doesn't matter.

00:27:19.608 --> 00:27:21.690
And I'm twenty five and I got to

00:27:21.710 --> 00:27:23.510
go home and come back tomorrow and fire

00:27:23.550 --> 00:27:23.892
someone.

00:27:24.271 --> 00:27:25.632
And everybody there been longer than

00:27:25.652 --> 00:27:26.272
they're longer than me.

00:27:26.292 --> 00:27:27.353
And most of them are older than me.

00:27:27.452 --> 00:27:28.513
I got to come back and fire somebody.

00:27:28.773 --> 00:27:29.394
So I went home.

00:27:30.515 --> 00:27:30.974
Drank.

00:27:32.175 --> 00:27:33.277
Came back the next day,

00:27:33.557 --> 00:27:35.078
walked into my boss's office and I'm like,

00:27:35.419 --> 00:27:36.461
I got a crazy idea.

00:27:36.740 --> 00:27:38.702
And my boss was used to me because

00:27:38.722 --> 00:27:40.163
he'd known me since I was nineteen,

00:27:40.203 --> 00:27:41.266
twenty one, twenty whatever.

00:27:41.685 --> 00:27:42.586
And he goes to me,

00:27:42.626 --> 00:27:44.189
this is not the time for crazy ideas

00:27:44.209 --> 00:27:45.589
like I just need a name like this

00:27:45.670 --> 00:27:46.090
sucks.

00:27:46.151 --> 00:27:46.451
He's like,

00:27:46.490 --> 00:27:47.632
but you just have to give me a

00:27:47.692 --> 00:27:47.972
name.

00:27:48.113 --> 00:27:49.213
And I gave him a name.

00:27:50.480 --> 00:27:52.122
I gave him the name of the guy

00:27:52.142 --> 00:27:54.163
who had my position at the country

00:27:54.182 --> 00:27:54.564
station.

00:27:55.223 --> 00:27:55.743
Here's why.

00:27:56.144 --> 00:27:57.586
That guy made more money than any of

00:27:57.625 --> 00:27:58.125
my people.

00:27:58.846 --> 00:28:00.627
That guy was terribly underperforming.

00:28:01.127 --> 00:28:02.788
That guy also had an Eeyore of an

00:28:02.848 --> 00:28:04.329
attitude.

00:28:04.549 --> 00:28:07.231
That guy could find something to complain

00:28:07.271 --> 00:28:09.553
about in the end zone of the Super

00:28:09.573 --> 00:28:09.733
Bowl.

00:28:09.894 --> 00:28:12.214
Just could not get out of his own

00:28:12.234 --> 00:28:12.454
way.

00:28:12.996 --> 00:28:15.938
And then I made my case hungover.

00:28:16.932 --> 00:28:19.773
We will be a better team because I

00:28:19.794 --> 00:28:21.695
don't know two things about country music,

00:28:22.277 --> 00:28:23.297
but I don't need to.

00:28:23.577 --> 00:28:24.759
I'm good at running people.

00:28:25.459 --> 00:28:26.279
And you know I am,

00:28:26.319 --> 00:28:27.881
otherwise I wouldn't be doing this thing.

00:28:29.061 --> 00:28:31.944
And he goes, by five o'clock,

00:28:32.005 --> 00:28:33.326
someone did have a cardboard box,

00:28:33.346 --> 00:28:34.626
but it wasn't anybody on my team.

00:28:35.777 --> 00:28:36.659
Because I read the room.

00:28:37.240 --> 00:28:39.123
But that was the thing said in front

00:28:39.163 --> 00:28:39.344
of me.

00:28:40.105 --> 00:28:41.467
So just because you're a good clinician

00:28:41.507 --> 00:28:42.107
doesn't mean you're good.

00:28:42.169 --> 00:28:42.308
I mean,

00:28:42.328 --> 00:28:44.112
that guy was very good on the air.

00:28:44.553 --> 00:28:45.994
Just a terrible program director.

00:28:46.256 --> 00:28:46.757
Like just...

00:28:48.365 --> 00:28:49.425
And it's two different jobs.

00:28:49.586 --> 00:28:51.346
It's like your dad said about like wanting

00:28:51.366 --> 00:28:52.067
to have the ax.

00:28:52.107 --> 00:28:53.009
I mean, in marketing,

00:28:53.249 --> 00:28:55.349
it's obviously lower stakes or different

00:28:55.410 --> 00:28:56.852
stakes when we don't have an ax.

00:28:56.932 --> 00:28:59.413
But I know I'm like,

00:28:59.433 --> 00:29:00.453
I don't know if that's a good idea.

00:29:00.473 --> 00:29:02.435
But we the higher you get,

00:29:02.455 --> 00:29:04.156
like the less marketing you're doing.

00:29:04.196 --> 00:29:04.778
Correct.

00:29:04.817 --> 00:29:06.038
That's the weird part.

00:29:06.398 --> 00:29:09.040
You're managing like sales.

00:29:09.500 --> 00:29:11.702
just a lot of stuff that doesn't feel

00:29:11.742 --> 00:29:12.442
like marketing.

00:29:12.523 --> 00:29:15.546
You're, you're managing problems like in,

00:29:15.645 --> 00:29:16.727
and in some ways I enjoy it.

00:29:16.747 --> 00:29:19.568
Like you are, you're in operations,

00:29:19.828 --> 00:29:21.170
you are in finance,

00:29:21.250 --> 00:29:23.551
you're managing the people you're man.

00:29:23.652 --> 00:29:24.653
And when I say people, I mean,

00:29:24.673 --> 00:29:26.213
you're managing your people and you're

00:29:26.233 --> 00:29:28.055
managing across the executive team.

00:29:28.075 --> 00:29:30.656
You're managing up to the CEO, the board,

00:29:31.258 --> 00:29:31.857
you name it.

00:29:31.897 --> 00:29:33.740
Like you're not necessarily the one,

00:29:33.759 --> 00:29:35.320
like you don't have the space to,

00:29:35.881 --> 00:29:37.623
um and i used to have to intentionally

00:29:37.682 --> 00:29:39.463
carve out time that like wasn't even

00:29:39.624 --> 00:29:41.065
during work time a lot of times to

00:29:41.085 --> 00:29:42.826
go like all right let me be creative

00:29:42.987 --> 00:29:44.667
so i can lead my team to do

00:29:44.688 --> 00:29:47.309
like cool marketing things um because

00:29:47.349 --> 00:29:50.972
that's not what your role is when you

00:29:51.012 --> 00:29:54.435
get to a certain level in my experience

00:29:54.496 --> 00:29:55.636
and i didn't even get to a vp

00:29:55.676 --> 00:29:58.118
level i'm pretty good at director i'm like

00:29:58.138 --> 00:29:59.619
that's as high as i want to go

00:30:00.079 --> 00:30:01.320
because otherwise i'm having just

00:30:01.461 --> 00:30:04.384
conversations that i didn't love and uh

00:30:05.981 --> 00:30:08.387
It was hard to even get a meeting.

00:30:08.448 --> 00:30:08.989
They'd be like, hey,

00:30:09.009 --> 00:30:11.074
your next quarter goal is this.

00:30:11.134 --> 00:30:11.755
And I'm like, great.

00:30:12.036 --> 00:30:12.938
I'd love to learn more about it.

00:30:12.958 --> 00:30:13.920
And they're like, just go do it.

00:30:14.598 --> 00:30:15.640
And I'm like, all right, see ya.

00:30:15.960 --> 00:30:16.661
And then I'd go do it,

00:30:16.701 --> 00:30:17.361
put a plan together.

00:30:17.381 --> 00:30:18.241
Like, well, what's this?

00:30:18.321 --> 00:30:19.403
And I'm like, you asked,

00:30:20.083 --> 00:30:21.364
you told me your knee hurt.

00:30:21.564 --> 00:30:21.805
I said,

00:30:21.845 --> 00:30:22.925
I want to ask you a question about

00:30:22.965 --> 00:30:23.425
your knee.

00:30:23.486 --> 00:30:24.207
Take a look at the knee.

00:30:24.227 --> 00:30:25.688
You said it's knee pain.

00:30:25.708 --> 00:30:26.307
Get to work.

00:30:26.647 --> 00:30:27.189
I did.

00:30:27.588 --> 00:30:28.849
And then I came back with a plan,

00:30:28.890 --> 00:30:29.471
started doing it.

00:30:29.490 --> 00:30:30.490
And you're like, what's this?

00:30:30.531 --> 00:30:32.192
And I'm like, that's the funny part.

00:30:32.772 --> 00:30:32.893
Like,

00:30:33.012 --> 00:30:34.734
do you think I'm just sitting on Instagram

00:30:34.755 --> 00:30:35.095
all day?

00:30:35.414 --> 00:30:39.077
I am, but you don't know that.

00:30:39.117 --> 00:30:40.398
But that's the funny part.

00:30:40.538 --> 00:30:41.079
Like people,

00:30:41.339 --> 00:30:43.321
like people still this last week,

00:30:44.078 --> 00:30:45.519
Hey, we need this.

00:30:45.720 --> 00:30:46.621
Can we bring you in?

00:30:47.122 --> 00:30:47.342
Sure.

00:30:47.682 --> 00:30:48.522
How much will it cost?

00:30:49.502 --> 00:30:50.723
Might be a dollar.

00:30:50.825 --> 00:30:52.105
I might owe you money after this.

00:30:52.286 --> 00:30:52.705
What?

00:30:53.287 --> 00:30:54.928
I have no idea what the problem is

00:30:54.968 --> 00:30:55.367
yet.

00:30:55.868 --> 00:30:57.109
Do you know what the problem is?

00:30:57.609 --> 00:30:57.930
No.

00:30:58.911 --> 00:31:00.112
That's why you're calling me.

00:31:00.372 --> 00:31:01.633
How much will it cost?

00:31:02.773 --> 00:31:03.714
It's probably going to be less than a

00:31:03.755 --> 00:31:04.095
million.

00:31:05.256 --> 00:31:06.037
I'll save you some money.

00:31:06.857 --> 00:31:07.817
Definitely less than a million.

00:31:10.039 --> 00:31:11.740
Do you want it done right?

00:31:11.902 --> 00:31:13.103
I don't know what the problem is.

00:31:13.836 --> 00:31:14.116
So yeah,

00:31:14.136 --> 00:31:15.317
I spent a lot of time doing that

00:31:15.356 --> 00:31:17.018
when I would rather be in a lab

00:31:19.718 --> 00:31:21.398
figuring out weird ways to solve the

00:31:21.439 --> 00:31:21.759
problem,

00:31:21.898 --> 00:31:23.378
knowing ninety nine ways we're not going

00:31:23.398 --> 00:31:23.659
to do.

00:31:23.699 --> 00:31:24.480
I'm OK with that,

00:31:24.960 --> 00:31:25.960
but we're going to whittle it down to

00:31:25.980 --> 00:31:27.259
the one that we're going to run with.

00:31:28.059 --> 00:31:28.980
Did I show you this?

00:31:29.560 --> 00:31:30.181
Here's a market.

00:31:30.221 --> 00:31:31.361
Let's just play marketing now.

00:31:31.820 --> 00:31:33.501
So, Andrea,

00:31:33.561 --> 00:31:36.061
you are the vice president of marketing

00:31:36.342 --> 00:31:40.383
for a small independent podcast in

00:31:40.442 --> 00:31:42.624
physical therapy hosted by Jimmy.

00:31:44.403 --> 00:31:47.227
I'm going to be live streaming from a

00:31:47.267 --> 00:31:48.428
booth, somebody else's booth,

00:31:48.488 --> 00:31:49.449
one of our sponsors booth,

00:31:49.528 --> 00:31:50.670
because I don't have the money for a

00:31:50.710 --> 00:31:50.930
booth.

00:31:50.970 --> 00:31:52.872
Like buying a booth would just be stupid.

00:31:53.172 --> 00:31:56.515
Ten grand or whatever.

00:31:56.535 --> 00:31:56.694
CSM?

00:31:56.714 --> 00:31:56.935
CSM.

00:31:57.056 --> 00:31:57.536
Yeah, sorry.

00:31:57.576 --> 00:31:58.136
See, it's smart.

00:31:58.297 --> 00:31:59.157
I didn't say that.

00:31:59.337 --> 00:31:59.897
You didn't assume.

00:31:59.917 --> 00:32:00.098
Good.

00:32:01.579 --> 00:32:02.681
I'm trying to think how to get people

00:32:02.701 --> 00:32:03.402
to come up to me.

00:32:03.662 --> 00:32:04.082
Number one,

00:32:04.102 --> 00:32:05.804
I'm going to do live stream of interviews,

00:32:05.943 --> 00:32:06.523
all CSM.

00:32:07.458 --> 00:32:10.300
So I'm having movers and shakers and

00:32:10.320 --> 00:32:11.362
people with something to say.

00:32:11.461 --> 00:32:12.542
And I'm like, let's talk.

00:32:12.663 --> 00:32:13.963
And I'm going to bring the lights,

00:32:14.084 --> 00:32:16.405
the camera, the big oversized microphone.

00:32:16.866 --> 00:32:17.988
But how do I get people to stop

00:32:18.008 --> 00:32:19.048
by just to say hi?

00:32:19.068 --> 00:32:20.609
That's a weak ask.

00:32:21.191 --> 00:32:22.932
I did a post on this last week.

00:32:23.692 --> 00:32:25.634
We're at booth four, five, six.

00:32:25.674 --> 00:32:27.977
Come see us is a bullshit ask.

00:32:28.436 --> 00:32:29.458
Come say hi.

00:32:30.078 --> 00:32:31.740
I don't know you, recruiter lady.

00:32:31.759 --> 00:32:32.942
So anyway.

00:32:33.775 --> 00:32:34.736
Yeah, give me a reason.

00:32:35.115 --> 00:32:39.118
So I came up with these.

00:32:39.138 --> 00:32:40.500
These are merit badges.

00:32:40.519 --> 00:32:42.280
I think I saw those.

00:32:42.300 --> 00:32:44.803
And it's like first time presenter.

00:32:45.143 --> 00:32:47.724
It's ran into my past professor.

00:32:49.165 --> 00:32:50.487
I want to print a bunch of these

00:32:50.626 --> 00:32:51.327
as stickers.

00:32:52.252 --> 00:32:53.933
And I want you to earn your merit

00:32:53.973 --> 00:32:54.575
badge.

00:32:54.595 --> 00:32:55.375
You will come to me,

00:32:55.496 --> 00:32:56.596
you'll present your case,

00:32:56.916 --> 00:32:58.758
and then I will bestow it upon you.

00:32:59.018 --> 00:32:59.939
And then you stick it to the back

00:32:59.959 --> 00:33:03.342
of your laptop or your Yeti or your

00:33:03.481 --> 00:33:05.844
Odwalla, whatever those water bottles are.

00:33:07.505 --> 00:33:09.487
And I'm thinking of these things because,

00:33:09.807 --> 00:33:10.207
number one,

00:33:10.227 --> 00:33:12.249
I don't like scavenger hunts because it's

00:33:12.328 --> 00:33:12.509
too...

00:33:13.512 --> 00:33:15.715
too much but i like i earned that

00:33:15.875 --> 00:33:17.538
give it to me i want this to

00:33:17.597 --> 00:33:20.541
represent me it's not it's not a scavenger

00:33:20.582 --> 00:33:22.483
hunt it's scav it's not a scavenger hunt

00:33:22.703 --> 00:33:24.787
because i don't i don't do them like

00:33:25.207 --> 00:33:27.349
as corny and cheesy as i am when

00:33:27.390 --> 00:33:28.510
i go to a conference i'm like go

00:33:28.550 --> 00:33:30.393
get your stamp and maybe win i'm like

00:33:30.413 --> 00:33:31.474
i'm good i'm gonna do zero

00:33:33.828 --> 00:33:37.632
none so thoughts on me pressing the i

00:33:37.672 --> 00:33:39.053
want pictures with people getting their

00:33:39.393 --> 00:33:42.654
thing i want stuff after i want people

00:33:42.674 --> 00:33:45.676
to post i earned this generated content

00:33:45.757 --> 00:33:48.419
you are all over it so that so

00:33:48.479 --> 00:33:50.079
thoughts is the juice worth the squeeze on

00:33:50.099 --> 00:33:52.761
me getting a hundred of ten of these

00:33:53.221 --> 00:33:54.863
printed out and then be like come if

00:33:54.883 --> 00:33:57.265
you earned your badge now come to booth

00:33:57.285 --> 00:33:59.486
four five six get your badge while

00:33:59.506 --> 00:34:00.207
supplies last

00:34:00.759 --> 00:34:02.500
Well, yes, for a few reasons.

00:34:03.340 --> 00:34:04.742
But there's a little bit of FOMO.

00:34:04.782 --> 00:34:06.324
Like, I need to earn my badge.

00:34:06.503 --> 00:34:07.765
Or I did earn it.

00:34:07.945 --> 00:34:08.666
I need the credit.

00:34:09.126 --> 00:34:09.646
Exactly.

00:34:10.708 --> 00:34:10.947
Yeah.

00:34:11.268 --> 00:34:12.590
What else would you amp to that?

00:34:12.630 --> 00:34:13.911
Is there any angle I'm not seeing?

00:34:15.992 --> 00:34:16.994
And I'm putting you on the spot.

00:34:17.514 --> 00:34:18.034
But that's okay.

00:34:18.054 --> 00:34:19.096
We're always put on the spot.

00:34:20.257 --> 00:34:20.757
No.

00:34:21.498 --> 00:34:22.778
I'm sure there's an angle.

00:34:22.998 --> 00:34:23.260
So...

00:34:24.521 --> 00:34:25.061
I think it's,

00:34:25.402 --> 00:34:26.782
so it's not a scavenger hunt.

00:34:26.864 --> 00:34:28.045
I think it's a badge.

00:34:28.065 --> 00:34:29.445
They're creating content.

00:34:29.485 --> 00:34:31.307
You're like making a big deal of it

00:34:31.347 --> 00:34:32.208
when they're there.

00:34:33.750 --> 00:34:34.329
Um,

00:34:35.731 --> 00:34:37.512
what else do they get to be there?

00:34:37.532 --> 00:34:39.614
So they get there, they talk,

00:34:41.876 --> 00:34:43.818
you're giving them maybe some media.

00:34:43.858 --> 00:34:44.619
This is not,

00:34:45.019 --> 00:34:47.643
this is not just for people guests.

00:34:47.663 --> 00:34:48.422
This is for people.

00:34:48.463 --> 00:34:49.324
This is for listeners.

00:34:49.364 --> 00:34:49.605
Like,

00:34:50.521 --> 00:34:52.043
I want them to have earned something.

00:34:52.164 --> 00:34:54.728
And I started putting these out on social

00:34:55.190 --> 00:34:56.431
and I wanted to see if I didn't

00:34:56.472 --> 00:34:58.315
say we might do this if it gets

00:34:58.335 --> 00:34:59.376
one hundred likes.

00:35:00.731 --> 00:35:03.574
one hundred retweets and my wife will let

00:35:03.594 --> 00:35:04.893
me quit my job and be a golf

00:35:04.934 --> 00:35:05.454
professional.

00:35:06.275 --> 00:35:07.034
I get those.

00:35:07.596 --> 00:35:08.835
But this was like, hey,

00:35:09.556 --> 00:35:10.396
who would have earned this?

00:35:10.436 --> 00:35:11.418
And then I just started putting them out

00:35:11.438 --> 00:35:11.918
and people were like,

00:35:12.478 --> 00:35:14.298
I'm now getting emails on our website.

00:35:14.438 --> 00:35:16.000
Where can I purchase that?

00:35:16.079 --> 00:35:17.940
And that's when I'm onto something.

00:35:18.300 --> 00:35:19.282
That's when I want to give it out

00:35:19.322 --> 00:35:20.141
for free when you're like,

00:35:20.322 --> 00:35:22.224
how do I give you six dollars to

00:35:22.264 --> 00:35:23.403
get five of these?

00:35:23.563 --> 00:35:24.204
And I'm like, got it.

00:35:24.224 --> 00:35:24.605
You got it.

00:35:24.625 --> 00:35:25.264
I mean, you've got it.

00:35:27.559 --> 00:35:29.802
So I see like a little Rubbermaid case,

00:35:30.224 --> 00:35:31.045
little dividers.

00:35:31.766 --> 00:35:34.449
And you got the Ten Timers Club.

00:35:34.469 --> 00:35:35.530
You've been to ten CSMs.

00:35:35.590 --> 00:35:36.472
Okay, there you go.

00:35:37.032 --> 00:35:38.775
All right, let's put that on.

00:35:38.934 --> 00:35:39.175
All right,

00:35:39.195 --> 00:35:40.416
let's take a little quick picture of that.

00:35:40.538 --> 00:35:43.742
I'm picturing like the sash for Boy Scout.

00:35:44.320 --> 00:35:45.461
So my outfit,

00:35:45.762 --> 00:35:47.202
so I have a thing at CSM.

00:35:47.302 --> 00:35:48.322
First day of CSM,

00:35:48.443 --> 00:35:49.884
I wear a redonkulous outfit.

00:35:50.284 --> 00:35:51.324
When I worked for Fox,

00:35:51.364 --> 00:35:52.304
their color was orange.

00:35:52.465 --> 00:35:54.806
I wore a complete orange suit,

00:35:55.367 --> 00:35:58.088
orange jacket, orange tie, orange pants,

00:35:58.387 --> 00:35:59.268
orange converse.

00:36:01.170 --> 00:36:03.070
When I host the Foundation for Physical

00:36:03.090 --> 00:36:04.331
Therapy Research Gala,

00:36:04.791 --> 00:36:08.233
I wore a black suit with like chalk...

00:36:09.369 --> 00:36:09.728
physics.

00:36:10.250 --> 00:36:11.550
I look like Bill Nye the Science Guy.

00:36:12.012 --> 00:36:13.432
It was a research gala.

00:36:13.632 --> 00:36:13.994
Boom.

00:36:14.693 --> 00:36:15.614
So this year,

00:36:15.755 --> 00:36:19.458
I'm going red tuxedo jacket because we've

00:36:19.478 --> 00:36:21.481
got Valentine's Day on Saturday.

00:36:22.041 --> 00:36:23.802
So I'm going all about the heart angle.

00:36:24.222 --> 00:36:26.485
I legitimately bought a tuxedo jacket.

00:36:26.626 --> 00:36:28.748
Not like an opposite, corny,

00:36:28.807 --> 00:36:29.668
sixty-eight dollar.

00:36:30.028 --> 00:36:31.409
I bought a legit tuxedo jacket.

00:36:32.090 --> 00:36:33.650
And I'm going to wear that because in

00:36:33.690 --> 00:36:34.371
my mind,

00:36:34.911 --> 00:36:37.211
I'm going to be standing amongst amongst a

00:36:37.251 --> 00:36:38.753
bunch of polo shirts and I'm in a

00:36:38.793 --> 00:36:40.492
booth and everyone's got squeezy balls and

00:36:40.532 --> 00:36:40.952
pens.

00:36:41.373 --> 00:36:42.333
How do you stand out?

00:36:42.452 --> 00:36:44.793
Either I don't go because you won't notice

00:36:44.813 --> 00:36:46.094
me if I'm not there because it's the

00:36:46.134 --> 00:36:48.914
sea of sameness or I need to slap

00:36:48.934 --> 00:36:50.735
you across the face with why is that

00:36:50.775 --> 00:36:52.775
guy wearing a bow tie?

00:36:53.661 --> 00:36:54.481
I need to find out with that.

00:36:54.501 --> 00:36:55.121
And then someone will be like,

00:36:55.161 --> 00:36:55.742
that's Jimmy.

00:36:55.882 --> 00:36:56.862
He talks a lot.

00:36:56.983 --> 00:36:58.682
And like, oh, okay.

00:36:58.702 --> 00:36:59.704
I don't need you to love me.

00:37:00.503 --> 00:37:01.824
I just need you to know like what

00:37:01.864 --> 00:37:03.125
the hell that guy's doing there.

00:37:03.826 --> 00:37:04.385
Did you ever,

00:37:04.425 --> 00:37:05.887
do you remember savetoby.com?

00:37:05.907 --> 00:37:06.007
No.

00:37:08.527 --> 00:37:10.608
One of the first viral websites.

00:37:10.668 --> 00:37:11.909
I'll get the whole Wikipedia story.

00:37:11.929 --> 00:37:13.190
We could do an entire episode on this.

00:37:14.621 --> 00:37:15.963
This is in nineteen ninety seven.

00:37:16.103 --> 00:37:18.023
Nineteen ninety eight websites were a

00:37:18.043 --> 00:37:18.985
thing, kind of.

00:37:19.324 --> 00:37:22.146
And then someone told me in the hallway

00:37:22.266 --> 00:37:23.686
about Save Toby dot com.

00:37:23.748 --> 00:37:24.628
And I'm like, what's this?

00:37:24.648 --> 00:37:26.168
And like a guy's going to kill a

00:37:26.208 --> 00:37:27.050
bunny and eat it.

00:37:27.070 --> 00:37:29.170
Oh, God, yes.

00:37:29.231 --> 00:37:30.231
And I'm like, what?

00:37:30.251 --> 00:37:31.012
And they're like, yeah,

00:37:31.052 --> 00:37:33.112
unless unless he gets enough donations to

00:37:33.172 --> 00:37:35.855
like like ten thousand ten thousand people

00:37:35.894 --> 00:37:36.894
giving him one dollar.

00:37:37.996 --> 00:37:38.757
The thing is,

00:37:39.672 --> 00:37:40.594
When you went there,

00:37:40.653 --> 00:37:43.195
you saw like a little thermometer, right?

00:37:43.235 --> 00:37:44.775
The one where you like bought a pixel

00:37:44.815 --> 00:37:45.815
for like a dollar.

00:37:45.835 --> 00:37:46.737
No, that was a different one.

00:37:46.996 --> 00:37:49.217
OK, this was this was legitimate.

00:37:49.237 --> 00:37:49.818
Some guy was like,

00:37:49.858 --> 00:37:50.938
here's a picture of a bunny.

00:37:51.119 --> 00:37:52.739
If I don't get if he if the

00:37:52.860 --> 00:37:55.501
bunny doesn't get enough donations by this

00:37:55.561 --> 00:37:56.621
date, bunny dies.

00:37:58.282 --> 00:37:58.862
The thing is,

00:37:58.903 --> 00:38:00.784
the more clicks it got early,

00:38:01.264 --> 00:38:01.985
early Google,

00:38:02.224 --> 00:38:04.106
the higher it would rank on search.

00:38:04.746 --> 00:38:06.487
And then this was before social.

00:38:07.233 --> 00:38:08.153
This was this.

00:38:08.434 --> 00:38:11.335
This was word of mouth.

00:38:12.135 --> 00:38:13.096
You had to go look.

00:38:13.976 --> 00:38:14.876
And then when you're there, you're like,

00:38:14.896 --> 00:38:15.737
this isn't real.

00:38:16.077 --> 00:38:18.398
But what if it is?

00:38:18.599 --> 00:38:21.280
Give one dollar and save Toby.

00:38:21.380 --> 00:38:21.940
Just save Toby.

00:38:22.001 --> 00:38:23.782
To potentially save Toby.

00:38:25.422 --> 00:38:26.923
I mean, this also brings about...

00:38:27.583 --> 00:38:29.905
There's a genre of social media video

00:38:30.025 --> 00:38:32.547
slash post that I must have watched enough

00:38:32.606 --> 00:38:32.927
of these.

00:38:32.987 --> 00:38:34.047
Now I see a ton of them,

00:38:34.527 --> 00:38:35.509
which is this like...

00:38:36.643 --> 00:38:38.545
First-person point of view, camera,

00:38:38.925 --> 00:38:41.509
guy talking to people on the street,

00:38:41.588 --> 00:38:43.451
homeless people, and being like,

00:38:43.490 --> 00:38:44.472
can I get you some food?

00:38:44.891 --> 00:38:45.672
Yes.

00:38:45.733 --> 00:38:47.554
That gets so much view and traffic.

00:38:47.675 --> 00:38:50.516
That channel makes money enough for them

00:38:50.556 --> 00:38:53.159
to fund doing the work and giving the

00:38:53.219 --> 00:38:53.559
thing.

00:38:54.481 --> 00:38:56.202
And I hope anyway,

00:38:56.422 --> 00:38:57.603
at least what I'm seeing, I mean,

00:38:57.643 --> 00:38:57.963
I know there's,

00:38:58.282 --> 00:38:59.784
there's always going to be just douchebags

00:38:59.844 --> 00:39:01.045
out there to take advantage of it,

00:39:01.485 --> 00:39:03.925
but there's a guy, Victor, Victor,

00:39:04.226 --> 00:39:06.628
something drives around and it's like,

00:39:06.688 --> 00:39:07.288
do you want, he's like,

00:39:07.347 --> 00:39:08.088
I was on the street.

00:39:08.228 --> 00:39:09.248
Do you want to get off the street?

00:39:09.289 --> 00:39:10.969
If you say yes, I fly you.

00:39:11.070 --> 00:39:13.152
I think he's in like New England.

00:39:14.230 --> 00:39:15.570
he's like i fly you to florida i

00:39:15.610 --> 00:39:17.351
pay for the flight i pay for rehab

00:39:17.632 --> 00:39:19.333
i get you a job and i hope

00:39:19.373 --> 00:39:21.634
it's real because i watched the damn video

00:39:22.193 --> 00:39:23.974
because it's a before during and after

00:39:24.014 --> 00:39:27.036
story it's compelling here's the problem

00:39:27.077 --> 00:39:29.057
let's go back to our conversation with

00:39:29.438 --> 00:39:32.159
ceos and cmos if you pitch that idea

00:39:33.420 --> 00:39:35.561
in a boardroom would it ever make it

00:39:35.581 --> 00:39:40.762
out of the boardroom no i'd be fired

00:39:40.782 --> 00:39:41.764
do you know who big do you know

00:39:41.784 --> 00:39:42.744
who big dawes is no

00:39:44.447 --> 00:39:47.190
He's a guy who's just a content creator.

00:39:47.210 --> 00:39:48.230
And again, I hate that term,

00:39:48.269 --> 00:39:49.911
but he does.

00:39:50.010 --> 00:39:51.612
And he'll walk in a college campus with

00:39:51.632 --> 00:39:52.231
a football.

00:39:52.813 --> 00:39:53.172
And of course,

00:39:53.213 --> 00:39:54.713
he's got like people behind him shooting

00:39:54.733 --> 00:39:56.135
from sixteen different angles.

00:39:56.614 --> 00:39:58.195
And he'll he'll just like see some girl

00:39:58.235 --> 00:39:59.315
on a college campus, you know,

00:39:59.376 --> 00:40:01.297
walk in a class, AirPods and books,

00:40:01.338 --> 00:40:01.677
whatever.

00:40:02.197 --> 00:40:02.557
And I'll go,

00:40:02.918 --> 00:40:04.278
I'll give you five hundred dollars if you

00:40:04.298 --> 00:40:04.920
catch this ball.

00:40:04.980 --> 00:40:06.019
And he just throws the ball up.

00:40:08.862 --> 00:40:10.483
And then the whole then the video slows

00:40:10.523 --> 00:40:12.704
down and you're watching.

00:40:15.239 --> 00:40:17.260
gonna catch it she's gonna catch it she's

00:40:17.280 --> 00:40:21.304
gonna catch it and she doesn't and you're

00:40:21.324 --> 00:40:24.005
like and then you see the same type

00:40:24.025 --> 00:40:25.505
of video like three days later and she

00:40:25.545 --> 00:40:28.128
does if you were in a marketing meeting

00:40:28.168 --> 00:40:29.389
and you were like so i'm gonna walk

00:40:29.429 --> 00:40:31.010
around and give away money and they're

00:40:31.030 --> 00:40:32.871
like how does that money relate back

00:40:32.990 --> 00:40:35.492
directly what is one degree of kevin bacon

00:40:36.052 --> 00:40:37.614
one degree of getting the more money we

00:40:37.634 --> 00:40:38.914
need more money because we're also paying

00:40:38.934 --> 00:40:40.376
for you and the camera crew

00:40:41.344 --> 00:40:41.764
It doesn't.

00:40:42.206 --> 00:40:44.688
We're going to gain so much attention that

00:40:44.728 --> 00:40:46.750
this five hundred dollar video we do once

00:40:47.510 --> 00:40:50.213
will make twenty times that over the

00:40:50.253 --> 00:40:51.233
lifetime of the video.

00:40:52.054 --> 00:40:54.056
And then we gain a subscriber and then

00:40:54.076 --> 00:40:55.838
they watch thirty of those videos.

00:40:56.237 --> 00:40:58.099
And now we've four hundred X to the

00:40:58.119 --> 00:40:58.420
budget.

00:40:58.980 --> 00:41:00.681
But you can't explain that in a boardroom.

00:41:00.702 --> 00:41:01.402
You can't explain it.

00:41:01.422 --> 00:41:03.063
And this goes back to attribution where

00:41:03.083 --> 00:41:05.226
like we can't always just go back to

00:41:05.585 --> 00:41:08.608
one asset and say this drove

00:41:09.490 --> 00:41:12.652
a customer because it's over X amount of

00:41:12.713 --> 00:41:13.152
time.

00:41:13.273 --> 00:41:14.594
It's like watching multiple,

00:41:14.614 --> 00:41:16.235
like we all follow those different types

00:41:16.255 --> 00:41:17.016
of things, right?

00:41:17.076 --> 00:41:17.476
And it's like,

00:41:17.615 --> 00:41:19.237
I can't say what video it was that

00:41:19.297 --> 00:41:21.759
made me want to start following or get

00:41:21.798 --> 00:41:24.219
like caught up in certain accounts.

00:41:24.639 --> 00:41:26.541
This is why I won't do affiliate

00:41:26.561 --> 00:41:29.123
marketing.

00:41:29.143 --> 00:41:30.364
Like organizations have been like,

00:41:30.403 --> 00:41:31.925
we'll give you a promo code and then

00:41:31.945 --> 00:41:33.085
we'll pay you from that.

00:41:33.405 --> 00:41:34.045
And I'm like, okay,

00:41:34.065 --> 00:41:36.788
but the payment needs to be redonkulous,

00:41:36.807 --> 00:41:37.027
right?

00:41:37.900 --> 00:41:39.340
Ten percent of what you made.

00:41:39.762 --> 00:41:42.222
I don't do it like because I'll feel

00:41:42.943 --> 00:41:44.882
I will be reading your live read and

00:41:44.922 --> 00:41:47.503
I'll be feel like I'm getting robbed every

00:41:47.543 --> 00:41:48.985
time because I'm definitely doing

00:41:49.045 --> 00:41:49.405
something.

00:41:49.804 --> 00:41:52.106
You're definitely getting something and it

00:41:52.206 --> 00:41:52.706
might pay off.

00:41:53.065 --> 00:41:54.547
I might get people to your website and

00:41:54.686 --> 00:41:55.666
your product sucks.

00:41:56.829 --> 00:41:57.588
I did my job,

00:41:57.610 --> 00:41:58.630
but didn't get paid for it.

00:41:58.710 --> 00:41:59.351
That isn't fair.

00:41:59.751 --> 00:42:00.510
You pay me.

00:42:00.791 --> 00:42:02.152
Now, you want to do a combo deal?

00:42:02.411 --> 00:42:03.452
We'll pay you X,

00:42:03.672 --> 00:42:04.673
and then on top of that,

00:42:04.693 --> 00:42:05.974
if it hits, sure.

00:42:06.755 --> 00:42:07.876
Or we pay you,

00:42:07.956 --> 00:42:08.795
we give you no cut.

00:42:09.036 --> 00:42:09.356
Great.

00:42:10.456 --> 00:42:11.577
Because of attribution.

00:42:11.898 --> 00:42:13.298
And I'm probably this way because I came

00:42:13.318 --> 00:42:15.380
from traditional broadcast media where,

00:42:15.420 --> 00:42:18.981
like, good luck attributing radio.

00:42:19.943 --> 00:42:20.123
I mean,

00:42:20.202 --> 00:42:24.505
even the radio rating system was called

00:42:24.724 --> 00:42:25.306
Arbitron.

00:42:26.487 --> 00:42:28.570
And every quarterly when the ratings would

00:42:28.590 --> 00:42:29.471
come out, oh,

00:42:29.510 --> 00:42:31.152
what are the arbitrary ratings from

00:42:31.293 --> 00:42:32.394
Arbitron this quarter?

00:42:32.715 --> 00:42:33.615
They're just making them up.

00:42:33.835 --> 00:42:34.817
They're just making them up.

00:42:35.077 --> 00:42:36.099
Here's how I would tell people.

00:42:36.239 --> 00:42:38.240
I had a hardcore CEO.

00:42:39.215 --> 00:42:40.815
thinking about sponsoring my podcast.

00:42:40.835 --> 00:42:41.936
And they're like, well, how do we know?

00:42:42.096 --> 00:42:42.456
And I go,

00:42:42.655 --> 00:42:43.815
how many clinicians do you have?

00:42:44.135 --> 00:42:44.936
And he was like, eighty.

00:42:45.056 --> 00:42:47.097
And I go email every one of them.

00:42:47.356 --> 00:42:47.996
Two questions.

00:42:48.137 --> 00:42:49.356
Do you listen to physical therapy

00:42:49.376 --> 00:42:50.056
podcasts?

00:42:50.436 --> 00:42:51.978
If yes, they can answer the next one.

00:42:52.538 --> 00:42:54.097
Name two that you've listened to in the

00:42:54.117 --> 00:42:54.797
last thirty days.

00:42:54.958 --> 00:42:55.898
If I'm not one of them,

00:42:56.139 --> 00:42:57.559
don't call me back.

00:42:57.579 --> 00:42:59.119
There's your there's your attribution,

00:43:00.338 --> 00:43:02.400
your own people.

00:43:02.500 --> 00:43:05.320
It's it's it's I always say you need

00:43:05.340 --> 00:43:06.481
to look at it directionally.

00:43:07.240 --> 00:43:07.701
What does that mean?

00:43:08.362 --> 00:43:09.601
you need to look at attribution

00:43:09.621 --> 00:43:10.322
directionally.

00:43:10.382 --> 00:43:12.242
So gone are the days where we can

00:43:12.282 --> 00:43:14.523
go like someone did this thing and that's

00:43:14.543 --> 00:43:15.184
what drove them.

00:43:15.344 --> 00:43:16.724
Like you need to look at it,

00:43:16.824 --> 00:43:18.204
like look at all of the data,

00:43:18.764 --> 00:43:19.965
look at behaviors,

00:43:20.045 --> 00:43:23.686
talk to people and then go, they,

00:43:23.746 --> 00:43:24.146
you know,

00:43:24.186 --> 00:43:27.987
these sorts of things drive a customer or

00:43:28.007 --> 00:43:29.748
a client or views or whatever it is

00:43:29.768 --> 00:43:31.688
that you're trying to drive.

00:43:31.768 --> 00:43:33.588
What's, what are we solving for?

00:43:33.969 --> 00:43:35.909
Should be the first question.

00:43:36.170 --> 00:43:37.409
It's always the first question out of my

00:43:37.449 --> 00:43:37.750
mouth.

00:43:38.527 --> 00:43:40.527
I try to hold what's your budget.

00:43:41.967 --> 00:43:42.487
I play with AI.

00:43:43.568 --> 00:43:45.750
I hated when people would ask me what

00:43:45.789 --> 00:43:47.230
your budget in the first three questions.

00:43:47.250 --> 00:43:48.210
So like, oh, here we go.

00:43:48.231 --> 00:43:49.130
I'm going to say a number and then

00:43:49.150 --> 00:43:49.791
you're going to imagine.

00:43:50.150 --> 00:43:51.052
I understand it now.

00:43:52.012 --> 00:43:53.012
I usually follow up.

00:43:54.012 --> 00:43:55.813
What budget are we like ballparking?

00:43:55.992 --> 00:43:57.534
Is this a ten dollar problem,

00:43:57.994 --> 00:43:59.173
a thousand dollar problem,

00:43:59.215 --> 00:44:00.675
a ten thousand dollar problem or a hundred

00:44:00.715 --> 00:44:01.534
thousand dollar problem?

00:44:01.815 --> 00:44:03.056
I like asking it that way.

00:44:04.076 --> 00:44:05.297
Well, we're bleeding money.

00:44:05.916 --> 00:44:06.197
Okay,

00:44:06.217 --> 00:44:08.599
so it's not a dollar or a thousand

00:44:08.619 --> 00:44:08.920
dollars.

00:44:08.940 --> 00:44:09.940
We're talking ten or a hundred.

00:44:10.420 --> 00:44:11.641
If this doesn't go away,

00:44:11.782 --> 00:44:13.342
are you still a business in five years?

00:44:15.083 --> 00:44:15.724
Probably not.

00:44:16.164 --> 00:44:17.186
Now we know what we're dealing with.

00:44:20.467 --> 00:44:21.869
Is this like tourniquet,

00:44:22.030 --> 00:44:23.231
go to the emergency room?

00:44:23.331 --> 00:44:25.932
Or is this like gauze and stay off

00:44:25.952 --> 00:44:26.672
it for a few days?

00:44:26.793 --> 00:44:28.675
I like asking it in healthcare terms.

00:44:29.014 --> 00:44:31.217
But maybe you're explaining a lot.

00:44:32.065 --> 00:44:33.465
You're asking, what did you say?

00:44:33.485 --> 00:44:34.885
Look at it directionally?

00:44:34.905 --> 00:44:36.547
Just look at it directionally, right?

00:44:36.567 --> 00:44:38.027
You're asking a healthcare person to look

00:44:38.047 --> 00:44:39.788
at something directionally.

00:44:39.867 --> 00:44:41.469
And we're very cause and effect.

00:44:41.509 --> 00:44:42.108
And I know that.

00:44:42.208 --> 00:44:44.130
And yet everything depends in physical

00:44:44.150 --> 00:44:44.449
therapy.

00:44:44.469 --> 00:44:45.411
We love that go-to.

00:44:46.030 --> 00:44:46.570
So I'll be like,

00:44:46.610 --> 00:44:48.052
maybe I should open up a marketing agency

00:44:48.072 --> 00:44:49.413
called It Depends Marketing.

00:44:49.432 --> 00:44:50.032
Right.

00:44:50.393 --> 00:44:51.032
Depends on what?

00:44:51.452 --> 00:44:52.313
A lot of things.

00:44:52.798 --> 00:44:54.260
And that's where a lot of the friction

00:44:54.480 --> 00:44:58.702
and hard relationships come from is it's

00:44:59.204 --> 00:45:00.744
maybe because you were asking health care

00:45:00.764 --> 00:45:01.744
people to look at it that way,

00:45:01.784 --> 00:45:03.567
but also we're asking PE

00:45:04.297 --> 00:45:06.059
like investors to look at it that way.

00:45:06.119 --> 00:45:08.681
And CFOs who like, are like, well, no,

00:45:08.740 --> 00:45:09.561
these two numbers,

00:45:09.722 --> 00:45:10.782
if I add these together,

00:45:10.802 --> 00:45:12.123
it's going to equal this thing and this

00:45:12.164 --> 00:45:13.105
is what's going to happen.

00:45:13.144 --> 00:45:16.608
And so it's not a good answer.

00:45:16.648 --> 00:45:18.148
And that's not to say we can't attribute

00:45:18.168 --> 00:45:18.568
things,

00:45:18.688 --> 00:45:20.371
but I think we can't attribute all of

00:45:20.391 --> 00:45:20.710
the things.

00:45:20.731 --> 00:45:21.451
Like we should know,

00:45:21.851 --> 00:45:23.032
like we should know what our cost is

00:45:23.932 --> 00:45:25.393
to acquire a customer is we should know

00:45:25.414 --> 00:45:26.673
what their lifetime value is.

00:45:26.693 --> 00:45:28.315
Like we absolutely should know what the

00:45:28.335 --> 00:45:29.855
lifetime value of a customer is because

00:45:29.894 --> 00:45:30.335
that's when,

00:45:30.355 --> 00:45:31.335
when we're talking about budget,

00:45:31.396 --> 00:45:31.795
I go like,

00:45:31.815 --> 00:45:32.795
what is it worth to you?

00:45:33.195 --> 00:45:35.277
If I acquire one customer for you,

00:45:36.016 --> 00:45:36.677
what is it worth?

00:45:37.257 --> 00:45:39.498
I remember staffing agencies,

00:45:40.539 --> 00:45:42.579
travel therapy and staffing agencies.

00:45:43.659 --> 00:45:44.900
I'll get one of them back on as

00:45:44.920 --> 00:45:47.541
a sponsor, but they were, I'm like, I,

00:45:47.621 --> 00:45:49.641
you know, I had,

00:45:49.702 --> 00:45:50.782
I wanted to learn their industry.

00:45:50.822 --> 00:45:51.802
So I took them out to dinner and

00:45:51.822 --> 00:45:51.842
I,

00:45:52.728 --> 00:45:53.648
got a bunch of drinks in them.

00:45:53.668 --> 00:45:55.429
And I go, what's one contract worth?

00:45:55.510 --> 00:45:56.210
And then they told me,

00:45:56.230 --> 00:45:56.670
and I was like, oh,

00:45:56.710 --> 00:45:57.791
my price just changed.

00:45:58.672 --> 00:46:00.112
And someone was like, that's not,

00:46:00.672 --> 00:46:01.413
that's not okay.

00:46:01.512 --> 00:46:03.114
And I go, that is one thousand percent.

00:46:03.173 --> 00:46:03.454
Okay.

00:46:04.175 --> 00:46:06.657
Me getting you one thing would lead.

00:46:06.717 --> 00:46:08.498
And I don't know if it's right,

00:46:08.518 --> 00:46:09.898
but they were like fifteen grand.

00:46:09.938 --> 00:46:11.699
We get fifteen grand for every fish we

00:46:11.739 --> 00:46:12.039
catch.

00:46:13.021 --> 00:46:13.561
And I'm like, well,

00:46:13.581 --> 00:46:15.202
then I'm charging you five grand a month

00:46:15.402 --> 00:46:15.981
for a year.

00:46:16.563 --> 00:46:19.505
You don't think you're going to get five

00:46:19.545 --> 00:46:21.146
fish from being heard?

00:46:22.375 --> 00:46:25.697
and seen several hundred thousand times on

00:46:25.737 --> 00:46:26.436
this podcast,

00:46:26.597 --> 00:46:30.579
then you don't understand how math works.

00:46:30.599 --> 00:46:32.179
How many times do you have to touch

00:46:32.199 --> 00:46:34.561
someone to make them get on the phone?

00:46:34.820 --> 00:46:35.981
How many phone calls do you need to

00:46:36.001 --> 00:46:37.061
close one contract?

00:46:37.362 --> 00:46:38.302
If you don't know those numbers,

00:46:38.862 --> 00:46:39.882
I don't want to talk to you because

00:46:40.184 --> 00:46:41.983
then no matter what story I tell you,

00:46:42.425 --> 00:46:45.686
you can't see the rabbit trail.

00:46:46.146 --> 00:46:47.166
But if you do know those numbers,

00:46:47.226 --> 00:46:47.766
I go, well,

00:46:47.827 --> 00:46:49.128
if I show it to a hundred people,

00:46:50.068 --> 00:46:51.568
will one get a call?

00:46:51.608 --> 00:46:51.728
Yeah.

00:46:52.693 --> 00:46:52.813
Great.

00:46:52.853 --> 00:46:53.894
How many calls do you need to close?

00:46:54.215 --> 00:46:54.956
That's two degrees.

00:46:55.715 --> 00:46:56.277
Hear about it.

00:46:57.438 --> 00:46:57.978
Think about it.

00:46:58.157 --> 00:46:58.557
Feel it.

00:46:58.679 --> 00:46:59.079
Got it.

00:46:59.980 --> 00:47:00.579
Book a call.

00:47:00.699 --> 00:47:01.780
Call to close.

00:47:02.121 --> 00:47:03.121
For fifteen grand?

00:47:04.523 --> 00:47:05.083
What's that worth?

00:47:05.103 --> 00:47:06.505
Not free.

00:47:06.684 --> 00:47:07.244
Not free.

00:47:11.306 --> 00:47:12.447
What are you seeing out in the world

00:47:12.467 --> 00:47:14.009
right now that excites you in marketing

00:47:14.028 --> 00:47:15.190
and healthcare and all the things that

00:47:15.210 --> 00:47:15.570
you're doing?

00:47:16.030 --> 00:47:16.831
Oh, so many things.

00:47:16.990 --> 00:47:19.112
I mean, optimistic.

00:47:19.632 --> 00:47:22.434
So I think like all of this chat

00:47:22.534 --> 00:47:26.217
around AI stuff, like I was not...

00:47:27.077 --> 00:47:28.938
an early adopter of AI because I was

00:47:28.998 --> 00:47:30.280
sort of like, no,

00:47:30.340 --> 00:47:31.561
I think if you're adopting it now,

00:47:31.581 --> 00:47:32.242
you're still early.

00:47:32.302 --> 00:47:33.623
I think most people aren't doing it.

00:47:34.003 --> 00:47:35.324
It's like, I,

00:47:35.344 --> 00:47:36.985
but I was very much like I was

00:47:37.045 --> 00:47:39.268
in house at the time as a leader.

00:47:39.347 --> 00:47:40.148
And I was just like,

00:47:40.608 --> 00:47:41.849
we have to honor the craft.

00:47:41.909 --> 00:47:43.952
Like we're copywriters and we're creatives

00:47:43.992 --> 00:47:45.512
and like, we can't do this, you know?

00:47:46.173 --> 00:47:46.333
Um,

00:47:46.434 --> 00:47:47.954
and I still don't use it to like

00:47:48.135 --> 00:47:49.836
generate a lot of content.

00:47:49.916 --> 00:47:50.538
I use it as a

00:47:51.789 --> 00:47:53.510
partner for a lot of things.

00:47:53.530 --> 00:47:55.231
And I do use it operationally and I

00:47:55.271 --> 00:47:56.052
use it for analytics.

00:47:56.932 --> 00:47:59.255
But it's exciting in healthcare for the

00:47:59.295 --> 00:48:00.775
reasons we sort of talked about is I

00:48:00.815 --> 00:48:04.039
think it is this interesting turning point

00:48:04.079 --> 00:48:05.800
for patients and their behaviors.

00:48:05.840 --> 00:48:07.822
Like people are frustrated.

00:48:07.942 --> 00:48:09.443
They want to feel empowered.

00:48:09.523 --> 00:48:10.804
They want to get answers.

00:48:11.425 --> 00:48:12.585
We have a lot of issues it's not

00:48:12.606 --> 00:48:13.286
going to solve,

00:48:13.346 --> 00:48:17.128
but I think it is amazing for healthcare

00:48:17.148 --> 00:48:18.891
consumers to have this at their

00:48:18.911 --> 00:48:19.891
fingertips.

00:48:19.911 --> 00:48:20.411
Agreed.

00:48:21.400 --> 00:48:22.201
Yeah.

00:48:22.380 --> 00:48:23.521
How it's going to play out.

00:48:23.762 --> 00:48:26.204
We will be laughing at how clueless we

00:48:26.244 --> 00:48:28.284
are now.

00:48:28.344 --> 00:48:28.605
Yes.

00:48:28.706 --> 00:48:30.487
Two years from now when someone starts

00:48:30.527 --> 00:48:32.889
doing it.

00:48:34.210 --> 00:48:35.150
I've met with some groups,

00:48:35.289 --> 00:48:36.530
large practices.

00:48:36.690 --> 00:48:39.012
So consumer facing, business to consumer.

00:48:40.293 --> 00:48:42.735
But their biggest problems when I get down

00:48:42.795 --> 00:48:44.516
to it, and I know this,

00:48:44.938 --> 00:48:45.277
but I'm like,

00:48:45.318 --> 00:48:46.358
where are you in the journey?

00:48:46.778 --> 00:48:47.619
And they're like, hiring.

00:48:48.429 --> 00:48:49.951
And I'm like, share screen.

00:48:49.990 --> 00:48:51.532
I don't come with slide decks anymore.

00:48:52.291 --> 00:48:52.592
Nope.

00:48:53.193 --> 00:48:53.853
You are giving,

00:48:54.014 --> 00:48:57.695
you are telegraphing what is important or

00:48:58.056 --> 00:48:59.237
you're telling me what's important and

00:48:59.257 --> 00:49:00.557
you're showing me something else.

00:49:00.577 --> 00:49:01.777
And I just go incongruity.

00:49:02.599 --> 00:49:02.898
So I go,

00:49:02.958 --> 00:49:04.920
let's go look at your last ten LinkedIn

00:49:04.960 --> 00:49:05.221
posts.

00:49:05.260 --> 00:49:06.260
Let's look at your YouTube.

00:49:06.320 --> 00:49:07.561
What are you telling the world?

00:49:08.121 --> 00:49:08.902
We need to hire.

00:49:09.422 --> 00:49:11.043
Why are you showing me random,

00:49:11.143 --> 00:49:14.005
poorly produced rotator cuff exercises

00:49:14.326 --> 00:49:16.588
that get thirty eight views on YouTube?

00:49:17.420 --> 00:49:18.780
when you need to hire clinicians?

00:49:20.081 --> 00:49:20.422
Not.

00:49:21.021 --> 00:49:22.461
So then show me the different ways.

00:49:22.782 --> 00:49:24.242
I got one group and I asked them

00:49:24.262 --> 00:49:24.922
for information.

00:49:24.983 --> 00:49:25.222
I was like,

00:49:25.242 --> 00:49:26.083
can you show me your last...

00:49:26.443 --> 00:49:27.983
You tell me email is the best way

00:49:28.003 --> 00:49:29.523
you gain customers.

00:49:29.603 --> 00:49:30.483
Somewhere in the world,

00:49:30.543 --> 00:49:31.804
they sign up for a webinar,

00:49:32.023 --> 00:49:33.103
they click on a thing,

00:49:33.123 --> 00:49:34.945
they ask for a PDF, a lead magnet,

00:49:35.184 --> 00:49:35.985
and you say email.

00:49:36.025 --> 00:49:38.346
And I go, can I see those emails?

00:49:38.385 --> 00:49:39.226
And they're like, no.

00:49:39.485 --> 00:49:40.445
And I'm like, then I can't.

00:49:41.911 --> 00:49:43.213
That's like being like my knee hurts and

00:49:43.273 --> 00:49:44.476
I can't, but I'm not going to,

00:49:44.496 --> 00:49:45.898
I'm not going to bring the knee with

00:49:45.958 --> 00:49:46.679
me to the appointment.

00:49:46.699 --> 00:49:49.161
Oh, okay.

00:49:49.181 --> 00:49:49.623
I don't know.

00:49:50.103 --> 00:49:51.244
It could be bleeding.

00:49:51.405 --> 00:49:54.590
Like you're telling me you do email.

00:49:54.650 --> 00:49:54.929
I did it.

00:49:55.090 --> 00:49:56.211
I did an interview the other day,

00:49:56.291 --> 00:49:57.132
a couple of weeks,

00:49:57.172 --> 00:49:58.474
a week or two ago with somebody.

00:49:59.615 --> 00:50:00.777
And this was about policy.

00:50:01.597 --> 00:50:02.237
This guy was like,

00:50:02.378 --> 00:50:03.938
we are going to do emails.

00:50:04.358 --> 00:50:06.460
We're doing... We are doing this better.

00:50:07.001 --> 00:50:07.661
We are Coke.

00:50:07.681 --> 00:50:08.442
They are Pepsi.

00:50:08.561 --> 00:50:10.023
We are doing it better than Pepsi.

00:50:10.083 --> 00:50:10.862
And I'm like, awesome.

00:50:11.182 --> 00:50:11.483
How?

00:50:11.503 --> 00:50:11.983
And they're like,

00:50:12.523 --> 00:50:13.505
we're going to send emails.

00:50:13.625 --> 00:50:14.706
And I was like, okay.

00:50:15.106 --> 00:50:17.166
The other group is also sending emails.

00:50:17.608 --> 00:50:18.668
Are you going to send them to better

00:50:18.708 --> 00:50:20.108
people more often?

00:50:20.389 --> 00:50:21.550
Are they going to be written better?

00:50:21.989 --> 00:50:23.992
And they were like, I don't really know.

00:50:24.032 --> 00:50:24.831
And they didn't have an answer.

00:50:24.891 --> 00:50:25.672
And Lily was like,

00:50:25.833 --> 00:50:27.454
I think I get a moment of like,

00:50:29.161 --> 00:50:30.202
wanted to hold up a mirror i'm like

00:50:30.222 --> 00:50:31.423
are you just gonna write all of yours

00:50:31.463 --> 00:50:33.266
in capital letter like how are you gonna

00:50:33.286 --> 00:50:34.708
be different are you just gonna go caps

00:50:34.748 --> 00:50:37.409
lock on me that's your differentiating

00:50:37.469 --> 00:50:42.155
factor good luck but these are the stupid

00:50:42.195 --> 00:50:43.657
things that andrea and i have in our

00:50:43.677 --> 00:50:45.838
brains when someone's like we should just

00:50:46.298 --> 00:50:47.740
we should do an email campaign and i

00:50:47.760 --> 00:50:50.704
go great to whom for what how

00:50:52.153 --> 00:50:54.356
And they're like, I said, did you, Jimmy,

00:50:54.376 --> 00:50:55.056
I said email.

00:50:55.257 --> 00:50:55.677
And I was like, yes.

00:50:55.697 --> 00:50:58.398
Jimmy, just send the email.

00:50:58.438 --> 00:50:59.059
Thank you.

00:50:59.719 --> 00:51:00.740
I'm going to send one right now.

00:51:00.920 --> 00:51:03.663
Do you care what's in it?

00:51:03.682 --> 00:51:05.244
There was a billboard campaign and I'm

00:51:05.264 --> 00:51:06.045
going to screw up the name,

00:51:06.065 --> 00:51:07.126
but it doesn't matter.

00:51:07.146 --> 00:51:10.688
I love campaigns like this.

00:51:10.829 --> 00:51:12.610
Did you ever see like somebody designed an

00:51:12.731 --> 00:51:15.552
ad and it was clearly done in Microsoft

00:51:15.632 --> 00:51:15.992
paint?

00:51:16.514 --> 00:51:16.614
Yes.

00:51:17.253 --> 00:51:19.152
And it said, our graphic designer quit.

00:51:19.434 --> 00:51:19.914
Do you know anyone?

00:51:19.974 --> 00:51:21.353
And I was like, and it was so,

00:51:21.373 --> 00:51:22.253
it was like written.

00:51:22.833 --> 00:51:24.795
And I'm like, that's an ad, people.

00:51:25.554 --> 00:51:26.434
That's an ad.

00:51:26.735 --> 00:51:28.715
Well, this guy did, it was for the,

00:51:28.815 --> 00:51:29.635
I mean, something,

00:51:29.735 --> 00:51:32.175
I love great marketing in boring sectors.

00:51:32.777 --> 00:51:34.016
When someone really,

00:51:34.277 --> 00:51:36.237
really is like understands the assignment.

00:51:36.597 --> 00:51:37.418
So this was for,

00:51:37.458 --> 00:51:38.378
and I might screw it up,

00:51:38.697 --> 00:51:42.039
like New Mexico or a town in New

00:51:42.079 --> 00:51:43.099
Mexico's tourism.

00:51:44.867 --> 00:51:46.469
And instead of saying like, just,

00:51:46.668 --> 00:51:46.929
all right,

00:51:47.048 --> 00:51:48.610
spend ten grand on a photographer,

00:51:48.731 --> 00:51:50.012
go get us some landscapes,

00:51:50.052 --> 00:51:51.634
get us some amazing photos,

00:51:51.653 --> 00:51:52.695
because we're going to put them on

00:51:52.715 --> 00:51:53.135
billboards.

00:51:53.396 --> 00:51:55.077
They decided billboard was the angle

00:51:55.217 --> 00:51:56.159
because it wanted to be local.

00:51:56.478 --> 00:51:58.501
And I like when the world goes digital,

00:51:58.800 --> 00:51:59.422
go analog.

00:51:59.541 --> 00:52:00.903
And when the world starts going analog,

00:52:01.264 --> 00:52:02.065
go digital, right?

00:52:02.105 --> 00:52:02.965
Just be ahead of the curve.

00:52:03.827 --> 00:52:05.909
These were analog billboard ads.

00:52:07.528 --> 00:52:11.630
And they were like sort of hand homemade.

00:52:12.231 --> 00:52:14.072
And it was this dude who sort of

00:52:14.092 --> 00:52:14.672
looked dorky.

00:52:15.432 --> 00:52:16.452
Like he was excited to be in front

00:52:16.472 --> 00:52:16.974
of the camera.

00:52:17.393 --> 00:52:20.474
And he was like, hey, I'm Jimmy,

00:52:20.695 --> 00:52:21.516
forty three years old.

00:52:22.516 --> 00:52:23.376
I just moved to the area.

00:52:23.396 --> 00:52:24.876
Are you looking for a kayak buddy?

00:52:24.978 --> 00:52:26.557
And it was like new to Santa Fe

00:52:26.597 --> 00:52:29.099
dot com.

00:52:29.199 --> 00:52:30.900
Hey, I'm Jimmy, like him hiking.

00:52:31.079 --> 00:52:32.161
Like, hey, I'm Jimmy.

00:52:32.780 --> 00:52:34.101
I'm looking for a hiking buddy.

00:52:34.302 --> 00:52:34.521
Like,

00:52:34.681 --> 00:52:36.063
I just want I'm new to the area.

00:52:37.202 --> 00:52:39.764
new to santafe.com and it was i don't

00:52:39.784 --> 00:52:42.425
know it was all about promoting all the

00:52:42.465 --> 00:52:43.867
things that are going on that you might

00:52:43.887 --> 00:52:46.228
not know about if you're new to the

00:52:46.309 --> 00:52:48.952
area and it was mind-numbingly brilliant

00:52:48.972 --> 00:52:51.673
so good it's in its simplicity and i

00:52:51.813 --> 00:52:53.795
love crap like that i just love it

00:52:54.175 --> 00:52:55.978
because more ai ads

00:52:57.210 --> 00:52:57.789
Oh my God.

00:52:57.949 --> 00:52:59.951
I saw one group that I worked with

00:53:00.331 --> 00:53:01.311
running AI ads.

00:53:01.911 --> 00:53:03.733
I watched it three times because I was

00:53:03.753 --> 00:53:07.554
like, I don't know who this is for.

00:53:07.614 --> 00:53:09.376
Maybe their brilliance is that I had to

00:53:09.436 --> 00:53:10.617
watch it because I'm dumbfounded,

00:53:10.637 --> 00:53:12.016
but the average person ain't watching it

00:53:12.036 --> 00:53:12.237
like me.

00:53:12.257 --> 00:53:14.838
You gave them three views.

00:53:14.958 --> 00:53:15.278
Yeah,

00:53:15.298 --> 00:53:16.478
I gave them three views because I'm like,

00:53:16.659 --> 00:53:18.019
my man, you need it.

00:53:18.059 --> 00:53:18.981
But also it's an ad,

00:53:19.021 --> 00:53:21.101
so you just paid three times.

00:53:21.121 --> 00:53:21.961
It's not those vanity metrics, right?

00:53:21.981 --> 00:53:25.304
Jimmy watched the ad three times because

00:53:25.324 --> 00:53:26.023
it was so awful.

00:53:26.387 --> 00:53:27.007
Must be great.

00:53:27.608 --> 00:53:28.449
Actually, it was shit.

00:53:28.469 --> 00:53:29.548
Well, that's the angle, right?

00:53:29.568 --> 00:53:31.630
Like from the Howard Stern private parts

00:53:31.670 --> 00:53:33.791
movie, we have data.

00:53:33.831 --> 00:53:35.670
The average Howard Stern fan listens for

00:53:35.751 --> 00:53:36.291
four hours.

00:53:36.311 --> 00:53:37.231
The guy's like, that's great.

00:53:37.251 --> 00:53:37.512
It goes,

00:53:37.572 --> 00:53:39.492
the average Howard Stern hater listens for

00:53:39.652 --> 00:53:40.353
six hours.

00:53:40.373 --> 00:53:41.233
It's like, what?

00:53:41.532 --> 00:53:42.813
He understood the assignment.

00:53:44.737 --> 00:53:46.378
The assignment was being provocative and

00:53:46.418 --> 00:53:50.159
get people to listen, not say WNBC,

00:53:50.179 --> 00:53:51.719
not say the call letters right.

00:53:51.780 --> 00:53:53.460
That wasn't the assignment.

00:53:53.501 --> 00:53:54.882
When everybody in the world is going for

00:53:54.942 --> 00:53:56.661
perfection, go for imperfection.

00:53:57.001 --> 00:53:57.983
When everybody catches up,

00:53:58.202 --> 00:53:58.862
go the other way.

00:53:59.043 --> 00:53:59.402
Zig,

00:54:00.023 --> 00:54:00.684
have you ever heard of

00:54:00.844 --> 00:54:02.423
IHatesStevenSinger.com?

00:54:02.884 --> 00:54:03.985
Yes.

00:54:04.045 --> 00:54:05.844
Brilliant ad campaign in Philly.

00:54:05.864 --> 00:54:06.686
The first time I saw it,

00:54:06.706 --> 00:54:08.005
I was like, what's this crap?

00:54:08.085 --> 00:54:09.166
And then, of course, what did I do?

00:54:09.387 --> 00:54:10.086
Went to the website.

00:54:11.929 --> 00:54:12.509
Needed to.

00:54:12.949 --> 00:54:14.150
It was an itch I needed to scratch.

00:54:14.170 --> 00:54:14.489
All right.

00:54:15.090 --> 00:54:15.670
Parting shots.

00:54:15.690 --> 00:54:16.530
What do you got for today?

00:54:16.750 --> 00:54:17.490
Mic drop moment.

00:54:17.570 --> 00:54:19.110
This was pretty much Jimmy coming in hot

00:54:19.130 --> 00:54:19.650
on a Monday.

00:54:20.170 --> 00:54:22.172
I already talked about AI.

00:54:23.532 --> 00:54:25.092
What can I say that we just talked

00:54:25.132 --> 00:54:25.413
about?

00:54:25.492 --> 00:54:26.873
Don't send an email just to send an

00:54:26.932 --> 00:54:27.333
email.

00:54:27.974 --> 00:54:31.255
Oh, say that again.

00:54:32.014 --> 00:54:34.516
Don't send an email just to send an

00:54:34.675 --> 00:54:34.976
email.

00:54:36.398 --> 00:54:36.597
Yeah.

00:54:36.978 --> 00:54:38.818
So my parting shot will piggyback on that.

00:54:39.300 --> 00:54:42.041
I annoy people in meetings because I just

00:54:42.061 --> 00:54:45.043
go, I act like a petulant five-year-old.

00:54:45.143 --> 00:54:45.742
I just go, why?

00:54:46.563 --> 00:54:46.824
Why?

00:54:47.344 --> 00:54:47.603
Why?

00:54:48.063 --> 00:54:48.324
Why?

00:54:48.585 --> 00:54:49.625
And if you can't tell me,

00:54:49.885 --> 00:54:50.846
it's a dumb idea.

00:54:51.326 --> 00:54:53.166
Or we get to the real reason.

00:54:53.487 --> 00:54:54.507
And then when we get to the real

00:54:54.547 --> 00:54:55.007
reason, I go,

00:54:55.748 --> 00:54:57.809
is the email the best way to do

00:54:57.849 --> 00:54:58.030
that?

00:54:58.150 --> 00:55:00.391
And then, oh, listen,

00:55:00.990 --> 00:55:01.911
marketing is a skill.

00:55:03.518 --> 00:55:05.039
And you said it right because people

00:55:05.079 --> 00:55:06.280
consume so much of it.

00:55:06.659 --> 00:55:08.581
Hey, how hard could it be?

00:55:09.601 --> 00:55:11.342
How hard could it be?

00:55:11.742 --> 00:55:12.802
Look, you do some things,

00:55:12.822 --> 00:55:14.704
you put money behind it and then money

00:55:14.724 --> 00:55:15.264
shows up.

00:55:15.644 --> 00:55:16.625
How hard could it be?

00:55:17.525 --> 00:55:18.005
Not hard.

00:55:18.706 --> 00:55:20.266
I'll do the CFO thing for a month.

00:55:20.367 --> 00:55:22.168
You do this and we'll see which one

00:55:22.208 --> 00:55:22.869
of us screws up.

00:55:24.385 --> 00:55:26.628
me all right uh find andrea on linkedin

00:55:26.648 --> 00:55:28.548
i'll put you uh put the the link

00:55:28.568 --> 00:55:30.271
in the show notes and then we'll talk

00:55:30.331 --> 00:55:31.911
next week i'll be more prepared i just

00:55:31.952 --> 00:55:33.213
woke up late it's cold here in the

00:55:33.233 --> 00:55:34.454
northeast i think it's chilly but i think

00:55:34.474 --> 00:55:37.637
this one's good and remember kids

00:55:38.317 --> 00:55:38.617
marketing

00:55:40.019 --> 00:55:41.121
That's it for this one,

00:55:41.380 --> 00:55:43.061
but we're just getting warmed up.

00:55:43.521 --> 00:55:45.422
Smash follow, send it to a friend,

00:55:45.643 --> 00:55:47.304
or crank up the next episode.

00:55:47.824 --> 00:55:48.766
Want to go deeper?

00:55:49.186 --> 00:55:53.228
Hit us at pgpinecast.com or find us on

00:55:53.268 --> 00:55:55.829
YouTube and socials at pgpinecast.

00:55:56.250 --> 00:55:58.532
And legally, none of this was advice.

00:55:58.592 --> 00:56:00.432
It's for entertainment purposes only.

00:56:02.014 --> 00:56:02.574
See, Keith?

00:56:02.793 --> 00:56:03.875
We read the script.

00:56:04.155 --> 00:56:04.815
Happy now?