State Boards Are Coming for PT Packages

WEBVTT

00:00:00.963 --> 00:00:02.504
And we are live.

00:00:02.544 --> 00:00:04.386
Dave Kittle, Tony Meritato,

00:00:04.426 --> 00:00:06.729
Jimmy McKay is MIA.

00:00:08.169 --> 00:00:14.996
So Dave, what an exciting turn of events.

00:00:15.496 --> 00:00:17.978
I didn't see this on my radar anywhere.

00:00:19.420 --> 00:00:22.742
Then I started seeing pop-ups on social

00:00:22.783 --> 00:00:25.004
media and then I got messages from a

00:00:25.085 --> 00:00:26.385
couple people last night.

00:00:27.367 --> 00:00:29.849
Have you been following any of the stuff

00:00:29.888 --> 00:00:32.149
coming out of North Carolina and Texas

00:00:32.270 --> 00:00:35.512
related to cash-based self-pay direct pay

00:00:35.551 --> 00:00:41.316
PTs not being allowed legally to sell

00:00:41.536 --> 00:00:43.758
packages to potential clients,

00:00:43.838 --> 00:00:45.198
discounted packages,

00:00:45.238 --> 00:00:47.380
ten visit session packages,

00:00:47.539 --> 00:00:48.220
anything like that?

00:00:50.182 --> 00:00:50.362
Yeah,

00:00:50.381 --> 00:00:52.023
I just caught that a little bit yesterday

00:00:52.042 --> 00:00:52.643
or last night.

00:00:53.624 --> 00:00:54.625
I don't know where it's coming from.

00:00:54.865 --> 00:00:55.865
I know that we're going to get into

00:00:55.926 --> 00:00:55.985
it.

00:00:57.073 --> 00:01:01.835
um initially it sounds ridiculous and uh

00:01:01.954 --> 00:01:04.396
i'm curious and also i don't know a

00:01:04.415 --> 00:01:06.417
couple initial initial comments is like

00:01:07.016 --> 00:01:08.677
there's so many other providers doing this

00:01:08.837 --> 00:01:12.058
you know uh all the injectors and all

00:01:12.078 --> 00:01:15.500
the medical spas and chiropractors and

00:01:15.579 --> 00:01:18.081
someone commented in that post um dentists

00:01:18.361 --> 00:01:20.242
someone paid for a full year dentistry up

00:01:20.262 --> 00:01:22.822
front or something someone said uh so

00:01:22.921 --> 00:01:24.263
that's odd like

00:01:24.709 --> 00:01:25.831
It's allowed everywhere else.

00:01:25.911 --> 00:01:27.152
And how is that any different than all

00:01:27.171 --> 00:01:29.334
the concierge physicians that allow you to

00:01:29.373 --> 00:01:33.138
pay or have a recurring yearly or monthly

00:01:33.197 --> 00:01:35.439
subscription or membership to the

00:01:35.480 --> 00:01:36.281
concierge practice?

00:01:36.561 --> 00:01:38.802
I think it's all kind of the same.

00:01:39.243 --> 00:01:40.844
So I don't understand where is this coming

00:01:40.885 --> 00:01:41.626
from and why,

00:01:41.665 --> 00:01:43.548
but maybe you have some answers or maybe

00:01:43.727 --> 00:01:44.789
I'm sure you have some thoughts on it.

00:01:45.313 --> 00:01:48.694
yeah so i've been researching um looking

00:01:48.775 --> 00:01:50.695
at the original statements that were put

00:01:50.855 --> 00:01:54.798
out and both both state boards pt boards

00:01:54.837 --> 00:01:56.519
are kind of approaching this a little bit

00:01:56.558 --> 00:01:59.600
differently one is basically saying hey

00:01:59.641 --> 00:02:02.561
you cannot collect payment from a patient

00:02:03.001 --> 00:02:05.384
for services that have not been delivered

00:02:06.084 --> 00:02:07.846
You can only collect, you know,

00:02:07.865 --> 00:02:09.546
within a reasonable timeframe.

00:02:10.007 --> 00:02:12.269
So like if Dave, you're my patient,

00:02:12.288 --> 00:02:13.449
you book an appointment,

00:02:13.550 --> 00:02:15.671
I tell you it's a hundred dollar deposit.

00:02:16.492 --> 00:02:17.114
I can do that,

00:02:17.674 --> 00:02:20.717
but I can't charge you and collect if,

00:02:21.016 --> 00:02:21.336
you know,

00:02:21.377 --> 00:02:24.098
there's six visits that are being sold and

00:02:24.159 --> 00:02:25.741
I haven't delivered those visits.

00:02:26.401 --> 00:02:26.542
So,

00:02:26.681 --> 00:02:28.622
so one state is approaching it like that.

00:02:29.424 --> 00:02:31.725
One state is approaching it saying, okay,

00:02:32.646 --> 00:02:35.687
You cannot incentivize patients or put

00:02:35.728 --> 00:02:38.770
patients into a position where they feel

00:02:38.849 --> 00:02:39.610
compelled.

00:02:39.651 --> 00:02:40.770
Well, I bought six.

00:02:40.911 --> 00:02:42.051
I only use three.

00:02:42.932 --> 00:02:43.872
What am I going to do with the

00:02:43.913 --> 00:02:44.513
other three?

00:02:44.552 --> 00:02:46.955
They're not offering me a refund.

00:02:47.055 --> 00:02:48.395
And it goes back to, I mean,

00:02:48.915 --> 00:02:51.356
the theory behind it is patient

00:02:51.396 --> 00:02:53.399
protection, consumer protection.

00:02:54.587 --> 00:02:56.348
But within that protection,

00:02:56.367 --> 00:02:57.709
you give up independence,

00:02:57.729 --> 00:02:58.788
you give up autonomy.

00:02:58.829 --> 00:03:00.649
And the people that are trying to protect

00:03:00.848 --> 00:03:02.349
the client, the consumer,

00:03:02.870 --> 00:03:05.169
are not freaking business people.

00:03:05.691 --> 00:03:07.570
They're not approaching this with the

00:03:07.610 --> 00:03:09.831
mindset of a business and how a business

00:03:09.912 --> 00:03:12.551
operates and how a business does things to

00:03:12.632 --> 00:03:14.092
benefit the consumer,

00:03:14.832 --> 00:03:16.812
but they perceive it as something that's

00:03:16.832 --> 00:03:17.712
taking advantage.

00:03:17.913 --> 00:03:19.713
And I think you see it pretty clearly

00:03:19.894 --> 00:03:20.074
as

00:03:20.774 --> 00:03:23.195
The regulators are approaching it as

00:03:23.676 --> 00:03:25.959
you're the bad guy because you're making a

00:03:25.998 --> 00:03:26.579
profit.

00:03:26.680 --> 00:03:27.760
You're running a business.

00:03:27.841 --> 00:03:30.502
We need to protect the vulnerable consumer

00:03:31.003 --> 00:03:33.605
against all the unethical business people

00:03:33.626 --> 00:03:35.747
that are out there.

00:03:35.788 --> 00:03:36.528
So that being said,

00:03:36.568 --> 00:03:37.610
a couple of things that you mentioned.

00:03:38.604 --> 00:03:42.426
like concierge physicians memberships

00:03:42.907 --> 00:03:46.149
these kind of are categorized differently

00:03:46.229 --> 00:03:49.611
so technically the consumer could buy a

00:03:49.692 --> 00:03:51.592
membership they could buy access they

00:03:51.612 --> 00:03:54.835
could do retainers under under I think

00:03:54.854 --> 00:03:58.217
it's under Texas and that's what you're

00:03:58.258 --> 00:04:02.341
describing so the real problem isn't

00:04:03.080 --> 00:04:06.603
a ninety nine dollar a month retainer or

00:04:06.802 --> 00:04:09.424
a six thousand dollar a year you know

00:04:09.764 --> 00:04:13.866
access to the provider the real problem is

00:04:14.887 --> 00:04:16.987
uh jimmy's saying he's coming on but i

00:04:17.088 --> 00:04:19.269
haven't seen him yet the real problem is

00:04:19.730 --> 00:04:23.490
you can't sell the physical therapy visit

00:04:23.971 --> 00:04:26.213
and that is important the visit

00:04:26.937 --> 00:04:30.560
at a discounted rate in a future calendar,

00:04:32.300 --> 00:04:34.423
because that's where they're saying it's

00:04:34.483 --> 00:04:36.824
either like a kickback.

00:04:37.464 --> 00:04:39.627
And I don't remember which state was

00:04:40.127 --> 00:04:42.908
implying that you're getting a kickback by

00:04:43.089 --> 00:04:46.471
reducing what the client is actually

00:04:46.531 --> 00:04:46.872
paying.

00:04:47.512 --> 00:04:49.555
But I think it's a language problem.

00:04:50.334 --> 00:04:51.716
So you jump in.

00:04:51.776 --> 00:04:53.437
Tell me kind of what you're thinking

00:04:54.418 --> 00:04:55.259
before we keep going.

00:04:56.411 --> 00:04:58.692
I had messaged you guys earlier today or

00:04:58.733 --> 00:05:00.134
yesterday, whenever you mentioned it.

00:05:01.074 --> 00:05:02.175
Where do you think this is coming from?

00:05:02.235 --> 00:05:05.077
Is this coming from consumer complaints of

00:05:05.117 --> 00:05:08.620
people who were pitched these self-pay

00:05:08.639 --> 00:05:11.742
packages and they got upset because their

00:05:11.783 --> 00:05:12.663
expectations were,

00:05:13.704 --> 00:05:15.225
I would just pay whatever your rate is

00:05:15.384 --> 00:05:18.107
at the time of service because that's just

00:05:18.187 --> 00:05:18.788
the way that

00:05:19.627 --> 00:05:22.790
any person had had used physical therapy,

00:05:23.290 --> 00:05:24.531
if it's out of pocket before,

00:05:24.672 --> 00:05:26.853
or they associate, hey, I went for ten,

00:05:26.892 --> 00:05:27.374
twenty years,

00:05:27.473 --> 00:05:29.154
I went and paid a twenty dollar copay,

00:05:29.175 --> 00:05:30.016
fifty dollar copay.

00:05:30.375 --> 00:05:31.576
And even if you're out of pocket,

00:05:32.156 --> 00:05:33.338
let's say they called some other cash

00:05:33.377 --> 00:05:34.499
practice all of a sudden because they're

00:05:34.538 --> 00:05:36.579
changing where they went or where they

00:05:36.639 --> 00:05:37.321
moved or whatever.

00:05:37.781 --> 00:05:38.762
Now they call my practice,

00:05:38.781 --> 00:05:41.184
they call another practice and they hear

00:05:41.223 --> 00:05:41.944
that, you know,

00:05:42.064 --> 00:05:43.045
there's an evaluation rate.

00:05:43.064 --> 00:05:43.766
And then after that,

00:05:44.726 --> 00:05:47.048
a lot of these practices are presenting a

00:05:47.387 --> 00:05:50.428
package rate or a program or whatever.

00:05:50.569 --> 00:05:51.689
And it's basically what you described,

00:05:51.709 --> 00:05:53.529
which is some reduce.

00:05:53.949 --> 00:05:54.930
And this is in the future.

00:05:54.949 --> 00:05:55.449
This is by the way,

00:05:55.470 --> 00:05:56.790
this is not always like the best approach,

00:05:56.810 --> 00:05:58.990
but this is what a lot of physical

00:05:59.011 --> 00:05:59.632
therapists are doing,

00:05:59.672 --> 00:06:01.492
which is that like exactly what you said,

00:06:01.531 --> 00:06:05.713
Tony, pitching a six visit, twelve visit,

00:06:05.733 --> 00:06:08.314
whatever package where it's a discounted

00:06:09.355 --> 00:06:12.776
discounted offer off the traditional visit

00:06:12.815 --> 00:06:13.915
rate or the hourly rate.

00:06:14.697 --> 00:06:17.800
Um, but any thoughts,

00:06:17.920 --> 00:06:19.980
is there any commentary anywhere on where

00:06:20.000 --> 00:06:20.521
this is coming from?

00:06:20.601 --> 00:06:22.322
Is it coming from also insurance companies

00:06:22.343 --> 00:06:23.663
or hospitals or they're so big and they

00:06:23.684 --> 00:06:24.384
don't really care?

00:06:24.685 --> 00:06:26.125
Is this a hundred percent coming from

00:06:26.565 --> 00:06:29.749
consumers complaining and like,

00:06:29.809 --> 00:06:30.970
I don't know, like, uh, the,

00:06:31.129 --> 00:06:32.310
the better business Bureau and that,

00:06:32.370 --> 00:06:34.732
that type of stuff complaining and that's

00:06:34.752 --> 00:06:36.793
enough momentum for some bill to be

00:06:36.834 --> 00:06:37.894
drafted publicly.

00:06:37.935 --> 00:06:38.696
Like, is that it?

00:06:38.735 --> 00:06:39.196
Like, cause that's,

00:06:39.375 --> 00:06:40.317
that doesn't even make sense.

00:06:40.336 --> 00:06:40.536
Yeah.

00:06:41.000 --> 00:06:44.545
Before Jimmy chimes in, yeah,

00:06:44.625 --> 00:06:46.107
that's what everybody's asking.

00:06:46.187 --> 00:06:46.367
Like,

00:06:46.548 --> 00:06:48.651
why are these boards putting out these

00:06:48.711 --> 00:06:51.855
statements without any context behind,

00:06:52.334 --> 00:06:53.396
like nothing's changed.

00:06:54.197 --> 00:06:56.399
Their interpretation of these laws and

00:06:56.439 --> 00:06:58.041
rules have been there forever.

00:06:58.141 --> 00:06:59.824
Why all of a sudden is this coming?

00:07:00.345 --> 00:07:01.726
Somebody I talked to last night,

00:07:01.906 --> 00:07:03.709
he didn't tell me to mention his name,

00:07:03.728 --> 00:07:04.750
so I'm not going to mention it.

00:07:05.290 --> 00:07:05.872
But, you know,

00:07:05.911 --> 00:07:08.134
he said probably a consumer complained

00:07:08.154 --> 00:07:09.677
that they bought a package of ten,

00:07:09.716 --> 00:07:11.538
they use six and now they can't get

00:07:11.738 --> 00:07:13.562
a refund on the four they didn't use.

00:07:14.242 --> 00:07:14.963
We have no idea.

00:07:15.711 --> 00:07:17.233
But if you're a board and you're going

00:07:17.252 --> 00:07:18.353
to put out a statement,

00:07:18.593 --> 00:07:22.137
which clearly like there's tons of cash

00:07:22.156 --> 00:07:23.098
based practices,

00:07:23.137 --> 00:07:25.779
direct pay practices doing this.

00:07:26.281 --> 00:07:28.482
How do you not say, hey,

00:07:28.562 --> 00:07:29.764
because of this,

00:07:29.863 --> 00:07:32.365
we want to clarify the interpretation of

00:07:32.406 --> 00:07:32.946
the laws.

00:07:33.045 --> 00:07:35.588
We understand it as the governing body.

00:07:36.149 --> 00:07:37.170
This is what's allowed.

00:07:37.290 --> 00:07:38.411
This is what's not allowed.

00:07:39.031 --> 00:07:39.872
They didn't do any of that.

00:07:40.252 --> 00:07:41.533
They just came out and they were like,

00:07:41.673 --> 00:07:42.754
hey, you can't do this.

00:07:42.834 --> 00:07:44.394
This is why we say you can't do

00:07:44.535 --> 00:07:44.634
it.

00:07:45.076 --> 00:07:47.737
No context behind why this is happening.

00:07:48.177 --> 00:07:51.800
Jimmy, what you got for us?

00:07:51.920 --> 00:07:52.540
I can't hear him.

00:07:52.661 --> 00:07:52.980
Can you?

00:07:54.242 --> 00:07:55.322
Immuted or something.

00:07:56.084 --> 00:07:56.704
Check the mic.

00:07:57.004 --> 00:07:57.605
The mic man.

00:07:57.884 --> 00:07:58.345
The mic man.

00:07:58.384 --> 00:08:00.507
Check the mic.

00:08:00.607 --> 00:08:01.247
I'm just jumping in.

00:08:01.266 --> 00:08:01.807
I'm trying to figure out.

00:08:01.827 --> 00:08:02.127
We got it.

00:08:02.148 --> 00:08:02.709
There we go.

00:08:02.869 --> 00:08:03.829
I missed it.

00:08:03.848 --> 00:08:04.269
What did I miss?

00:08:05.177 --> 00:08:06.458
Okay, so real quick,

00:08:06.637 --> 00:08:09.579
North Carolina and Texas physical therapy

00:08:09.658 --> 00:08:10.220
board,

00:08:10.279 --> 00:08:12.821
basically association board came out and

00:08:12.880 --> 00:08:15.521
said a little bit different,

00:08:15.581 --> 00:08:17.502
different perspectives on both states,

00:08:17.543 --> 00:08:20.365
but both of them basically said cash-based

00:08:20.404 --> 00:08:25.187
PTs, direct pay PTs cannot accept a,

00:08:25.387 --> 00:08:26.427
cannot sell packages.

00:08:27.127 --> 00:08:29.093
You can't say my normal rates,

00:08:29.112 --> 00:08:29.975
two hundred dollars.

00:08:30.677 --> 00:08:33.263
I'm going to sell you ten sessions for,

00:08:33.443 --> 00:08:33.865
you know,

00:08:34.807 --> 00:08:36.210
one thousand five hundred dollars.

00:08:37.317 --> 00:08:37.517
One,

00:08:37.756 --> 00:08:39.398
and I don't remember which was the state,

00:08:39.437 --> 00:08:42.220
but one state basically interpreted as

00:08:42.639 --> 00:08:44.301
you're giving a five hundred dollar

00:08:44.380 --> 00:08:45.000
discount,

00:08:45.081 --> 00:08:47.602
which is a kickback to the patient for

00:08:47.682 --> 00:08:49.082
buying the package.

00:08:49.644 --> 00:08:50.964
That is against the law.

00:08:51.485 --> 00:08:54.186
The other state basically said you can't

00:08:54.245 --> 00:08:56.527
accept payment for services that have not

00:08:56.567 --> 00:08:57.268
been delivered.

00:08:58.041 --> 00:09:02.403
So you cannot accept payment for services.

00:09:02.423 --> 00:09:03.023
So ridiculous.

00:09:03.222 --> 00:09:04.264
Now, who was this again?

00:09:04.283 --> 00:09:07.325
Was this APTA state chapters or boards?

00:09:07.345 --> 00:09:08.385
Because those are different.

00:09:08.785 --> 00:09:09.806
I was seeing boards.

00:09:10.506 --> 00:09:12.126
Yeah, so boards are different.

00:09:12.267 --> 00:09:13.827
I would need someone much smarter than me

00:09:13.847 --> 00:09:14.508
to clarify.

00:09:14.567 --> 00:09:16.229
But boards are different because they're

00:09:16.389 --> 00:09:17.370
state boards.

00:09:18.311 --> 00:09:20.091
Yeah, versus an association, I guess.

00:09:20.192 --> 00:09:20.471
Again,

00:09:21.052 --> 00:09:22.273
professional associations are where

00:09:22.332 --> 00:09:23.494
professionals associate,

00:09:23.994 --> 00:09:26.216
but they're not a governing body like they

00:09:26.235 --> 00:09:27.417
don't make the rule.

00:09:27.517 --> 00:09:27.777
They don't.

00:09:28.850 --> 00:09:30.272
create laws or enforce laws.

00:09:30.413 --> 00:09:32.735
A state board though, and again, please,

00:09:32.774 --> 00:09:34.336
this is what comment sections are for.

00:09:34.355 --> 00:09:35.618
I don't think I ever need to remind

00:09:35.638 --> 00:09:36.578
someone to correct me.

00:09:37.019 --> 00:09:38.139
People love doing it, it's a sport.

00:09:38.440 --> 00:09:38.941
But correct me,

00:09:39.000 --> 00:09:40.942
I believe the state board is related to

00:09:40.962 --> 00:09:41.442
an agency.

00:09:41.482 --> 00:09:42.784
So if it's a state board,

00:09:43.445 --> 00:09:46.567
that could lead to a change as far

00:09:46.607 --> 00:09:47.068
as I know.

00:09:47.668 --> 00:09:49.951
An APTA chapter is just a bunch of

00:09:49.991 --> 00:09:52.073
people who think that this should be a

00:09:52.134 --> 00:09:52.354
thing.

00:09:53.297 --> 00:09:55.437
Okay, so it came out, North Carolina, May,

00:09:55.477 --> 00:09:57.618
two thousand twenty six publication by the

00:09:57.677 --> 00:09:59.839
North Carolina Board of Physical Therapy

00:09:59.899 --> 00:10:00.719
Examiners.

00:10:01.139 --> 00:10:01.859
That's it.

00:10:01.999 --> 00:10:03.119
And then in Texas,

00:10:03.198 --> 00:10:05.179
it was the Texas Board of Physical Therapy

00:10:05.220 --> 00:10:05.840
Examiners.

00:10:05.860 --> 00:10:08.120
Their newsletter communique described the

00:10:08.181 --> 00:10:10.301
board's position on this.

00:10:11.140 --> 00:10:11.740
And by the way,

00:10:12.741 --> 00:10:14.581
there's sweet southern boys down there in

00:10:14.621 --> 00:10:15.022
Texas,

00:10:15.101 --> 00:10:16.822
like like I thought they're all about free

00:10:16.942 --> 00:10:17.442
business.

00:10:17.743 --> 00:10:18.462
What's up with that, man?

00:10:19.385 --> 00:10:20.326
Well, that's the problem.

00:10:20.405 --> 00:10:22.226
The culture of the state.

00:10:22.307 --> 00:10:24.067
You're encroaching on my profit margin.

00:10:24.746 --> 00:10:27.528
The culture of the state is pro-business.

00:10:27.707 --> 00:10:29.707
I believe the culture of the board.

00:10:29.768 --> 00:10:31.928
And selling packages is pro-business.

00:10:32.408 --> 00:10:32.908
It's unbelievable.

00:10:32.928 --> 00:10:35.090
The board and then the association is not

00:10:35.149 --> 00:10:37.490
necessarily representative of the culture

00:10:37.529 --> 00:10:38.090
of the state.

00:10:38.770 --> 00:10:39.770
Well, in general,

00:10:39.910 --> 00:10:41.510
it should and typically does, no?

00:10:42.150 --> 00:10:43.331
It should, yes.

00:10:43.392 --> 00:10:44.851
All the things that both of you just

00:10:44.871 --> 00:10:45.552
said are correct.

00:10:46.532 --> 00:10:48.212
It should, it just might not.

00:10:49.443 --> 00:10:50.664
Um, wow.

00:10:51.086 --> 00:10:52.846
I did not hear about this until I

00:10:52.966 --> 00:10:53.628
breaking news.

00:10:53.668 --> 00:10:55.048
I like, we need a breaking news banner.

00:10:55.068 --> 00:10:56.190
I, I want to,

00:10:56.429 --> 00:10:57.691
I just want to go immediately.

00:10:57.711 --> 00:10:58.692
Like if this was in the state of

00:10:58.711 --> 00:11:01.394
New York, I'm sure you guys know.

00:11:01.474 --> 00:11:01.714
Yes.

00:11:02.195 --> 00:11:05.057
I, I, yes, I would, I would,

00:11:05.297 --> 00:11:06.217
I have, I have two,

00:11:06.378 --> 00:11:08.840
I have two in the holster as two

00:11:08.940 --> 00:11:09.581
approaches.

00:11:10.461 --> 00:11:11.522
One would be, so there, there's,

00:11:11.542 --> 00:11:12.322
there's some, um,

00:11:13.011 --> 00:11:13.652
There's a physical,

00:11:13.672 --> 00:11:14.673
I forget the guy's name,

00:11:14.692 --> 00:11:15.552
Demetri something.

00:11:16.033 --> 00:11:17.033
He's a practice owner in the New York

00:11:17.053 --> 00:11:17.514
city area.

00:11:17.594 --> 00:11:20.014
And he spoke to some lawyer about some

00:11:20.054 --> 00:11:21.796
class action lawsuit because of the out of

00:11:21.816 --> 00:11:22.897
network billing that we do.

00:11:23.437 --> 00:11:25.498
And he has a bunch of data over

00:11:25.518 --> 00:11:28.099
the years of the insurance company is kind

00:11:28.139 --> 00:11:30.721
of like nickel and diming the out of

00:11:30.740 --> 00:11:31.461
pay practices,

00:11:31.961 --> 00:11:34.522
the out of network practices that build

00:11:34.581 --> 00:11:35.883
the out of network insurance and how much

00:11:35.903 --> 00:11:36.562
they pay when,

00:11:36.863 --> 00:11:37.783
when there's like a specific

00:11:38.725 --> 00:11:40.086
allowed amount or whatever,

00:11:40.126 --> 00:11:41.467
like the percentage of the co-insurance,

00:11:41.488 --> 00:11:42.768
whatever that they're supposed to pay.

00:11:43.008 --> 00:11:43.528
Long story short,

00:11:43.729 --> 00:11:45.750
he has a lawyer and he's trying to

00:11:45.789 --> 00:11:47.230
gather other physical parity practice

00:11:47.291 --> 00:11:48.811
owners that, that, that,

00:11:48.850 --> 00:11:50.371
that build out of network insurance.

00:11:51.673 --> 00:11:53.153
So that would be one thing I,

00:11:53.193 --> 00:11:54.114
my initial thing would be,

00:11:54.794 --> 00:11:57.115
is there some attorney out there in the

00:11:57.135 --> 00:11:58.537
state of New York or New York city

00:11:58.697 --> 00:12:00.857
that would want to spearhead this, uh,

00:12:01.177 --> 00:12:01.498
and get it,

00:12:01.597 --> 00:12:03.119
get his or her name out there?

00:12:03.999 --> 00:12:04.899
Um, because

00:12:06.152 --> 00:12:08.673
would want someone that's uh you know

00:12:08.715 --> 00:12:10.035
strong-willed and someone who's

00:12:10.076 --> 00:12:12.878
experienced and confident to immediately

00:12:12.937 --> 00:12:15.301
fight this um that would be one thing

00:12:15.441 --> 00:12:17.162
a second thing and i did i did

00:12:17.182 --> 00:12:18.823
want to drop this while tony was here

00:12:18.844 --> 00:12:21.166
but he stepped away a second thing would

00:12:21.186 --> 00:12:23.028
be let's just say if um he's back

00:12:23.865 --> 00:12:25.708
Another thing I would even consider

00:12:25.729 --> 00:12:27.792
because I've seen the value of the

00:12:27.831 --> 00:12:28.253
packages.

00:12:28.273 --> 00:12:29.534
What I mean by that is I've seen

00:12:29.554 --> 00:12:32.840
the value of every single person except

00:12:32.860 --> 00:12:35.163
for one person in our practice because of

00:12:35.203 --> 00:12:35.965
like medical issues.

00:12:36.004 --> 00:12:37.346
But every single person that buys a

00:12:37.386 --> 00:12:38.889
package completes a package.

00:12:40.708 --> 00:12:42.370
if they, if they don't complete a package,

00:12:42.389 --> 00:12:44.850
they absolutely, our rules are, uh,

00:12:44.890 --> 00:12:45.552
you could share them.

00:12:45.611 --> 00:12:46.652
You could, you could give, you know,

00:12:46.692 --> 00:12:46.893
you could,

00:12:47.113 --> 00:12:49.153
you could gift the visits to your family

00:12:49.173 --> 00:12:50.153
members, your friends, whatever,

00:12:50.173 --> 00:12:52.196
which obviously we would do because they,

00:12:52.316 --> 00:12:53.596
and that per that new person would still

00:12:53.615 --> 00:12:54.856
get an initial evaluation.

00:12:54.876 --> 00:12:55.817
We'd have to screen them and all that

00:12:55.837 --> 00:12:56.418
and then treat them.

00:12:57.197 --> 00:12:57.398
Um,

00:12:57.418 --> 00:12:58.839
but we do have that option instead of

00:12:58.879 --> 00:13:01.019
like, they just don't go, uh, they don't,

00:13:01.541 --> 00:13:02.360
uh, they're not used.

00:13:03.361 --> 00:13:05.182
I've seen the value of packages in terms

00:13:05.263 --> 00:13:05.342
of

00:13:06.975 --> 00:13:07.796
more accountability.

00:13:08.056 --> 00:13:09.376
Someone who pays up front has more skin

00:13:09.397 --> 00:13:09.817
in the game.

00:13:10.418 --> 00:13:11.759
They have a significantly higher

00:13:11.778 --> 00:13:14.400
likelihood of getting to their result or

00:13:14.421 --> 00:13:16.042
achieving progress and results,

00:13:16.142 --> 00:13:17.201
whatever the things that they are that

00:13:17.462 --> 00:13:18.163
they want to get back to.

00:13:19.244 --> 00:13:21.024
And then also on the business side of

00:13:21.365 --> 00:13:22.586
more cash flow up front,

00:13:22.745 --> 00:13:25.908
which then we can deploy faster to paid

00:13:25.947 --> 00:13:27.509
marketing or other channels or other

00:13:27.589 --> 00:13:27.870
tests.

00:13:27.889 --> 00:13:28.409
Like when I did

00:13:29.056 --> 00:13:31.317
know the multiple thousand dollars of the

00:13:31.797 --> 00:13:33.277
mailers that i that i sent out or

00:13:33.336 --> 00:13:35.317
any other marketing test like that where

00:13:35.337 --> 00:13:37.139
i'm putting money by the way putting money

00:13:37.178 --> 00:13:39.658
back into the local economy uh for

00:13:39.698 --> 00:13:42.539
marketing purposes um i've seen the value

00:13:42.559 --> 00:13:44.880
of these packages for the patient and for

00:13:44.900 --> 00:13:48.261
the business and so if this were we

00:13:48.282 --> 00:13:50.462
woke up today in new york now said

00:13:50.482 --> 00:13:52.602
that this is like a an approved law

00:13:52.623 --> 00:13:55.543
it's coming i guarantee wait i got i

00:13:56.024 --> 00:13:57.424
i i would

00:13:58.417 --> 00:13:59.739
strongly, strongly,

00:13:59.818 --> 00:14:01.780
strongly consider getting rid of my

00:14:01.821 --> 00:14:04.605
license or having my therapist get rid of

00:14:04.625 --> 00:14:05.245
their licenses.

00:14:06.590 --> 00:14:08.912
right there's the tony look at that uh

00:14:09.052 --> 00:14:11.934
hey dave right now there's four all right

00:14:11.955 --> 00:14:14.417
so let's go back what are they apta

00:14:14.456 --> 00:14:16.519
i was right is a professional association

00:14:16.678 --> 00:14:17.500
if you ever want to be on their

00:14:17.539 --> 00:14:19.321
board you run for it you vote people

00:14:19.341 --> 00:14:20.722
get on there it is a professional

00:14:20.743 --> 00:14:21.943
association it's where professionals

00:14:21.964 --> 00:14:25.586
associate state boards are in fact a

00:14:25.687 --> 00:14:28.369
government regulatory body in new york

00:14:29.250 --> 00:14:31.030
It's state appointed board members and

00:14:31.150 --> 00:14:31.971
state government.

00:14:31.991 --> 00:14:33.211
You don't actually join it.

00:14:33.552 --> 00:14:34.673
So like where APTA,

00:14:34.793 --> 00:14:36.413
the job is represent advance the

00:14:36.433 --> 00:14:36.933
profession,

00:14:37.335 --> 00:14:39.115
the state board is protect the public.

00:14:39.894 --> 00:14:40.816
with a license, right?

00:14:40.836 --> 00:14:41.576
This is why Dave's like,

00:14:41.596 --> 00:14:42.316
I'll give her my license.

00:14:42.395 --> 00:14:43.256
Then you can't write it.

00:14:43.277 --> 00:14:45.859
I absolutely would consider that.

00:14:45.979 --> 00:14:48.039
Or Dave, me and you, buddy,

00:14:48.159 --> 00:14:48.980
we're both in New York.

00:14:49.240 --> 00:14:51.802
There are four open positions right now.

00:14:51.861 --> 00:14:53.523
We could go get on the board.

00:14:53.883 --> 00:14:56.083
Oh, should we take over the board?

00:14:56.164 --> 00:14:56.865
On the board.

00:14:57.504 --> 00:15:00.267
So this is- Hostile takeover.

00:15:00.326 --> 00:15:01.567
Hostile takeover.

00:15:02.519 --> 00:15:04.740
But this is the kind of diversity that

00:15:04.780 --> 00:15:06.120
I would get behind in a heartbeat.

00:15:06.181 --> 00:15:08.562
Give me diversity of ideas of information.

00:15:08.662 --> 00:15:12.263
Put Dave's business brain alongside some

00:15:12.602 --> 00:15:16.384
liberal socialist emotional component.

00:15:16.844 --> 00:15:18.524
Let the two of them battle it out

00:15:18.544 --> 00:15:19.985
and let's find something in the middle.

00:15:20.004 --> 00:15:21.326
Let's find some middle ground here.

00:15:22.046 --> 00:15:24.307
I understand the concern on the other

00:15:24.347 --> 00:15:26.389
side, but like Dave said,

00:15:26.890 --> 00:15:28.211
we want the commitment.

00:15:28.251 --> 00:15:29.253
We want the buy-in.

00:15:29.293 --> 00:15:30.594
It improves the outcome.

00:15:30.654 --> 00:15:32.135
It makes for a better patient care

00:15:32.176 --> 00:15:32.797
experience.

00:15:32.817 --> 00:15:33.937
All right.

00:15:34.057 --> 00:15:36.539
Let's play not devil's advocate.

00:15:36.620 --> 00:15:38.261
Let's play why is this a thing?

00:15:38.341 --> 00:15:39.383
Let's play a little game called why is

00:15:39.403 --> 00:15:39.844
this a thing?

00:15:39.864 --> 00:15:41.926
Go ahead.

00:15:42.206 --> 00:15:44.227
It's a different payment model and some of

00:15:44.248 --> 00:15:45.729
the people that got offended.

00:15:47.162 --> 00:15:48.322
are saying that they don't have the two

00:15:48.363 --> 00:15:49.243
thousand, three thousand,

00:15:49.283 --> 00:15:50.764
four thousand dollars up front to pay for

00:15:50.783 --> 00:15:50.943
this.

00:15:50.984 --> 00:15:52.404
So it's not for everyone.

00:15:52.625 --> 00:15:54.826
That is the that's the that's got to

00:15:54.846 --> 00:15:55.567
be the root reason.

00:15:55.586 --> 00:15:58.068
Like because people call around and

00:15:58.089 --> 00:15:59.950
they're calling for physical therapy and

00:15:59.990 --> 00:16:02.851
enough people have gotten they said, yeah,

00:16:02.912 --> 00:16:03.732
yeah, it's two hundred,

00:16:03.753 --> 00:16:04.812
three hundred whatever dollars for the

00:16:04.832 --> 00:16:05.293
first visit.

00:16:05.634 --> 00:16:06.614
And then and then the people on the

00:16:06.634 --> 00:16:08.254
phone say, well, well, after that,

00:16:08.274 --> 00:16:08.755
how much is it?

00:16:08.796 --> 00:16:10.677
Is it also two hundred or two fifty

00:16:10.697 --> 00:16:11.557
or three fifty or whatever?

00:16:12.197 --> 00:16:13.217
And like, well, yeah, it is.

00:16:13.479 --> 00:16:13.639
Or

00:16:15.017 --> 00:16:16.138
We have packages, you know,

00:16:16.158 --> 00:16:17.619
like the discounted packages or whatever.

00:16:19.379 --> 00:16:20.120
That's, I guess,

00:16:20.160 --> 00:16:21.802
where enough consumers have heard that and

00:16:21.841 --> 00:16:23.982
reported it and written or submitted

00:16:24.043 --> 00:16:25.904
complaints to their state or whatever.

00:16:25.965 --> 00:16:26.524
It's got to be that.

00:16:27.166 --> 00:16:28.726
Who would benefit the most of this

00:16:28.746 --> 00:16:32.249
happening?

00:16:32.269 --> 00:16:34.091
Patients think that they would benefit the

00:16:34.130 --> 00:16:34.410
most.

00:16:35.171 --> 00:16:35.892
Who benefits?

00:16:37.610 --> 00:16:39.352
If all the cash people can't do it,

00:16:39.393 --> 00:16:40.173
who benefits?

00:16:41.153 --> 00:16:41.754
All the in-network.

00:16:42.755 --> 00:16:43.336
Not even them.

00:16:43.676 --> 00:16:44.297
Hospitals.

00:16:44.537 --> 00:16:47.220
Right?

00:16:47.980 --> 00:16:50.403
If it's A and B, right?

00:16:50.442 --> 00:16:52.323
There's very few Daves and lots of

00:16:52.384 --> 00:16:52.904
in-network.

00:16:53.184 --> 00:16:54.546
And then you eliminate this.

00:16:54.907 --> 00:16:55.746
Dave goes, well,

00:16:55.767 --> 00:16:57.969
I either need to go in-network or go

00:16:57.969 --> 00:16:59.791
– let's call it not ditching a license.

00:16:59.811 --> 00:17:00.432
Let's call it, Dave.

00:17:00.451 --> 00:17:01.793
Let's call it going rogue.

00:17:02.950 --> 00:17:03.970
Dave goes rogue.

00:17:04.171 --> 00:17:05.590
He's like, I'm not PT anymore, though.

00:17:05.691 --> 00:17:07.132
I have the education of a PT,

00:17:07.432 --> 00:17:08.791
but I can do whatever I want.

00:17:09.333 --> 00:17:12.693
No rules.

00:17:12.993 --> 00:17:14.755
I don't necessarily agree with that.

00:17:14.835 --> 00:17:17.056
I think who benefits are the elected

00:17:17.076 --> 00:17:19.135
officials that are on the board because

00:17:19.155 --> 00:17:19.997
they can come out.

00:17:20.076 --> 00:17:21.416
They can come out and say, look,

00:17:21.777 --> 00:17:22.738
we passed this.

00:17:23.157 --> 00:17:25.679
We clarified this consumer protection.

00:17:26.159 --> 00:17:27.900
We're looking out for you.

00:17:28.503 --> 00:17:31.028
I don't think the insurance care is one

00:17:31.169 --> 00:17:31.609
iota.

00:17:31.630 --> 00:17:32.872
It doesn't matter to them.

00:17:33.633 --> 00:17:35.496
I don't think- Although they would

00:17:35.516 --> 00:17:36.017
benefit, but yes.

00:17:37.420 --> 00:17:39.022
I don't think hospitals and in-network

00:17:39.063 --> 00:17:41.247
providers care one bit either.

00:17:42.213 --> 00:17:45.355
I think who ultimately comes out is the

00:17:45.435 --> 00:17:47.257
regulators are going to regulate.

00:17:47.356 --> 00:17:49.076
I wanted to get that Warren G clip

00:17:49.096 --> 00:17:49.938
when we opened the show,

00:17:49.958 --> 00:17:51.499
but I didn't have time to get it.

00:17:52.298 --> 00:17:52.979
But seriously,

00:17:53.479 --> 00:17:55.240
they're the ones who look like the heroes

00:17:55.760 --> 00:17:58.741
to the poor oppressed consumer who's being

00:17:58.781 --> 00:18:00.103
taken advantage of.

00:18:00.843 --> 00:18:04.204
There is nothing of value in bringing this

00:18:04.404 --> 00:18:07.586
up now, now out of all the time,

00:18:07.685 --> 00:18:09.926
other than there was probably, likely,

00:18:09.967 --> 00:18:10.887
this is an assumption,

00:18:11.960 --> 00:18:14.221
complaint that came in and they were like

00:18:14.521 --> 00:18:17.443
yes rockstar this is my chance to shine

00:18:17.824 --> 00:18:19.125
this is why i was put in this

00:18:19.164 --> 00:18:21.146
position but i think those people like

00:18:21.166 --> 00:18:22.647
this is not a full-time position for the

00:18:22.688 --> 00:18:24.909
board this is like a this is something

00:18:24.929 --> 00:18:26.529
you do i think it's like you know

00:18:26.549 --> 00:18:28.311
i'm gonna we might we might have to

00:18:28.352 --> 00:18:29.833
find out we might have to pirate this

00:18:29.873 --> 00:18:30.093
board

00:18:32.423 --> 00:18:32.682
Right?

00:18:32.722 --> 00:18:33.144
Take it up.

00:18:33.163 --> 00:18:34.585
Like, if you don't like it, change it.

00:18:34.965 --> 00:18:35.445
I mean,

00:18:35.465 --> 00:18:37.627
I think boards like this agree with that,

00:18:37.667 --> 00:18:40.490
too, whether they want to change the rule.

00:18:41.092 --> 00:18:42.492
But that is the pitch, right?

00:18:42.512 --> 00:18:43.374
I mean, people are like, well,

00:18:43.493 --> 00:18:46.277
APTA needs to have more business owners on

00:18:46.297 --> 00:18:46.718
the board.

00:18:46.758 --> 00:18:48.358
Then APTA turns and goes, well,

00:18:48.720 --> 00:18:50.662
nobody really ran from a business because

00:18:51.041 --> 00:18:53.144
they're, for whatever reasons, like, hey,

00:18:53.304 --> 00:18:54.125
come do that.

00:18:55.346 --> 00:18:57.027
And then people finger wagging,

00:18:57.267 --> 00:18:58.988
you put more business owners on your board

00:18:59.028 --> 00:19:00.930
like we need people with experience who

00:19:00.950 --> 00:19:03.191
get voted in to run for that position.

00:19:03.451 --> 00:19:04.172
But a state board,

00:19:04.192 --> 00:19:05.172
you put yourself forward.

00:19:05.211 --> 00:19:05.932
Apparently, I got that.

00:19:06.053 --> 00:19:07.113
I got the website, Dave.

00:19:07.153 --> 00:19:07.794
I see you do it.

00:19:08.673 --> 00:19:11.516
Let's let's let's go deeper into this

00:19:11.536 --> 00:19:12.096
maybe next time.

00:19:12.135 --> 00:19:15.397
But there's there's there's another way.

00:19:15.878 --> 00:19:16.818
There's another way around this.

00:19:17.259 --> 00:19:18.099
I think let me look.

00:19:18.746 --> 00:19:19.026
All right.

00:19:19.066 --> 00:19:21.087
So there's some practices that I know.

00:19:21.147 --> 00:19:21.788
I won't mention names,

00:19:21.827 --> 00:19:24.711
but they're good cash practices or

00:19:24.830 --> 00:19:25.770
excellent cash practices.

00:19:27.192 --> 00:19:29.513
One approach is they will run a ton

00:19:29.534 --> 00:19:33.317
of Facebook ads with the evaluation being

00:19:33.376 --> 00:19:34.337
ninety seven dollars.

00:19:35.979 --> 00:19:36.839
Then you go,

00:19:36.859 --> 00:19:38.401
you pay ninety seven probably the day

00:19:38.441 --> 00:19:40.242
before or whatever, whatever you show up,

00:19:40.343 --> 00:19:41.743
you pay ninety seven dollars.

00:19:41.763 --> 00:19:43.085
Everything is very clear and transparent

00:19:43.424 --> 00:19:44.465
at the end of that evaluation.

00:19:45.166 --> 00:19:46.788
Then they're going to present to you a

00:19:48.123 --> 00:19:49.284
not just a package, but it's a,

00:19:49.304 --> 00:19:51.585
like a time-based program, uh, to,

00:19:51.765 --> 00:19:53.986
to overcome or fix whatever your issue is.

00:19:54.066 --> 00:19:54.946
And sometimes it could be.

00:19:55.527 --> 00:19:56.747
Twelve weeks or whatever.

00:19:56.827 --> 00:19:57.607
And it's twelve visits,

00:19:57.748 --> 00:19:58.387
twenty-four visits.

00:19:58.407 --> 00:19:59.048
Doesn't really matter.

00:19:59.929 --> 00:20:01.109
Um, but it's going to be,

00:20:01.769 --> 00:20:02.170
let's just say,

00:20:02.230 --> 00:20:03.730
three thousand dollars or four thousand

00:20:03.770 --> 00:20:04.571
dollars or whatever.

00:20:04.731 --> 00:20:07.772
So it might come out to two fifty

00:20:07.833 --> 00:20:09.233
to three fifty per visit.

00:20:09.846 --> 00:20:10.887
for whatever that package is.

00:20:11.229 --> 00:20:12.509
So you're going from a smaller dollar

00:20:12.529 --> 00:20:13.892
amount on the first visit, a very,

00:20:13.971 --> 00:20:14.532
a very small,

00:20:14.712 --> 00:20:16.094
small dollar amount on the first visit on

00:20:16.174 --> 00:20:16.515
purpose.

00:20:16.535 --> 00:20:17.756
Cause it's coming from paid marketing.

00:20:17.776 --> 00:20:19.759
You're trying to get more eyeballs into

00:20:19.778 --> 00:20:19.919
the,

00:20:20.019 --> 00:20:21.401
like more people to go through the funnel.

00:20:22.682 --> 00:20:22.803
So,

00:20:22.823 --> 00:20:24.824
ninety seven dollars to get the person to

00:20:25.003 --> 00:20:28.084
like book and then actually arrive and

00:20:28.144 --> 00:20:29.924
have the evaluation to get impressed and

00:20:29.944 --> 00:20:30.704
get wowed and all that.

00:20:30.765 --> 00:20:32.505
Then the therapist will present to them a

00:20:32.545 --> 00:20:33.506
two thousand, three thousand,

00:20:33.526 --> 00:20:34.586
four thousand, five thousand,

00:20:34.605 --> 00:20:38.086
whatever dollar package to solve their

00:20:38.146 --> 00:20:38.467
issue.

00:20:38.826 --> 00:20:40.767
In-person visits, some digital stuff,

00:20:41.307 --> 00:20:42.688
app type stuff, maybe virtual visits,

00:20:42.708 --> 00:20:43.607
all that doesn't really matter.

00:20:44.567 --> 00:20:46.528
Then the visit rate on the follow visits

00:20:46.909 --> 00:20:47.368
are, let's say,

00:20:47.409 --> 00:20:48.769
two fifty to three fifty per visit.

00:20:49.670 --> 00:20:51.309
Would that still be would that still fly?

00:20:53.415 --> 00:20:54.876
That is not a discounted package.

00:20:57.678 --> 00:20:59.719
But the one state said you can't pay

00:20:59.759 --> 00:21:02.740
up front to, oh, I got Dr.

00:21:02.760 --> 00:21:04.041
Melanie Carminati's support.

00:21:04.082 --> 00:21:04.741
She's in New York.

00:21:04.781 --> 00:21:05.221
Let's go.

00:21:05.241 --> 00:21:08.544
And David.

00:21:08.604 --> 00:21:09.124
D-three.

00:21:09.505 --> 00:21:10.045
Like, do it.

00:21:10.444 --> 00:21:11.546
Actually, what were the two states?

00:21:11.625 --> 00:21:12.326
Texas and?

00:21:12.885 --> 00:21:13.646
North Carolina.

00:21:14.106 --> 00:21:16.488
That's where Dave is.

00:21:16.508 --> 00:21:18.890
What do you mean that's where David Rubin

00:21:18.930 --> 00:21:19.029
is?

00:21:19.049 --> 00:21:19.529
Yeah, yeah.

00:21:20.173 --> 00:21:22.394
So here's my this would be my

00:21:22.434 --> 00:21:23.234
interpretation.

00:21:24.835 --> 00:21:28.115
I don't think that model per se would

00:21:28.316 --> 00:21:30.516
would qualify for this, like you said,

00:21:30.556 --> 00:21:32.457
because in the one say you can't prepay

00:21:32.497 --> 00:21:34.176
for services that aren't delivered.

00:21:35.357 --> 00:21:37.857
I ran this through chat GPT and kind

00:21:37.897 --> 00:21:39.097
of played around with some different

00:21:39.198 --> 00:21:39.679
ideas.

00:21:40.199 --> 00:21:44.259
Texas specifically code chapter one one

00:21:44.299 --> 00:21:44.700
seven.

00:21:45.779 --> 00:21:47.902
a licensed healthcare practitioner,

00:21:47.942 --> 00:21:50.384
so this includes PTs, OTs, doctors,

00:21:51.064 --> 00:21:51.644
physicians,

00:21:52.685 --> 00:21:55.928
may enter into a direct pay care agreement

00:21:55.968 --> 00:22:00.231
charging a direct fee that expressly

00:22:00.291 --> 00:22:02.354
includes memberships, subscriptions,

00:22:02.413 --> 00:22:05.675
retainers, visit fee, episode of care fee.

00:22:06.396 --> 00:22:08.378
Basically, the AIs that I went through

00:22:09.317 --> 00:22:09.817
said, look,

00:22:10.318 --> 00:22:13.161
the real hang up here is either collecting

00:22:13.201 --> 00:22:14.882
money for individual visits at a

00:22:14.942 --> 00:22:17.124
discounted rate or collecting money for

00:22:17.183 --> 00:22:19.286
visits that have not been provided.

00:22:19.846 --> 00:22:21.287
So forget that.

00:22:21.366 --> 00:22:25.049
Just sell a six-week access membership.

00:22:25.510 --> 00:22:26.731
You, the professional,

00:22:26.751 --> 00:22:29.073
make the determination on how much

00:22:29.133 --> 00:22:30.795
services are delivered.

00:22:31.604 --> 00:22:32.924
But you don't pre-state,

00:22:33.265 --> 00:22:35.806
you get six visits for this rate.

00:22:36.086 --> 00:22:37.748
You say, look, you got a shoulder problem,

00:22:38.268 --> 00:22:39.328
adhesive capsulitis.

00:22:39.348 --> 00:22:40.489
We're going to take six weeks.

00:22:40.929 --> 00:22:43.730
We're going to put the plan together to

00:22:44.010 --> 00:22:47.573
help you over that six-week period.

00:22:47.653 --> 00:22:49.654
It might be a thirty-minute session.

00:22:49.674 --> 00:22:51.296
It might be a fifteen-minute manual.

00:22:51.316 --> 00:22:52.236
It might be an hour.

00:22:53.257 --> 00:22:54.938
You develop it as it goes.

00:22:55.790 --> 00:22:59.353
but there should be no problem selling a

00:22:59.432 --> 00:23:02.094
six-week program as long as you don't

00:23:02.134 --> 00:23:04.915
specifically state it includes six

00:23:05.215 --> 00:23:07.156
individual visits for an hour each.

00:23:07.676 --> 00:23:09.018
It's a six-week program.

00:23:10.406 --> 00:23:11.407
It just sucks.

00:23:11.428 --> 00:23:12.728
And there are practice owners that sell

00:23:12.748 --> 00:23:13.627
that exact thing, Tony.

00:23:13.667 --> 00:23:14.307
And they're like, hey,

00:23:14.628 --> 00:23:16.368
you could come in two or three times

00:23:16.388 --> 00:23:16.648
a week.

00:23:16.689 --> 00:23:17.509
You come in once a week.

00:23:17.548 --> 00:23:19.049
Maybe once a week you come in and

00:23:19.069 --> 00:23:20.430
then once a week we do a telehealth

00:23:20.470 --> 00:23:20.849
consult.

00:23:20.869 --> 00:23:22.770
Make sure, get your questions answered.

00:23:22.830 --> 00:23:23.830
Give you some accountability.

00:23:23.891 --> 00:23:25.092
You know, show me this exercise.

00:23:25.112 --> 00:23:25.852
Show me this thing.

00:23:26.172 --> 00:23:26.932
Let's review this.

00:23:26.971 --> 00:23:28.252
How is this other thing going?

00:23:29.032 --> 00:23:30.953
And it's about the whole program.

00:23:30.973 --> 00:23:32.534
It's not about individual visits.

00:23:32.574 --> 00:23:34.055
I love it.

00:23:34.075 --> 00:23:35.295
Jimmy, you were going to say something?

00:23:35.907 --> 00:23:37.150
It just sucks that we have to do

00:23:37.190 --> 00:23:37.911
the dance.

00:23:38.250 --> 00:23:38.892
Do you know what I mean?

00:23:39.011 --> 00:23:41.695
It just sucks that there's a dance.

00:23:44.219 --> 00:23:46.082
This is what it is in every business.

00:23:47.683 --> 00:23:49.105
You innovate the business.

00:23:49.695 --> 00:23:51.435
The regulators come in to shut it down

00:23:51.955 --> 00:23:53.656
and they're doing it out of the goodness

00:23:53.696 --> 00:23:54.396
of their heart.

00:23:55.037 --> 00:23:56.737
Then you regulate in a new direction.

00:23:56.757 --> 00:23:57.798
They come in to shut it down.

00:23:58.117 --> 00:24:00.397
Then this is the dance that goes on

00:24:00.458 --> 00:24:02.558
in every industry, every profession.

00:24:02.618 --> 00:24:05.019
It's not just health care, you know,

00:24:05.159 --> 00:24:07.839
and that's that's where we are.

00:24:09.220 --> 00:24:10.319
It's not a Rotary Cup problem.

00:24:10.559 --> 00:24:11.059
Those are those.

00:24:11.099 --> 00:24:14.421
Do you guys notice that typically on the

00:24:14.441 --> 00:24:16.020
show that there's a direct correlation

00:24:16.060 --> 00:24:18.021
between how riled up I get and then

00:24:18.142 --> 00:24:19.442
immediately the live comments?

00:24:20.143 --> 00:24:20.483
Yeah,

00:24:21.005 --> 00:24:22.707
we should have a meter like the Davo

00:24:22.748 --> 00:24:25.451
meter, like, you know, like green, yellow,

00:24:25.672 --> 00:24:27.015
red, red, red, red, red.

00:24:28.356 --> 00:24:30.721
So looking into it, if you wanted

00:24:33.160 --> 00:24:34.580
If you wanted to get on the board,

00:24:34.740 --> 00:24:36.582
you have to qualify as a professional

00:24:36.622 --> 00:24:36.981
member.

00:24:37.261 --> 00:24:38.422
Just need to be a New York State

00:24:38.481 --> 00:24:39.502
resident licensing.

00:24:39.542 --> 00:24:40.343
New York, New York,

00:24:40.383 --> 00:24:41.284
don't make me do it.

00:24:41.304 --> 00:24:43.825
Because whatever I do, I go all in.

00:24:43.964 --> 00:24:46.625
You complete the form on the link I

00:24:46.665 --> 00:24:46.965
have,

00:24:47.105 --> 00:24:48.986
which we could do in eleven seconds with

00:24:49.227 --> 00:24:49.567
ChatGPT.

00:24:50.446 --> 00:24:52.048
You send the application to the board.

00:24:52.167 --> 00:24:54.229
You include a short note explaining why

00:24:54.269 --> 00:24:55.150
you want to serve.

00:24:56.650 --> 00:24:58.131
And then the employment process happens on

00:24:58.151 --> 00:24:58.771
the state side.

00:24:59.231 --> 00:25:00.553
But right now they have four open

00:25:00.593 --> 00:25:01.192
positions.

00:25:01.512 --> 00:25:02.273
I don't know, man.

00:25:02.554 --> 00:25:07.215
Like, would this be a coup?

00:25:07.836 --> 00:25:09.897
We could be looking at a coup publicly

00:25:09.938 --> 00:25:10.258
stated.

00:25:12.599 --> 00:25:14.121
I wonder why we haven't seen that though,

00:25:14.161 --> 00:25:14.902
seriously.

00:25:15.781 --> 00:25:17.182
We've got Larry Benz,

00:25:17.202 --> 00:25:18.943
we've got all these great business guys

00:25:18.983 --> 00:25:21.205
that are out there that have proven track

00:25:21.266 --> 00:25:21.846
records,

00:25:22.207 --> 00:25:24.367
have run very successful businesses.

00:25:25.189 --> 00:25:25.888
They're done,

00:25:26.809 --> 00:25:28.310
but they still want to contribute.

00:25:29.030 --> 00:25:30.672
They've sold their businesses.

00:25:30.731 --> 00:25:33.153
Why aren't we seeing more of those guys

00:25:33.693 --> 00:25:34.154
and women?

00:25:34.775 --> 00:25:38.016
coming out and running for these positions

00:25:38.536 --> 00:25:40.797
because we need some sort of balance.

00:25:40.876 --> 00:25:41.116
I mean,

00:25:41.416 --> 00:25:44.577
the state boards are just crazy with some

00:25:44.617 --> 00:25:45.238
of this stuff.

00:25:46.199 --> 00:25:48.019
Three meetings a year, Dave, March, June,

00:25:48.038 --> 00:25:48.578
and November.

00:25:48.739 --> 00:25:49.859
That's the only requirement.

00:25:49.880 --> 00:25:50.940
I'm sure you got to do some reading

00:25:50.980 --> 00:25:51.500
and whatever,

00:25:52.059 --> 00:25:53.560
read and write and arithmetic between,

00:25:53.601 --> 00:25:54.681
but three meetings a year,

00:25:54.941 --> 00:25:58.481
Dave could do probably in fantastic

00:25:59.343 --> 00:26:00.603
Albany, New York.

00:26:00.643 --> 00:26:01.843
Who doesn't want to go to Albany,

00:26:01.863 --> 00:26:03.003
New York?

00:26:03.044 --> 00:26:03.943
We got to go up there, man.

00:26:06.932 --> 00:26:07.973
People knock on Albany.

00:26:07.993 --> 00:26:08.874
It's not horrible.

00:26:09.954 --> 00:26:11.455
It's not great, but it's not horrible.

00:26:11.935 --> 00:26:14.597
All right, are we shifting topics?

00:26:15.278 --> 00:26:17.160
Yeah, what do you got?

00:26:17.180 --> 00:26:18.300
We were going to do the six-pack.

00:26:18.320 --> 00:26:19.402
We were going to do twelve-pack.

00:26:19.422 --> 00:26:22.104
We were going to bring our referral

00:26:22.144 --> 00:26:22.624
sources.

00:26:24.085 --> 00:26:24.965
Let's do six.

00:26:25.646 --> 00:26:26.146
So six.

00:26:26.166 --> 00:26:27.147
We're each going to do two.

00:26:29.288 --> 00:26:30.109
Give the ground rules again.

00:26:31.092 --> 00:26:31.333
Right,

00:26:31.393 --> 00:26:35.220
so the six pack format is kind of

00:26:35.240 --> 00:26:35.901
like a draft.

00:26:35.981 --> 00:26:37.324
So we'll just go in this order, Tony,

00:26:37.805 --> 00:26:39.808
Jimmy, Dave, but then Dave goes again,

00:26:39.848 --> 00:26:40.490
like a snake.

00:26:40.651 --> 00:26:41.752
So you're gonna pick third,

00:26:41.772 --> 00:26:42.875
but then you're gonna pick fourth.

00:26:43.856 --> 00:26:45.817
and then we'll go me, Tony, Tony, Jimmy,

00:26:45.857 --> 00:26:46.478
Dave, we'll end on it.

00:26:46.758 --> 00:26:47.778
So we're each bringing three.

00:26:48.618 --> 00:26:49.179
Right, is that right?

00:26:49.199 --> 00:26:50.098
No, two, we're just gonna do two.

00:26:50.118 --> 00:26:52.039
So we'll just do two passes.

00:26:52.160 --> 00:26:53.960
So this is specifically ideas or

00:26:54.000 --> 00:26:56.861
strategies around getting referral

00:26:56.901 --> 00:26:58.001
sources?

00:26:58.642 --> 00:26:59.781
Either they've had their business for a

00:26:59.821 --> 00:27:01.522
while, they're starting it tomorrow.

00:27:02.163 --> 00:27:04.523
Everybody says, get your referral sources.

00:27:05.044 --> 00:27:07.284
And then I almost feel like nobody can

00:27:07.345 --> 00:27:08.244
pick physicians.

00:27:09.053 --> 00:27:09.512
You know what I mean?

00:27:09.553 --> 00:27:10.953
That's like, that's obvious.

00:27:11.954 --> 00:27:13.394
What I wanted to do was point out

00:27:13.474 --> 00:27:16.277
who are the non-obvious people in your

00:27:16.297 --> 00:27:16.856
neighborhood?

00:27:17.356 --> 00:27:18.038
Could you ping?

00:27:18.637 --> 00:27:18.978
You know,

00:27:19.038 --> 00:27:20.419
there's some people who've launched

00:27:20.479 --> 00:27:23.661
podcasts just with the idea of like never

00:27:23.701 --> 00:27:24.421
getting listeners,

00:27:24.461 --> 00:27:25.602
but just being able to say,

00:27:25.821 --> 00:27:26.561
here's a microphone.

00:27:26.602 --> 00:27:27.663
Let's sit down for an hour.

00:27:28.242 --> 00:27:29.483
And then they walk out of the room

00:27:29.523 --> 00:27:31.365
with sixty minutes of audio.

00:27:31.704 --> 00:27:33.746
But a relationship which is way heavier

00:27:33.826 --> 00:27:35.406
and way, way better than this.

00:27:36.590 --> 00:27:37.571
a download or a listen.

00:27:37.971 --> 00:27:38.771
So I was sort of looking for like

00:27:38.791 --> 00:27:40.053
the off the beaten path.

00:27:40.292 --> 00:27:42.034
Who would you guys suggest since you do

00:27:42.074 --> 00:27:44.154
this outside of just, well,

00:27:44.174 --> 00:27:45.296
just go to the physician groups,

00:27:45.556 --> 00:27:46.977
go knock on the door of the hospital.

00:27:47.957 --> 00:27:49.557
That's done, right?

00:27:49.597 --> 00:27:50.378
Like we know that.

00:27:50.679 --> 00:27:51.459
Who else?

00:27:51.598 --> 00:27:54.020
What's the next level deeper?

00:27:54.300 --> 00:27:55.300
So I have some ideas.

00:27:55.602 --> 00:27:56.001
Go for it.

00:27:57.926 --> 00:27:58.527
Tony, what do you got?

00:27:58.768 --> 00:27:59.548
All right, I'll go first.

00:27:59.888 --> 00:28:01.250
And again,

00:28:01.609 --> 00:28:03.652
it's hard for me to think this is

00:28:03.711 --> 00:28:06.253
something that's not popular already,

00:28:06.875 --> 00:28:09.057
but the personal injury attorneys.

00:28:09.676 --> 00:28:13.079
These guys are booking ridiculous amounts

00:28:13.221 --> 00:28:14.602
of clients and money.

00:28:14.642 --> 00:28:16.442
They only take the cases that they know

00:28:16.462 --> 00:28:17.663
are going to pay the most.

00:28:18.724 --> 00:28:19.644
And I go back to,

00:28:19.746 --> 00:28:22.787
I understand the immediate recoil in most

00:28:23.086 --> 00:28:25.928
physical therapists that, oh, that's,

00:28:26.288 --> 00:28:27.968
yeah, that, you know,

00:28:28.229 --> 00:28:30.628
ambulance chasers and this is horrible.

00:28:31.190 --> 00:28:33.410
But the way I always balance this,

00:28:33.450 --> 00:28:34.911
and this has been a community I've gone

00:28:34.971 --> 00:28:36.131
after for twenty years.

00:28:36.991 --> 00:28:38.592
What if your mom got in the accident?

00:28:38.612 --> 00:28:38.771
Like,

00:28:38.852 --> 00:28:40.413
what if your mom was the person in

00:28:40.452 --> 00:28:43.314
the car that got hit, had the whiplash,

00:28:43.354 --> 00:28:45.394
had the shoulder pain, had the fracture?

00:28:46.295 --> 00:28:48.537
you know your mom needs help and your

00:28:48.557 --> 00:28:50.038
mom doesn't know who to go to and

00:28:50.057 --> 00:28:51.979
she ends up with an attorney and and

00:28:52.038 --> 00:28:53.661
the attorney is trying to direct her to

00:28:53.701 --> 00:28:55.422
these potentially unscrupulous

00:28:55.642 --> 00:28:59.085
unscrupulous chiropractors and med and

00:28:59.384 --> 00:29:02.047
massage therapists and other providers so

00:29:02.067 --> 00:29:04.107
i'm like look from from the ethics of

00:29:04.208 --> 00:29:04.308
it

00:29:05.167 --> 00:29:07.409
These guys will refer to physical

00:29:07.449 --> 00:29:08.029
therapists.

00:29:08.490 --> 00:29:10.830
What do we have to deliver to them?

00:29:11.471 --> 00:29:11.811
Clear,

00:29:11.832 --> 00:29:13.732
concise documentation that supports the

00:29:13.772 --> 00:29:14.173
case.

00:29:15.253 --> 00:29:18.635
We will get your people feeling better.

00:29:19.155 --> 00:29:21.678
And once you meet the attorney and you

00:29:21.718 --> 00:29:22.818
get to know the attorney,

00:29:22.858 --> 00:29:23.999
they're going to be the ones out there

00:29:24.038 --> 00:29:24.420
that say,

00:29:24.579 --> 00:29:25.861
I don't want you to ever discharge this

00:29:25.901 --> 00:29:26.240
person.

00:29:26.780 --> 00:29:28.242
But there are also the ones out there

00:29:28.262 --> 00:29:29.042
that are like, look,

00:29:29.103 --> 00:29:30.664
let's get them a good plan of care.

00:29:30.684 --> 00:29:32.165
Let's get them back to feeling better.

00:29:32.205 --> 00:29:34.828
Let's finish the case so we can settle

00:29:35.209 --> 00:29:36.410
and we can get our payment.

00:29:36.951 --> 00:29:37.310
You know,

00:29:37.592 --> 00:29:39.933
and I think that's probably one of the

00:29:40.094 --> 00:29:42.777
least Patrick.

00:29:43.017 --> 00:29:45.759
Patrick is a toy toy toy toy.

00:29:47.590 --> 00:29:48.371
Toy, you know,

00:29:48.451 --> 00:29:50.852
he does a ton of personal injury,

00:29:51.011 --> 00:29:52.032
auto accident.

00:29:52.073 --> 00:29:54.452
He was like the main guy talking about

00:29:54.553 --> 00:29:54.693
it.

00:29:55.094 --> 00:29:56.673
Reimbursement is off the charts.

00:29:56.733 --> 00:29:58.315
If you get there during med pay,

00:29:58.795 --> 00:30:00.296
when there's still money in the account,

00:30:00.336 --> 00:30:02.336
you get paid the full bill rate.

00:30:03.076 --> 00:30:04.876
So it is just the,

00:30:04.896 --> 00:30:06.678
and the consumer needs your help.

00:30:06.837 --> 00:30:08.438
That's who I'm going after first.

00:30:08.979 --> 00:30:09.858
Off the board.

00:30:11.141 --> 00:30:13.583
Tony's QB one referral source,

00:30:13.643 --> 00:30:15.663
personal injury attorney off the board.

00:30:15.683 --> 00:30:16.724
All right, I'll go next.

00:30:17.184 --> 00:30:17.945
And by the way, by the way,

00:30:17.965 --> 00:30:19.207
not for us because we're self-paced.

00:30:19.287 --> 00:30:21.028
So we actually never want them to call

00:30:21.127 --> 00:30:21.268
us.

00:30:21.587 --> 00:30:22.909
And if they do, we tell our patients,

00:30:22.929 --> 00:30:23.088
hey,

00:30:23.109 --> 00:30:24.671
we would love to treat you for your

00:30:24.691 --> 00:30:25.530
whiplash or whatever,

00:30:25.590 --> 00:30:28.653
but we will still want to have your

00:30:28.953 --> 00:30:31.315
personal credit card on file and we charge

00:30:31.355 --> 00:30:32.576
at the time of service and then we

00:30:32.596 --> 00:30:33.477
can give you receipts later.

00:30:34.098 --> 00:30:34.759
But real quick,

00:30:34.859 --> 00:30:37.840
a lot of personal injury cases pay at

00:30:37.881 --> 00:30:38.981
the time of service.

00:30:39.402 --> 00:30:41.182
You don't have to take a letter of

00:30:41.222 --> 00:30:41.763
protection.

00:30:41.804 --> 00:30:42.963
They will pay you.

00:30:43.345 --> 00:30:45.665
You give them your receipt and then

00:30:45.705 --> 00:30:48.728
they'll take that to the settlement and

00:30:48.988 --> 00:30:50.269
get paid when it's done.

00:30:51.023 --> 00:30:52.385
I guess rehab CEOs are doing something.

00:30:52.405 --> 00:30:52.986
I didn't realize that.

00:30:53.066 --> 00:30:54.008
This is great timing.

00:30:54.147 --> 00:30:55.890
It's fantasy draft time this year, guys.

00:30:55.910 --> 00:30:57.612
So that's Tony's first round pick.

00:30:58.011 --> 00:30:59.394
All right, my first round pick.

00:30:59.634 --> 00:31:00.836
I wanted this to be off the board.

00:31:00.875 --> 00:31:01.977
The goal is not to put together the

00:31:02.017 --> 00:31:02.498
perfect list.

00:31:02.778 --> 00:31:03.659
It's to get you to think.

00:31:04.259 --> 00:31:05.701
So I wanted to go with a trend.

00:31:06.342 --> 00:31:07.363
What is something that people say,

00:31:07.462 --> 00:31:08.404
oh my gosh, it's blowing up.

00:31:08.424 --> 00:31:08.924
It's too big.

00:31:08.964 --> 00:31:09.766
It shouldn't be this big.

00:31:10.227 --> 00:31:11.008
I'm going to go with...

00:31:12.210 --> 00:31:14.191
Kids, sports coaches.

00:31:14.590 --> 00:31:17.932
People are paying to play year-round

00:31:18.012 --> 00:31:21.433
sports for hockey and lacrosse and

00:31:21.493 --> 00:31:22.894
baseball and football.

00:31:23.414 --> 00:31:24.576
And, I mean,

00:31:24.596 --> 00:31:25.675
if you do the math on what a

00:31:25.736 --> 00:31:26.436
year costs,

00:31:26.497 --> 00:31:28.136
it's not just the league fee or the

00:31:28.178 --> 00:31:30.798
coaching or the extra coaching with the

00:31:30.878 --> 00:31:33.660
specialty coach or the equipment.

00:31:33.940 --> 00:31:34.780
It's the hotel.

00:31:35.020 --> 00:31:35.701
It's the travel.

00:31:35.840 --> 00:31:37.122
This is an investment.

00:31:37.741 --> 00:31:39.463
And then my mind goes to psychology.

00:31:39.683 --> 00:31:40.305
Well, therefore,

00:31:40.325 --> 00:31:42.646
if you're investing this much and your

00:31:42.666 --> 00:31:43.728
kid's got an injury,

00:31:45.369 --> 00:31:48.012
so I've known personally people who've had

00:31:48.032 --> 00:31:50.035
kids who are high-level dancers,

00:31:50.576 --> 00:31:51.217
have been injured,

00:31:51.537 --> 00:31:53.960
and have traveled out of state to see

00:31:54.039 --> 00:31:56.863
a PT who's a specialist in that area

00:31:57.323 --> 00:31:58.664
multiple times.

00:31:59.949 --> 00:32:01.371
And I gotta give a nod to my

00:32:01.411 --> 00:32:02.794
pediatric PTs on this one.

00:32:02.953 --> 00:32:05.897
I don't know if there's a bigger bleeding

00:32:05.938 --> 00:32:08.542
heart type of PT amongst PTs who are

00:32:08.583 --> 00:32:10.404
all bleeding hearts that get paid the

00:32:10.465 --> 00:32:10.885
least.

00:32:11.307 --> 00:32:13.230
Pete's PTs, we need to get some love.

00:32:14.126 --> 00:32:15.646
this would be probably different, right?

00:32:15.686 --> 00:32:16.826
Dave would probably say, well,

00:32:16.886 --> 00:32:18.728
it's probably a little bit off the beaten

00:32:18.748 --> 00:32:19.048
path.

00:32:19.167 --> 00:32:20.288
And the people that I know who've gone

00:32:20.327 --> 00:32:25.628
out of state to see specific, you know,

00:32:25.689 --> 00:32:28.608
peds or kids sports PTs have been referred

00:32:28.628 --> 00:32:29.930
by their coach.

00:32:29.990 --> 00:32:31.089
They're like, I got a short list.

00:32:31.150 --> 00:32:31.869
Here's who I love,

00:32:31.930 --> 00:32:34.069
drive to Connecticut and it's cash.

00:32:34.569 --> 00:32:36.830
So my first round pick, my QB one,

00:32:37.111 --> 00:32:39.431
kids sports coaches in twenty twenty six.

00:32:39.451 --> 00:32:39.911
What do you guys think?

00:32:39.931 --> 00:32:41.451
It's not it's not it's not always cash.

00:32:41.731 --> 00:32:42.551
The parents are still going to say,

00:32:42.571 --> 00:32:43.451
do you take my insurance?

00:32:43.872 --> 00:32:44.192
Right, right.

00:32:44.231 --> 00:32:44.452
Sure.

00:32:44.573 --> 00:32:45.153
Not always.

00:32:45.472 --> 00:32:47.194
But I think you can have a market

00:32:47.234 --> 00:32:47.654
for that.

00:32:47.755 --> 00:32:48.315
If you were like,

00:32:48.615 --> 00:32:50.037
this is going to be a giant referral

00:32:50.076 --> 00:32:50.336
source.

00:32:50.376 --> 00:32:51.518
If I want to be a cash based

00:32:52.117 --> 00:32:54.400
niche practitioner, I'm just a dance PT.

00:32:54.680 --> 00:32:55.140
Alyssa,

00:32:55.300 --> 00:32:57.862
Alyssa out in Colorado is just a dance

00:32:57.922 --> 00:32:58.343
PT.

00:32:58.923 --> 00:33:00.744
I'm sure my guess is Alyssa's got a

00:33:00.785 --> 00:33:02.925
couple of sports coaches that she talks to

00:33:03.246 --> 00:33:05.867
in the old back pocket.

00:33:05.887 --> 00:33:06.689
All right, Dave, what do you got?

00:33:07.757 --> 00:33:09.478
right for us now again we're you know

00:33:09.498 --> 00:33:11.337
a little unique because of being home

00:33:11.377 --> 00:33:13.278
visits historically and now some clinic

00:33:13.318 --> 00:33:17.480
visits but um for us it's nursing company

00:33:17.840 --> 00:33:21.301
in-home nursing companies nursing agencies

00:33:21.863 --> 00:33:23.242
and they're unfortunately you know for

00:33:23.282 --> 00:33:24.804
better for worse they're not all created

00:33:24.864 --> 00:33:27.825
equal and the ones that obviously take the

00:33:27.845 --> 00:33:29.144
medicaid's and the medicare's all that

00:33:29.164 --> 00:33:31.165
like they don't really refer to us but

00:33:31.185 --> 00:33:34.627
there are two large private pay nursing

00:33:34.667 --> 00:33:35.307
companies in

00:33:37.589 --> 00:33:41.192
and the people that we get referred from

00:33:41.232 --> 00:33:43.094
them because they have people that are

00:33:43.114 --> 00:33:44.394
affiliated with the hospitals so they

00:33:44.414 --> 00:33:46.277
already know like who's gonna be

00:33:46.297 --> 00:33:48.718
discharged home soon and who signs up with

00:33:48.758 --> 00:33:50.599
these uh in-home nursing companies that

00:33:50.619 --> 00:33:53.701
will provide either uh cnas like certified

00:33:53.761 --> 00:33:56.723
nursing assistants um hhas home health

00:33:56.763 --> 00:33:59.026
assistants or rns or any mix of those

00:33:59.066 --> 00:34:00.866
two or three depending on the severity of

00:34:00.886 --> 00:34:04.049
the the person's situation these two

00:34:04.089 --> 00:34:05.631
different nursing companies

00:34:06.589 --> 00:34:07.329
are self-pay.

00:34:08.010 --> 00:34:10.811
And yeah, the rate might be, you know,

00:34:10.831 --> 00:34:12.373
whatever, twenty five, fifty an hour.

00:34:12.413 --> 00:34:13.773
I think the RNs at these places,

00:34:13.813 --> 00:34:15.213
they're charging like a hundred dollars an

00:34:15.253 --> 00:34:15.454
hour.

00:34:15.494 --> 00:34:18.036
And sometimes people have nurses there for

00:34:18.155 --> 00:34:19.976
many hours a day, many,

00:34:20.197 --> 00:34:22.018
many days of the week or the month.

00:34:22.597 --> 00:34:23.998
And so they're they're paying these

00:34:24.018 --> 00:34:25.480
families are paying thousands or tens of

00:34:25.519 --> 00:34:27.780
thousands of dollars every month or every

00:34:27.800 --> 00:34:29.581
couple of months to these the nursing

00:34:29.621 --> 00:34:29.981
companies.

00:34:31.137 --> 00:34:32.918
And when these nursing companies refer to

00:34:32.958 --> 00:34:33.418
us, by the way,

00:34:33.978 --> 00:34:35.518
none of the two big nursing companies that

00:34:35.539 --> 00:34:35.978
are self-paying,

00:34:36.119 --> 00:34:37.159
none of them have therapy.

00:34:37.259 --> 00:34:39.300
So they obviously refer out for therapy.

00:34:40.320 --> 00:34:42.039
We're definitely one of the trusted

00:34:42.079 --> 00:34:43.380
providers for these two.

00:34:43.880 --> 00:34:45.481
I take out these folks, we, you know,

00:34:45.681 --> 00:34:47.641
lunches and dinners and networking and all

00:34:47.661 --> 00:34:47.882
that.

00:34:48.021 --> 00:34:48.501
And they're great.

00:34:48.521 --> 00:34:49.882
We try to refer patients to them as

00:34:49.922 --> 00:34:50.141
well.

00:34:50.481 --> 00:34:51.481
Sometimes people call us.

00:34:51.822 --> 00:34:53.583
That's a huge thing with this whole topic

00:34:53.643 --> 00:34:54.762
of referral sources is like,

00:34:55.003 --> 00:34:55.983
if you want referrals,

00:34:56.722 --> 00:34:59.804
go out of your way to refer patients.

00:35:00.318 --> 00:35:02.380
one of your patients or clients to them.

00:35:02.541 --> 00:35:02.702
It's,

00:35:02.961 --> 00:35:04.824
it's so simple and no one really does

00:35:04.864 --> 00:35:04.963
it.

00:35:05.824 --> 00:35:06.284
Your whole,

00:35:06.505 --> 00:35:07.706
the whole objective for that day.

00:35:08.206 --> 00:35:09.387
That's the only thing is try to get

00:35:09.568 --> 00:35:10.469
this patient who said,

00:35:11.050 --> 00:35:12.632
I might need like a home nurse or

00:35:12.652 --> 00:35:13.152
a home health aide.

00:35:13.172 --> 00:35:14.213
Do you know anyone that would do that?

00:35:14.954 --> 00:35:16.775
You go out of your way to connect

00:35:17.516 --> 00:35:20.420
your patient to this nursing company and

00:35:20.519 --> 00:35:21.860
have obviously like a two way

00:35:21.900 --> 00:35:22.501
collaboration.

00:35:23.038 --> 00:35:26.179
For us, I don't even know the number.

00:35:26.260 --> 00:35:27.840
It's multiple hundreds of thousands of

00:35:27.860 --> 00:35:30.422
dollars of revenue over the past several

00:35:30.443 --> 00:35:30.702
years.

00:35:31.623 --> 00:35:33.525
The one guy that's a whale the past

00:35:33.565 --> 00:35:34.385
two years that has spent,

00:35:34.945 --> 00:35:36.106
one person that has spent like,

00:35:36.206 --> 00:35:37.807
eighty thousand dollars with us over the

00:35:37.827 --> 00:35:38.568
last two years.

00:35:38.608 --> 00:35:40.769
So he's paying thirty,

00:35:40.789 --> 00:35:42.231
forty K a year to work with us.

00:35:42.311 --> 00:35:44.413
This one client came from just one of

00:35:44.432 --> 00:35:45.393
these nursing companies.

00:35:46.014 --> 00:35:48.576
And so for us,

00:35:49.882 --> 00:35:50.643
It's huge.

00:35:50.963 --> 00:35:51.905
If you have a brick and mortar,

00:35:52.445 --> 00:35:53.606
maybe it would be a little less

00:35:54.960 --> 00:35:56.262
less of your focus and it might not

00:35:56.302 --> 00:35:58.222
translate but anyway that's our that's our

00:35:58.342 --> 00:35:59.744
probably our number one and i have another

00:35:59.804 --> 00:36:01.324
one after this obviously yeah you're gonna

00:36:01.344 --> 00:36:02.905
go forth i just wanted to chime in

00:36:02.945 --> 00:36:04.947
do you notice what all three of our

00:36:04.987 --> 00:36:07.108
picks have in common i look for common

00:36:07.268 --> 00:36:10.190
and different is tony mentioned personal

00:36:10.231 --> 00:36:12.831
injury attorneys what if your mom got

00:36:12.911 --> 00:36:14.552
injured right you can there's two things

00:36:14.572 --> 00:36:15.813
you can go both ways what if your

00:36:15.833 --> 00:36:17.894
mom got injured if your kid got injured

00:36:18.215 --> 00:36:20.097
if your family member was in care

00:36:21.382 --> 00:36:23.164
It's the emotional driver, right?

00:36:23.443 --> 00:36:24.644
My dad's had a stroke.

00:36:24.664 --> 00:36:25.525
I don't have an option.

00:36:26.505 --> 00:36:28.306
I'm either going to pick an option,

00:36:28.327 --> 00:36:29.728
whether I choose the care or not,

00:36:29.748 --> 00:36:30.949
it's who I'm choosing from.

00:36:31.208 --> 00:36:32.409
And Dave is saying, be there.

00:36:32.869 --> 00:36:35.110
So you're picked first or second, right?

00:36:35.130 --> 00:36:35.871
You're thought of.

00:36:36.271 --> 00:36:39.413
Top of mind will get you picked.

00:36:39.693 --> 00:36:40.733
And Scott was chiming in.

00:36:40.773 --> 00:36:42.675
I'm guessing on my selection,

00:36:42.695 --> 00:36:44.675
he's saying you hire an athletic trainer

00:36:45.197 --> 00:36:46.978
to build the relationships with coaches,

00:36:47.038 --> 00:36:48.018
families, and local communities.

00:36:48.038 --> 00:36:48.838
It's a great idea, Scott.

00:36:49.496 --> 00:36:51.099
Even the big in-network practices like

00:36:51.139 --> 00:36:53.505
JAGPT in the New York City area,

00:36:53.525 --> 00:36:54.126
they do this.

00:36:54.606 --> 00:36:56.130
And they basically do it at a loss,

00:36:56.150 --> 00:36:57.092
by the way.

00:36:57.152 --> 00:36:57.474
Really?

00:36:57.514 --> 00:36:57.634
Yeah.

00:36:58.797 --> 00:37:00.139
To get the athlete referrals.

00:37:00.398 --> 00:37:00.978
Well, yeah, Dave,

00:37:00.998 --> 00:37:03.599
what's your lunch cost for whatever that

00:37:03.679 --> 00:37:05.159
source was that brought you that guy that

00:37:05.179 --> 00:37:06.280
spent eighty thousand dollars?

00:37:06.320 --> 00:37:07.800
You know, it was two hundred bucks.

00:37:08.260 --> 00:37:08.940
Is that worth it?

00:37:09.121 --> 00:37:10.762
Well, feels like all day.

00:37:11.141 --> 00:37:11.402
All day.

00:37:11.422 --> 00:37:12.981
You just don't know which lunch is going

00:37:13.001 --> 00:37:13.541
to lead to it.

00:37:13.561 --> 00:37:15.282
But I'm guessing the more you do this,

00:37:15.342 --> 00:37:17.242
the more you're like you probably in the

00:37:17.282 --> 00:37:18.724
first ninety seconds are going to be like,

00:37:19.284 --> 00:37:19.583
all right.

00:37:20.224 --> 00:37:21.985
this ain't gonna happen or ooh this person

00:37:22.045 --> 00:37:24.206
gets how this works I'm gonna help them

00:37:24.565 --> 00:37:25.945
we're just gonna route people to great

00:37:25.985 --> 00:37:27.407
care it feels like that all right so

00:37:27.447 --> 00:37:28.967
Dave we're using the snake draft which

00:37:29.007 --> 00:37:31.248
means you get to go one to the

00:37:31.288 --> 00:37:34.248
fourth all right so the next one will

00:37:34.289 --> 00:37:36.210
be also applicable to any outpatient

00:37:36.230 --> 00:37:39.791
clinic brick-and-mortar gym owners and

00:37:39.831 --> 00:37:42.192
it's not just any gym owner it is

00:37:42.291 --> 00:37:45.353
the the group fitness class gym owners and

00:37:45.512 --> 00:37:46.773
obviously there's a lot of them out there

00:37:47.653 --> 00:37:48.974
You want to like for us,

00:37:49.054 --> 00:37:49.994
like we got lucky.

00:37:50.054 --> 00:37:51.856
There's this guy nearby, Anthony,

00:37:52.356 --> 00:37:53.516
and I've worked out there.

00:37:53.677 --> 00:37:54.217
So, yes,

00:37:54.277 --> 00:37:56.318
you should be a paying customer of that

00:37:56.358 --> 00:37:56.639
gym.

00:37:57.159 --> 00:37:58.679
Go on Instagram, go on Facebook.

00:37:59.900 --> 00:38:02.561
Usually these usually these places are

00:38:02.601 --> 00:38:05.382
doing video and they're doing content and

00:38:05.483 --> 00:38:06.724
you want to look at like like,

00:38:06.744 --> 00:38:07.844
for example, this guy's place,

00:38:08.204 --> 00:38:09.304
this this gym.

00:38:10.425 --> 00:38:12.186
It is never been busier.

00:38:12.347 --> 00:38:13.166
It is, it is,

00:38:13.628 --> 00:38:16.190
I think actually almost fire safety code,

00:38:16.389 --> 00:38:19.413
uh, too crowded fire, like, like,

00:38:19.512 --> 00:38:21.373
like going against the fire safety code.

00:38:21.614 --> 00:38:22.795
There's so many people in this place.

00:38:23.215 --> 00:38:25.597
That's like an obvious, um,

00:38:26.639 --> 00:38:28.320
signal of like, okay, wow,

00:38:28.360 --> 00:38:31.123
this person or this, this, uh, company,

00:38:31.163 --> 00:38:33.784
this gym is obviously doing something

00:38:33.864 --> 00:38:34.105
right.

00:38:34.204 --> 00:38:34.885
And it's, guess what?

00:38:34.905 --> 00:38:35.847
It's not the workouts.

00:38:35.867 --> 00:38:37.427
You can do these workouts anywhere.

00:38:38.063 --> 00:38:39.025
It's the community.

00:38:39.085 --> 00:38:41.427
It's the tribe that these gym owners

00:38:41.467 --> 00:38:41.789
build.

00:38:42.208 --> 00:38:43.190
And the guy, Anthony,

00:38:43.650 --> 00:38:45.853
is basically like the mayor of the town.

00:38:46.355 --> 00:38:47.576
So like everyone knows him.

00:38:47.916 --> 00:38:49.418
He is very extroverted.

00:38:49.458 --> 00:38:50.920
He talks with everyone and he has sent

00:38:50.960 --> 00:38:51.740
us a lot of people.

00:38:52.322 --> 00:38:54.224
So this is a long term play.

00:38:54.244 --> 00:38:55.927
You would want to as a strategy for

00:38:55.967 --> 00:38:56.847
you watching or listening.

00:38:57.742 --> 00:38:58.983
would want to first of all go and

00:38:59.043 --> 00:39:01.445
pay uh as a as a gym member

00:39:01.505 --> 00:39:03.005
don't think they're going to send you new

00:39:03.065 --> 00:39:05.608
patients and like like what's in it for

00:39:05.628 --> 00:39:07.630
them so go pay go patronize their their

00:39:07.650 --> 00:39:10.291
business meet other people you know it's a

00:39:10.351 --> 00:39:11.853
long-term play even if you work out at

00:39:11.893 --> 00:39:13.454
home even if you have two or three

00:39:13.474 --> 00:39:15.356
gym memberships you should consider having

00:39:15.396 --> 00:39:17.277
multiple gym memberships and working out

00:39:17.318 --> 00:39:18.619
at multiple places and doing this at

00:39:18.659 --> 00:39:20.701
multiple gyms and getting yourself in

00:39:20.721 --> 00:39:23.362
front of all these different gym members

00:39:23.682 --> 00:39:24.543
at different places but

00:39:25.063 --> 00:39:26.923
Finding the gym owners and the trainers

00:39:26.943 --> 00:39:28.204
and the coaches and the instructors that

00:39:28.224 --> 00:39:29.405
are kind of like the mayor,

00:39:29.445 --> 00:39:30.985
like they're very outgoing.

00:39:31.005 --> 00:39:34.346
They have a lot of relationships.

00:39:34.365 --> 00:39:35.246
They know everyone.

00:39:35.286 --> 00:39:36.365
They always have someone, oh,

00:39:36.385 --> 00:39:37.067
I got a guy for that.

00:39:37.126 --> 00:39:37.806
I got a guy for this.

00:39:37.827 --> 00:39:38.686
Like if you're in a pickle,

00:39:38.726 --> 00:39:40.246
someone else is in a jam,

00:39:40.507 --> 00:39:41.467
they have a guy for this.

00:39:41.927 --> 00:39:43.648
That's the type of person you want to

00:39:43.807 --> 00:39:46.288
naturally build a relationship with,

00:39:46.427 --> 00:39:50.708
not anything that's like high level or

00:39:51.268 --> 00:39:52.510
just like transactional.

00:39:52.570 --> 00:39:53.750
This is a long-term play.

00:39:55.021 --> 00:39:56.103
all and all these by the way all

00:39:56.143 --> 00:39:58.623
these are long-term plays should be yeah

00:39:58.864 --> 00:40:01.306
um i completely agree one of my aunts

00:40:01.365 --> 00:40:02.925
lives several states away so the only way

00:40:02.945 --> 00:40:05.208
i really interact with her uh props to

00:40:05.248 --> 00:40:08.148
aunt betty is uh facebook and the way

00:40:08.168 --> 00:40:11.791
she talks about her trainers is like a

00:40:11.851 --> 00:40:13.532
family member she's like you know spent

00:40:13.572 --> 00:40:15.713
the morning with so-and-so you know she

00:40:15.753 --> 00:40:16.954
really gave it to me but feeling great

00:40:16.974 --> 00:40:19.815
like this is a deep deep relationship why

00:40:19.835 --> 00:40:21.615
does that matter because when her trainer

00:40:21.655 --> 00:40:22.556
says to do something

00:40:23.317 --> 00:40:24.878
There's a good chance she's going to trust

00:40:24.918 --> 00:40:25.378
her, right?

00:40:25.518 --> 00:40:26.760
And I've had that slide before,

00:40:26.780 --> 00:40:28.081
which is attention leads to trust.

00:40:28.521 --> 00:40:29.442
Trust leads to action.

00:40:29.661 --> 00:40:31.603
Attention rarely leads directly to action,

00:40:31.983 --> 00:40:33.364
unless you're Teemu.

00:40:33.505 --> 00:40:34.786
That's just how it works, people.

00:40:34.826 --> 00:40:35.527
It's psychology.

00:40:36.047 --> 00:40:38.329
I think specifically gym owners,

00:40:38.349 --> 00:40:39.429
group fitness classes is great.

00:40:39.469 --> 00:40:40.070
Tony, what do you think?

00:40:40.231 --> 00:40:41.472
Good, bad, ugly, good pick?

00:40:42.275 --> 00:40:43.036
No, it's a good one.

00:40:43.436 --> 00:40:46.057
I love the idea we talked about a

00:40:46.097 --> 00:40:48.300
long time ago where I would be the

00:40:48.360 --> 00:40:51.001
telehealth PT for the gym,

00:40:51.061 --> 00:40:53.121
the group practice, things like that,

00:40:53.161 --> 00:40:55.344
so that I could multiply myself.

00:40:55.963 --> 00:40:58.826
If there's twenty, you know, CrossFit,

00:40:59.045 --> 00:41:01.766
Orange Theory, SoulCycle,

00:41:01.847 --> 00:41:02.807
all those places,

00:41:03.447 --> 00:41:06.269
I would be the telehealth PT.

00:41:06.710 --> 00:41:08.710
So you don't lose your member to a

00:41:08.751 --> 00:41:10.271
PT who's going to tell your member to

00:41:10.311 --> 00:41:10.992
stop coming.

00:41:11.672 --> 00:41:12.594
you bring me in,

00:41:12.634 --> 00:41:13.713
put me on a monitor,

00:41:13.855 --> 00:41:15.155
I do the evaluation,

00:41:15.275 --> 00:41:16.896
I can use their insurance if I'm

00:41:16.936 --> 00:41:17.717
contracted,

00:41:18.077 --> 00:41:20.518
doesn't even cost you anything, you know,

00:41:20.878 --> 00:41:23.041
and then my plan of care is going

00:41:23.081 --> 00:41:25.822
to include, hey, stay with your trainer,

00:41:25.842 --> 00:41:26.862
stay with your coach,

00:41:26.943 --> 00:41:29.105
this is what I recommend that you guys

00:41:29.144 --> 00:41:29.744
do together.

00:41:31.126 --> 00:41:32.367
I love that.

00:41:32.547 --> 00:41:34.447
One thread that I think we want to

00:41:34.487 --> 00:41:35.128
pull through

00:41:37.132 --> 00:41:39.114
We always have to understand what is the

00:41:39.155 --> 00:41:40.876
benefit to the referral source.

00:41:40.896 --> 00:41:42.277
Like we're talking about where the

00:41:42.338 --> 00:41:43.539
referrals coming from.

00:41:44.119 --> 00:41:45.282
I said with the attorney,

00:41:45.822 --> 00:41:48.144
I understand the attorney wants to run up

00:41:48.525 --> 00:41:51.807
the total bill amount for the settlement

00:41:52.088 --> 00:41:53.851
because they're going to take a percentage

00:41:53.971 --> 00:41:54.911
of that settlement.

00:41:55.032 --> 00:41:56.213
I understand they want clear,

00:41:56.233 --> 00:41:57.634
concise documentation.

00:41:58.355 --> 00:41:59.315
My next one.

00:42:00.496 --> 00:42:02.378
and i've got a couple here but we'll

00:42:02.398 --> 00:42:05.001
just pick one the the wheelchair assistive

00:42:05.041 --> 00:42:06.681
device companies you know these medical

00:42:06.722 --> 00:42:09.083
equipment companies like they have

00:42:09.123 --> 00:42:12.186
consumers going direct to them wanting

00:42:12.206 --> 00:42:14.588
devices that could be covered by insurance

00:42:14.969 --> 00:42:17.891
and the only thing they're lacking is the

00:42:17.931 --> 00:42:20.353
sometimes the pt eval ot eval like for

00:42:20.373 --> 00:42:22.655
a wheelchair power mobility you know that

00:42:22.675 --> 00:42:23.396
kind of stuff

00:42:24.715 --> 00:42:28.057
But the idea is they're not being marketed

00:42:28.117 --> 00:42:30.179
to by other providers.

00:42:30.679 --> 00:42:32.320
So the opportunity is there.

00:42:32.900 --> 00:42:34.440
They can push their equipment.

00:42:34.960 --> 00:42:37.682
The potential consumer has no idea what's

00:42:37.722 --> 00:42:39.503
the best piece of equipment for them.

00:42:39.963 --> 00:42:41.324
And even back in the day when I

00:42:41.344 --> 00:42:42.945
was doing a lot of these wheelchair

00:42:42.985 --> 00:42:43.865
evaluations,

00:42:44.505 --> 00:42:46.668
I think therapists get intimidated because

00:42:46.748 --> 00:42:47.068
I'm like,

00:42:47.309 --> 00:42:49.891
I don't know what the seat depth should

00:42:49.931 --> 00:42:51.291
be, what the height should be,

00:42:51.351 --> 00:42:52.893
what the specifications should be.

00:42:52.913 --> 00:42:54.034
I don't know any of that stuff,

00:42:54.434 --> 00:42:56.697
but I don't need to because they have

00:42:56.757 --> 00:43:00.099
their certified people who do all the

00:43:00.139 --> 00:43:01.920
fitting and all the appropriate stuff and

00:43:01.960 --> 00:43:03.001
make the recommendations.

00:43:03.643 --> 00:43:06.485
All my job is, is to say, yes,

00:43:06.664 --> 00:43:08.547
this person would benefit from this device

00:43:08.967 --> 00:43:09.588
or no,

00:43:09.807 --> 00:43:11.409
this person would not benefit from this

00:43:11.449 --> 00:43:11.829
device.

00:43:12.289 --> 00:43:15.353
You know, and so these are super simple,

00:43:15.454 --> 00:43:16.496
twenty minute,

00:43:16.576 --> 00:43:19.099
fifteen minute evaluations just to say yes

00:43:19.159 --> 00:43:22.362
or no and provide them the clinical

00:43:22.402 --> 00:43:26.648
background to justify issuing the device.

00:43:26.688 --> 00:43:28.590
But I always did really well with medical

00:43:28.632 --> 00:43:29.532
equipment companies.

00:43:31.376 --> 00:43:31.556
All right,

00:43:31.577 --> 00:43:33.697
my second round pick sort of follows in

00:43:33.737 --> 00:43:34.277
line with Dave.

00:43:34.297 --> 00:43:35.818
If there's a deep relationship,

00:43:36.297 --> 00:43:38.677
if you're willing to go spend money as

00:43:38.898 --> 00:43:40.998
just a regular person off the street with

00:43:41.059 --> 00:43:42.719
someone who runs group fitness classes,

00:43:43.039 --> 00:43:43.918
that's a relationship.

00:43:44.458 --> 00:43:46.659
If you're willing to take your clothes off

00:43:46.699 --> 00:43:48.019
in front of this person and let them

00:43:48.099 --> 00:43:48.679
touch you,

00:43:49.219 --> 00:43:51.701
I think massage therapists have a pretty

00:43:51.740 --> 00:43:52.960
damn deep relationship.

00:43:53.561 --> 00:43:54.701
I've heard people who go to massage

00:43:54.740 --> 00:43:55.581
therapists regularly.

00:43:56.121 --> 00:43:57.681
I don't, but the people that I hear...

00:43:58.735 --> 00:43:59.576
That's their person.

00:43:59.795 --> 00:44:01.836
Like they test people out until they find

00:44:01.996 --> 00:44:03.177
the one, the one.

00:44:03.637 --> 00:44:05.619
It's a little bit of personality, right?

00:44:05.639 --> 00:44:06.719
A little bit of comfort level.

00:44:06.920 --> 00:44:08.021
Even if the person had great hands,

00:44:08.041 --> 00:44:08.842
but they were weird.

00:44:09.262 --> 00:44:10.382
My guess is you wouldn't go back to

00:44:10.402 --> 00:44:11.083
that person a lot.

00:44:11.362 --> 00:44:12.443
So you've got an affinity.

00:44:12.784 --> 00:44:14.606
You're regularly having conversations.

00:44:15.106 --> 00:44:16.007
This would be in line.

00:44:16.027 --> 00:44:17.086
If I had a third round pick,

00:44:17.106 --> 00:44:18.628
I might say like hairdresser as we're

00:44:18.648 --> 00:44:19.228
getting deeper,

00:44:19.329 --> 00:44:21.889
further away from the middle of the target

00:44:21.909 --> 00:44:22.791
with like a physician.

00:44:23.251 --> 00:44:24.692
Massage therapists have a deep

00:44:24.711 --> 00:44:25.313
relationship.

00:44:25.333 --> 00:44:26.373
People have their go-to.

00:44:27.094 --> 00:44:27.914
What can you do?

00:44:28.942 --> 00:44:29.161
Well,

00:44:29.242 --> 00:44:30.764
if you're one of those people who get

00:44:30.804 --> 00:44:31.945
mad in the Facebook comments,

00:44:32.525 --> 00:44:34.307
physical therapists aren't just massage

00:44:34.347 --> 00:44:34.909
therapists.

00:44:35.028 --> 00:44:36.090
Great, do something about it.

00:44:36.210 --> 00:44:37.431
If someone asks for a massage,

00:44:37.471 --> 00:44:38.271
instead of just saying, no,

00:44:38.311 --> 00:44:38.813
we don't do that,

00:44:39.092 --> 00:44:40.434
send them to someone you have,

00:44:40.795 --> 00:44:43.217
as Dave mentioned, tried out, tested.

00:44:44.380 --> 00:44:45.400
built a relationship with,

00:44:45.940 --> 00:44:48.121
can honestly say not just here's a massage

00:44:48.141 --> 00:44:49.422
therapist near you I Googled.

00:44:49.842 --> 00:44:50.762
I've been to this person.

00:44:51.083 --> 00:44:51.882
When I have an issue,

00:44:52.103 --> 00:44:52.724
I go to them.

00:44:52.963 --> 00:44:54.764
And then just as Scott also pointed out

00:44:54.784 --> 00:44:55.945
for Dave's pick and my pick,

00:44:56.324 --> 00:44:58.346
now massages and gym memberships become a

00:44:58.405 --> 00:44:59.407
business expense.

00:44:59.967 --> 00:45:02.367
Scott doing our taxes way ahead of

00:45:02.387 --> 00:45:02.887
November.

00:45:02.987 --> 00:45:04.168
And I love that about you, Scott.

00:45:04.208 --> 00:45:04.789
Thank you for that.

00:45:06.925 --> 00:45:07.206
All right.

00:45:07.226 --> 00:45:08.827
So that's, that's a six pack right there.

00:45:08.867 --> 00:45:09.907
Dave jumped, uh, Tony,

00:45:09.949 --> 00:45:11.028
Tony traded up somehow.

00:45:11.068 --> 00:45:11.730
He jumped in front of me.

00:45:11.769 --> 00:45:12.371
I don't know how he did that,

00:45:12.391 --> 00:45:14.411
but he, I would,

00:45:14.532 --> 00:45:15.693
I would say by the way, the,

00:45:15.713 --> 00:45:17.554
the massage therapist would be like an

00:45:17.635 --> 00:45:18.094
asterisk.

00:45:18.114 --> 00:45:19.115
So it depends.

00:45:19.556 --> 00:45:21.458
Some of them will have like the,

00:45:21.478 --> 00:45:23.280
the ego that they can like fix every

00:45:23.340 --> 00:45:25.320
injury and do rehab and all that and

00:45:25.481 --> 00:45:27.302
stretch their legs and, you know,

00:45:27.322 --> 00:45:28.523
do assisted stretching and all that.

00:45:29.204 --> 00:45:29.545
Um,

00:45:29.585 --> 00:45:30.965
versus there's some massage therapists

00:45:30.985 --> 00:45:34.027
that like want to just do massage.

00:45:34.188 --> 00:45:35.710
And like, if someone's complaining about,

00:45:36.612 --> 00:45:37.893
something else they're like oh well you

00:45:37.914 --> 00:45:40.034
know you should maybe get some pt and

00:45:40.074 --> 00:45:41.954
rehab or whatever so it's going to depend

00:45:42.054 --> 00:45:43.516
on the massage therapist and their

00:45:43.556 --> 00:45:46.137
approach and maybe for lack of a better

00:45:46.177 --> 00:45:48.297
word like depends on their ego and all

00:45:48.336 --> 00:45:50.297
that so that would be just like you

00:45:50.398 --> 00:45:51.998
just again it's like it's like with the

00:45:52.018 --> 00:45:54.480
gym gym uh gym owner you're not going

00:45:54.500 --> 00:45:55.179
to just go after

00:45:55.940 --> 00:45:58.300
any gym you want to find that you

00:45:58.320 --> 00:45:59.862
want to find the gyms where like the

00:45:59.942 --> 00:46:01.422
instructors and the owners are like on

00:46:01.463 --> 00:46:03.364
video like smiling and they're like

00:46:03.704 --> 00:46:05.885
they're happy and there's a ton of people

00:46:05.925 --> 00:46:09.427
that pay to work out there and the

00:46:09.467 --> 00:46:09.547
the

00:46:10.068 --> 00:46:12.269
The gym members stay there for years and

00:46:12.289 --> 00:46:12.730
years and years.

00:46:12.949 --> 00:46:16.851
That's a perfect gym owner to go after

00:46:17.331 --> 00:46:18.710
and refer your friends to the gym.

00:46:18.931 --> 00:46:21.612
Bring friends, by the way, and say, hey,

00:46:21.711 --> 00:46:23.291
I'm a new member and I brought some

00:46:23.311 --> 00:46:23.851
friends or whatever.

00:46:24.032 --> 00:46:25.393
They would love that because now they're

00:46:25.413 --> 00:46:29.213
getting some new customer acquisition just

00:46:29.333 --> 00:46:30.673
from word of mouth and not having to

00:46:30.713 --> 00:46:31.094
pay for it.

00:46:31.824 --> 00:46:33.126
I'll go as far as to say this.

00:46:33.567 --> 00:46:34.748
The way Dave does it,

00:46:35.208 --> 00:46:36.971
let's say you just referred someone to a

00:46:37.030 --> 00:46:37.871
gym you heard about.

00:46:38.293 --> 00:46:40.755
And then that person who trusted you went

00:46:40.795 --> 00:46:42.657
there and had a crappy experience.

00:46:44.056 --> 00:46:45.757
their trust in you would probably go down

00:46:45.777 --> 00:46:46.257
a little bit.

00:46:46.518 --> 00:46:47.338
You're like, all right, well,

00:46:47.358 --> 00:46:48.039
that was a dud.

00:46:48.501 --> 00:46:49.842
But because you went there and you

00:46:49.902 --> 00:46:50.762
experienced it,

00:46:51.083 --> 00:46:52.385
and you have two different patients on

00:46:52.405 --> 00:46:54.266
your schedule, you can say, yeah,

00:46:54.286 --> 00:46:55.228
this would be great for you.

00:46:55.268 --> 00:46:55.907
Like, honestly,

00:46:55.927 --> 00:46:57.230
from what I know about you, that one,

00:46:57.269 --> 00:46:58.391
probably not the best idea.

00:46:58.630 --> 00:47:00.913
So the goal isn't everybody comes to me,

00:47:01.313 --> 00:47:03.615
it's you want the right patients sent to

00:47:03.655 --> 00:47:03.775
you,

00:47:04.436 --> 00:47:05.396
The referral source,

00:47:05.717 --> 00:47:06.938
if it's going to be a two-way street,

00:47:06.978 --> 00:47:07.577
as it should,

00:47:08.077 --> 00:47:10.159
also wants the right people sent to them.

00:47:10.239 --> 00:47:12.699
So you're burning some cred if the answer

00:47:12.719 --> 00:47:14.221
is just like, here's my QR code.

00:47:14.460 --> 00:47:16.922
Link in bio to find a gym near

00:47:16.961 --> 00:47:17.161
me.

00:47:17.561 --> 00:47:19.483
That's not the right way to do this.

00:47:19.543 --> 00:47:23.585
You're leveraging trust,

00:47:23.684 --> 00:47:25.065
or you're putting trust on the line.

00:47:25.746 --> 00:47:27.885
And if you misuse that,

00:47:29.126 --> 00:47:30.266
treat it as a resource that could go

00:47:30.306 --> 00:47:30.947
away at any time.

00:47:32.951 --> 00:47:34.291
And that's something, you know,

00:47:34.351 --> 00:47:36.413
I don't think is discussed often enough

00:47:36.432 --> 00:47:37.813
when you're talking about building that

00:47:37.853 --> 00:47:40.695
relationship with a referral source.

00:47:41.436 --> 00:47:42.637
We skip doctors,

00:47:42.717 --> 00:47:45.079
but it's worth closing the show talking

00:47:45.119 --> 00:47:46.000
about doctors.

00:47:46.300 --> 00:47:46.559
Sure.

00:47:47.099 --> 00:47:49.621
You know, doctors, doctor referrals,

00:47:49.661 --> 00:47:51.862
doctor marketing, relationship building.

00:47:52.244 --> 00:47:53.965
Everybody wants to move away from it.

00:47:54.445 --> 00:47:56.005
That's why it's the perfect time to go

00:47:56.065 --> 00:47:57.086
back to it.

00:47:57.367 --> 00:47:57.487
Yes.

00:47:57.507 --> 00:47:58.648
Double down on it.

00:47:59.228 --> 00:47:59.929
And I would say,

00:48:00.489 --> 00:48:01.650
and I've shared this story, but...

00:48:02.494 --> 00:48:03.916
When we open a new clinic,

00:48:03.936 --> 00:48:05.536
when we move into a new space,

00:48:05.835 --> 00:48:07.297
I go and talk to the physician.

00:48:07.996 --> 00:48:09.018
My marketing,

00:48:09.077 --> 00:48:11.458
my conversation is never about what a

00:48:11.498 --> 00:48:13.458
great therapist I am, we are,

00:48:13.518 --> 00:48:14.380
the services.

00:48:15.139 --> 00:48:18.240
I'm trying to understand what's the

00:48:18.280 --> 00:48:20.302
resistance of them referring to me.

00:48:21.081 --> 00:48:23.222
Number one, it's not a habit.

00:48:23.443 --> 00:48:26.204
They have habits for referral patterns.

00:48:26.585 --> 00:48:29.288
It is not a habit to change and

00:48:29.347 --> 00:48:30.027
come to me.

00:48:30.489 --> 00:48:32.050
So I need to figure out what's worth

00:48:32.110 --> 00:48:34.251
breaking that habit, changing that habit.

00:48:34.632 --> 00:48:35.893
And my big things are, look,

00:48:36.253 --> 00:48:37.813
I'm never going to send somebody back

00:48:37.855 --> 00:48:38.235
worse.

00:48:38.735 --> 00:48:40.436
They probably won't get better.

00:48:40.456 --> 00:48:41.376
They might not get better.

00:48:41.396 --> 00:48:42.878
They're never going to get worse.

00:48:43.641 --> 00:48:45.623
I'm not going to send somebody back with

00:48:45.663 --> 00:48:48.123
an unexpected bill because then they're

00:48:48.143 --> 00:48:50.206
going to get mad at you for sending

00:48:50.246 --> 00:48:52.568
them to me and getting a three hundred

00:48:52.608 --> 00:48:54.148
dollar bill that they didn't know about.

00:48:55.358 --> 00:48:57.240
And I'm going to keep it easy.

00:48:57.260 --> 00:48:58.983
I'm never going to ask you for op

00:48:59.003 --> 00:49:01.824
reports and studies and all this other

00:49:01.864 --> 00:49:02.306
stuff.

00:49:02.405 --> 00:49:04.248
I am not going to bother your office,

00:49:04.288 --> 00:49:07.971
your admin, or you for anything.

00:49:08.331 --> 00:49:09.813
We just had a woman come in the

00:49:09.853 --> 00:49:10.253
other day.

00:49:10.293 --> 00:49:12.275
She actually was a physical therapist.

00:49:12.655 --> 00:49:15.599
She took a position as a liaison between

00:49:15.719 --> 00:49:18.402
physicians for a local big hospital group.

00:49:19.061 --> 00:49:21.664
and outpatient providers and and she came

00:49:21.724 --> 00:49:22.826
in and said hey you know i just

00:49:22.846 --> 00:49:24.847
want to check how are things going are

00:49:24.867 --> 00:49:27.271
you happy with the orthopedics and the

00:49:27.311 --> 00:49:29.733
referrals and we're like yeah you know i

00:49:29.753 --> 00:49:31.355
don't know everything's great we got

00:49:31.394 --> 00:49:33.237
plenty of patients she's like do you have

00:49:33.297 --> 00:49:35.179
any ever have any problems you know

00:49:35.219 --> 00:49:37.822
requesting reports or anything else like i

00:49:37.842 --> 00:49:39.284
don't ever request a report

00:49:39.824 --> 00:49:41.744
I've got chat GPT and Google.

00:49:42.164 --> 00:49:44.146
I'm never going to bother somebody who's

00:49:44.186 --> 00:49:47.226
sending me patients and give them jobs to

00:49:47.286 --> 00:49:47.547
do.

00:49:47.626 --> 00:49:48.347
Like, that's not,

00:49:48.487 --> 00:49:49.668
that's not what I'm here for.

00:49:49.688 --> 00:49:50.228
And she was like, Oh,

00:49:50.288 --> 00:49:51.688
don't ever worry about that.

00:49:52.168 --> 00:49:53.768
If you need a protocol or whatever,

00:49:53.809 --> 00:49:55.170
I'm like, all right,

00:49:55.289 --> 00:49:56.449
I appreciate you saying that,

00:49:56.550 --> 00:49:57.590
but I'm never going to do it.

00:49:57.710 --> 00:50:00.391
I'm never going to put, you know,

00:50:00.452 --> 00:50:03.932
a responsibility on them to make my life

00:50:04.032 --> 00:50:04.432
easier.

00:50:04.652 --> 00:50:06.253
I'm here to make their life easier.

00:50:06.655 --> 00:50:08.117
I mean, everything that Tony was saying,

00:50:08.217 --> 00:50:10.018
I use the analogy from Eight Mile.

00:50:10.059 --> 00:50:12.402
You took every bullet out of their gun.

00:50:12.601 --> 00:50:14.202
You're like, is this another?

00:50:14.222 --> 00:50:15.565
Because they see PT, right?

00:50:15.644 --> 00:50:16.786
We love to throw those letters.

00:50:17.045 --> 00:50:17.726
I'm a PT.

00:50:17.827 --> 00:50:18.447
I'm a PT.

00:50:18.807 --> 00:50:20.268
Maybe they've had bad experiences.

00:50:20.409 --> 00:50:21.570
Everything that Tony just said,

00:50:22.050 --> 00:50:23.713
maybe someone did all those things.

00:50:23.733 --> 00:50:24.193
They're like, oh,

00:50:24.233 --> 00:50:26.034
here comes another one of these nimrods.

00:50:26.514 --> 00:50:28.436
And you just say, real high end.

00:50:29.570 --> 00:50:32.032
Talking to them about them.

00:50:32.492 --> 00:50:33.653
Do you hate when this happens?

00:50:33.833 --> 00:50:34.614
Yeah, we don't do that.

00:50:34.653 --> 00:50:35.315
Do you hate this?

00:50:35.635 --> 00:50:36.476
Also don't do that.

00:50:36.735 --> 00:50:37.456
Do you need this?

00:50:37.675 --> 00:50:38.456
We do do that.

00:50:39.036 --> 00:50:40.878
Here's how we can work together.

00:50:40.978 --> 00:50:42.880
Keep it simple and make it about them.

00:50:43.179 --> 00:50:44.260
Some people might put how many

00:50:44.320 --> 00:50:45.742
certifications they had or how many

00:50:45.782 --> 00:50:46.561
courses they went to.

00:50:46.902 --> 00:50:47.862
Cool story, bro.

00:50:48.123 --> 00:50:48.744
Tell it again.

00:50:49.143 --> 00:50:49.804
No one cares.

00:50:50.045 --> 00:50:50.605
No one cares.

00:50:50.965 --> 00:50:52.686
How are you going to make my day

00:50:52.847 --> 00:50:53.746
easier and better?

00:50:54.748 --> 00:50:55.748
You think from their end.

00:50:55.789 --> 00:50:56.829
What are their biggest, hairiest,

00:50:56.849 --> 00:50:57.690
scariest problems?

00:50:58.369 --> 00:50:58.891
Ask them.

00:50:59.891 --> 00:51:00.411
Ask them.

00:51:01.112 --> 00:51:02.492
Or maybe you ask a bunch of doctors

00:51:02.512 --> 00:51:03.193
and they don't refer to you,

00:51:03.213 --> 00:51:04.713
but then the fifteenth, you take all that,

00:51:05.074 --> 00:51:06.235
all those problems and you say, oh,

00:51:06.275 --> 00:51:07.155
I finally understand.

00:51:07.576 --> 00:51:09.177
I'm in the problem removal business.

00:51:09.617 --> 00:51:12.318
Not in the talk to people about how

00:51:12.378 --> 00:51:13.639
smart and how many credentials I have

00:51:13.679 --> 00:51:13.980
business.

00:51:14.000 --> 00:51:14.681
That ain't it.

00:51:14.701 --> 00:51:15.161
That ain't it.

00:51:16.074 --> 00:51:17.295
You know, a couple years ago,

00:51:17.976 --> 00:51:19.358
couple being like ten,

00:51:20.340 --> 00:51:21.882
I did an interview with one of my

00:51:21.942 --> 00:51:24.505
local non-surgical orthopedic guys.

00:51:25.164 --> 00:51:26.806
And before the interview,

00:51:27.047 --> 00:51:28.208
the interview was for him.

00:51:28.329 --> 00:51:29.751
It was, hey, tell me what you're doing,

00:51:29.791 --> 00:51:30.231
what's new,

00:51:30.271 --> 00:51:31.333
what's going on in the practice.

00:51:31.793 --> 00:51:34.215
But about ten to fifteen minutes before

00:51:34.235 --> 00:51:35.476
the interview, I said, hey,

00:51:36.197 --> 00:51:38.639
Before we hit record, which I recorded,

00:51:38.699 --> 00:51:39.900
I told them I'm recording this,

00:51:39.920 --> 00:51:42.081
but before we record for your audience,

00:51:42.840 --> 00:51:44.561
I want to record for my audience,

00:51:44.621 --> 00:51:46.722
my audience being other therapists.

00:51:47.364 --> 00:51:49.204
Tell me unbiased,

00:51:49.324 --> 00:51:51.746
tell me behind the scenes, like,

00:51:52.346 --> 00:51:54.067
are you happy with, you know,

00:51:54.166 --> 00:51:56.307
how therapists are currently marketing to

00:51:56.367 --> 00:51:56.788
you?

00:51:57.809 --> 00:51:59.469
What are things that therapists could do

00:51:59.530 --> 00:52:00.090
better?

00:52:00.170 --> 00:52:01.590
Like, how does this all work?

00:52:02.489 --> 00:52:03.050
And truthfully,

00:52:03.289 --> 00:52:05.552
I don't remember a lot of the responses,

00:52:06.112 --> 00:52:07.574
but basically it was the same thing.

00:52:07.733 --> 00:52:08.474
He was like, look,

00:52:08.894 --> 00:52:10.938
don't wait around my office to talk to

00:52:10.958 --> 00:52:12.079
me because I'm busy.

00:52:12.139 --> 00:52:12.880
I've got patients,

00:52:12.900 --> 00:52:14.240
I've got other responsibilities.

00:52:14.681 --> 00:52:17.264
Don't do things that draw my time away

00:52:17.324 --> 00:52:18.846
from what I'm already doing.

00:52:19.485 --> 00:52:22.068
and you know just be a normal person

00:52:22.248 --> 00:52:24.710
like i know you want business i know

00:52:24.731 --> 00:52:26.492
you want me to send you patients i'll

00:52:26.532 --> 00:52:28.795
send you a few if it works out

00:52:29.295 --> 00:52:31.938
awesome but you you just stay out of

00:52:31.978 --> 00:52:34.760
my hair and and let me do my

00:52:34.820 --> 00:52:37.963
job um and that was that was a

00:52:38.003 --> 00:52:40.826
good experience as we're wrapping up

00:52:41.867 --> 00:52:44.291
So I had ChatGPT put this together for

00:52:44.331 --> 00:52:44.530
me.

00:52:45.472 --> 00:52:46.873
I think we're going to keep seeing...

00:52:47.335 --> 00:52:48.056
Wait, that's fake?

00:52:48.096 --> 00:52:48.536
You made that?

00:52:48.556 --> 00:52:49.478
Yeah, yeah, a hundred percent.

00:52:52.514 --> 00:52:52.795
I said,

00:52:53.195 --> 00:52:56.639
put the coffee stain circle on the page.

00:52:56.719 --> 00:52:57.981
Oh, my God.

00:52:58.581 --> 00:53:00.784
So we're going to see more.

00:53:01.284 --> 00:53:01.784
The headline,

00:53:01.824 --> 00:53:03.306
if you're listening and not watching,

00:53:03.746 --> 00:53:06.670
says this popular cash pay discount could

00:53:06.710 --> 00:53:08.112
cost you your license.

00:53:08.132 --> 00:53:09.632
Wow.

00:53:09.713 --> 00:53:11.896
I'd be interested to see where this goes.

00:53:14.117 --> 00:53:14.936
I know where it's going to go.

00:53:14.976 --> 00:53:16.518
Dave's going to get elected to the State

00:53:16.539 --> 00:53:17.800
Board of Physical Therapy in New York

00:53:17.820 --> 00:53:18.820
because we're going to put together a

00:53:19.021 --> 00:53:21.643
banging application in eleven minutes or

00:53:21.702 --> 00:53:24.125
less with Dave's background.

00:53:24.244 --> 00:53:26.567
Maybe, maybe.

00:53:26.827 --> 00:53:28.509
But I'll tell you,

00:53:28.528 --> 00:53:30.369
just get rid of your license is a

00:53:30.389 --> 00:53:31.311
lot faster and easier.

00:53:31.331 --> 00:53:32.992
A lot less work.

00:53:33.353 --> 00:53:34.713
I would love to hear someone have the

00:53:35.393 --> 00:53:36.835
argument against that.

00:53:36.936 --> 00:53:37.195
Right.

00:53:37.275 --> 00:53:38.637
Because as soon as you make the

00:53:38.697 --> 00:53:40.237
regulations so friction filled.

00:53:41.280 --> 00:53:43.079
I either jump over that fence and every

00:53:43.119 --> 00:53:43.920
time I jumped the fence,

00:53:44.101 --> 00:53:46.320
raise the fence or I go,

00:53:46.541 --> 00:53:48.041
I'm just going to walk around the fence.

00:53:48.581 --> 00:53:49.922
And anyone watching or listening,

00:53:50.001 --> 00:53:51.422
if you hear me say that, like,

00:53:51.842 --> 00:53:52.382
then yes,

00:53:52.402 --> 00:53:53.621
of course we wouldn't be able to bill

00:53:53.641 --> 00:53:54.101
insurance.

00:53:54.382 --> 00:53:55.782
That just goes without saying, like,

00:53:55.802 --> 00:53:56.202
that's fine.

00:53:56.222 --> 00:53:57.922
Like we do bill some, you know,

00:53:57.983 --> 00:53:59.742
the big five out of network insurances,

00:54:00.543 --> 00:54:01.304
but then it's like, Hey,

00:54:01.324 --> 00:54:01.864
we could just get,

00:54:02.003 --> 00:54:03.503
we could just get even more creative and

00:54:03.523 --> 00:54:05.103
just double down on the packages and,

00:54:05.563 --> 00:54:06.603
you know, do like the,

00:54:06.905 --> 00:54:09.244
the trip wire type of a lower cost.

00:54:10.235 --> 00:54:11.735
charges for the first visit to get people

00:54:11.835 --> 00:54:11.996
in.

00:54:12.896 --> 00:54:15.538
Not ideal.

00:54:15.577 --> 00:54:16.398
That wouldn't be great.

00:54:16.559 --> 00:54:19.079
How does that change the protection of the

00:54:19.119 --> 00:54:19.559
consumer?

00:54:19.679 --> 00:54:20.041
It doesn't.

00:54:20.300 --> 00:54:20.920
It does not.

00:54:20.940 --> 00:54:21.922
That's the thing.

00:54:22.021 --> 00:54:23.802
It's removing access, right?

00:54:23.902 --> 00:54:25.503
And there's a bunch of therapists who work

00:54:25.543 --> 00:54:27.003
at practices that are primarily

00:54:27.023 --> 00:54:27.605
insurance-based.

00:54:28.405 --> 00:54:29.706
This is affecting them.

00:54:29.746 --> 00:54:30.567
It's not helping them.

00:54:31.447 --> 00:54:32.548
Someone would need to make a better case

00:54:32.568 --> 00:54:33.871
to me why this is a good idea.

00:54:33.911 --> 00:54:36.413
Because I don't think that it is.

00:54:37.173 --> 00:54:39.255
Very rarely are we all a hundred percent

00:54:39.295 --> 00:54:39.836
in agreement.

00:54:39.876 --> 00:54:42.298
And this is, I think, one of those.

00:54:42.659 --> 00:54:44.081
It's a rare moment.

00:54:44.240 --> 00:54:45.342
For everybody.

00:54:45.461 --> 00:54:47.864
Like, I don't see a positive,

00:54:47.923 --> 00:54:49.186
but maybe we're just not seeing it.

00:54:49.206 --> 00:54:50.146
And that's a possibility.

00:54:50.206 --> 00:54:50.867
And I, you know,

00:54:51.367 --> 00:54:52.628
that's the smartest way to never look like

00:54:52.648 --> 00:54:53.469
an idiot is be like, well,

00:54:53.530 --> 00:54:54.331
if there's a possibility,

00:54:54.371 --> 00:54:55.311
I'd love to have someone explain it to

00:54:55.331 --> 00:54:56.652
me like I'm an eighth grader.

00:54:57.253 --> 00:54:58.213
We're open to that.

00:54:58.994 --> 00:55:00.797
I mean, can we, oh, here's my next,

00:55:00.817 --> 00:55:01.737
here's what I'll do when we hang up.

00:55:02.539 --> 00:55:04.320
Can we see who these people are on

00:55:04.360 --> 00:55:05.121
these boards?

00:55:05.181 --> 00:55:07.521
Can we invite them to explain this to

00:55:07.561 --> 00:55:08.001
me?

00:55:08.103 --> 00:55:10.284
So good luck.

00:55:10.583 --> 00:55:13.224
And somebody had shared who who makes up

00:55:13.264 --> 00:55:13.824
the board.

00:55:14.005 --> 00:55:15.005
I think it was for Texas.

00:55:15.065 --> 00:55:15.686
But yeah, I mean,

00:55:15.706 --> 00:55:17.027
it's all public information.

00:55:17.586 --> 00:55:19.126
And like you said, my first thought,

00:55:19.228 --> 00:55:20.847
I thought you would have said it earlier.

00:55:21.608 --> 00:55:23.028
Let's go come on the board,

00:55:23.108 --> 00:55:24.769
like come on the show, talk to us,

00:55:24.849 --> 00:55:26.210
inform us, educate us,

00:55:26.251 --> 00:55:27.931
because otherwise we're just going to make

00:55:27.971 --> 00:55:28.512
assumptions.

00:55:29.351 --> 00:55:32.032
So parting shots, I'll go first.

00:55:32.532 --> 00:55:33.733
I tell my kids all the time.

00:55:34.313 --> 00:55:35.373
I'm like, guys,

00:55:35.974 --> 00:55:38.956
if mom tells you you are not allowed

00:55:39.016 --> 00:55:41.177
to fish at the river,

00:55:42.333 --> 00:55:44.277
There's a zero percent chance you're gonna

00:55:44.317 --> 00:55:46.179
drown in the river if you're never allowed

00:55:46.219 --> 00:55:47.599
to go to the river Even if it's

00:55:47.619 --> 00:55:49.722
a point zero zero zero zero one percent

00:55:49.742 --> 00:55:51.063
chance that you will hit your head and

00:55:51.083 --> 00:55:54.547
drown in six inches of water The easiest

00:55:54.608 --> 00:55:57.190
way to a limit one hundred percent of

00:55:57.210 --> 00:55:59.693
the chances to just say no and that

00:55:59.733 --> 00:56:01.556
is what we are seeing here even if

00:56:01.615 --> 00:56:03.538
thousands of people could benefit and

00:56:04.224 --> 00:56:06.505
you're eliminating the chance that one

00:56:06.545 --> 00:56:09.565
person doesn't isn't happy with the rule

00:56:09.905 --> 00:56:11.826
by simply saying you're not allowed to do

00:56:11.885 --> 00:56:17.407
it yeah that's not okay dave i don't

00:56:17.427 --> 00:56:19.947
know i can't imagine what number of each

00:56:20.128 --> 00:56:21.668
in each of these states like what number

00:56:21.768 --> 00:56:24.088
of complaints resulted in this even being

00:56:24.148 --> 00:56:26.449
potentially drafted like and it there's no

00:56:26.489 --> 00:56:28.269
way it's hundreds there's no way it's

00:56:28.289 --> 00:56:30.530
hundreds of complaints so are we talking

00:56:30.849 --> 00:56:32.710
twelve twenty two

00:56:33.503 --> 00:56:35.085
complaint, like, it's insane.

00:56:36.184 --> 00:56:37.264
Let's let it work, too.

00:56:37.304 --> 00:56:38.166
And now there's twelve.

00:56:38.186 --> 00:56:39.425
So that's a four thousand percent

00:56:39.445 --> 00:56:40.407
increase, right?

00:56:40.487 --> 00:56:40.887
Yeah.

00:56:40.967 --> 00:56:41.286
Yeah.

00:56:41.347 --> 00:56:41.806
Well,

00:56:42.927 --> 00:56:44.507
and it's just people that got offended,

00:56:44.967 --> 00:56:45.427
probably.

00:56:45.527 --> 00:56:45.668
Right.

00:56:45.708 --> 00:56:46.889
It's just it's just consumers that got

00:56:46.929 --> 00:56:47.349
offended.

00:56:47.469 --> 00:56:50.190
So I don't understand that.

00:56:50.349 --> 00:56:50.530
Like,

00:56:50.550 --> 00:56:53.610
if you got offended and you call it

00:56:53.630 --> 00:56:55.411
a practice and you got offended that they

00:56:55.472 --> 00:56:58.413
do this cash pay discount to sell

00:56:58.452 --> 00:56:59.012
packages,

00:57:00.893 --> 00:57:01.094
just

00:57:01.672 --> 00:57:03.574
go and get your in-network physical

00:57:03.594 --> 00:57:06.255
therapy and get treated in a busy clinic

00:57:06.476 --> 00:57:08.597
and just call it a day.

00:57:09.378 --> 00:57:12.719
It doesn't make sense why try to change

00:57:12.739 --> 00:57:14.481
someone else's business model because

00:57:14.521 --> 00:57:16.922
you're offended or it's a threat or

00:57:16.981 --> 00:57:17.402
whatever.

00:57:17.603 --> 00:57:18.663
It just doesn't even make sense to me.

00:57:18.682 --> 00:57:18.802
No.

00:57:19.523 --> 00:57:19.724
All right.

00:57:19.744 --> 00:57:22.666
My parting shot will be jab, jab, jab,

00:57:22.706 --> 00:57:23.065
right hook.

00:57:23.106 --> 00:57:24.146
We talked about referrals.

00:57:25.045 --> 00:57:26.266
We were talking about the people,

00:57:26.586 --> 00:57:28.427
but the strategy that Tony talked about

00:57:28.507 --> 00:57:31.048
and that Dave does is, hey,

00:57:31.268 --> 00:57:32.590
how do I help me help you?

00:57:32.670 --> 00:57:33.510
How do I help you?

00:57:33.530 --> 00:57:35.030
You know, let me help you.

00:57:35.130 --> 00:57:37.253
And then it's a great relationship when

00:57:37.293 --> 00:57:37.572
it's not.

00:57:37.592 --> 00:57:39.773
So jab, jab, jab, right hook is give,

00:57:39.793 --> 00:57:42.414
give, give before you ever ask at all.

00:57:42.735 --> 00:57:43.536
We're back on Tuesday.

00:57:43.576 --> 00:57:44.295
I like this format.

00:57:44.315 --> 00:57:44.777
That was fun.

00:57:44.797 --> 00:57:46.036
A little six pack real quick.

00:57:46.077 --> 00:57:46.958
All right, gentlemen, we'll talk soon.

00:57:49.856 --> 00:57:50.056
That's it.

00:57:50.076 --> 00:57:50.317
We're out.

00:57:50.336 --> 00:57:51.856
Boys, what the hell are you doing?

00:57:51.896 --> 00:57:54.717
Follow Tony Meritato on YouTube at Total

00:57:54.757 --> 00:57:55.798
Therapy Solution.

00:57:55.938 --> 00:57:56.838
Find Dave Kittle at

00:57:56.858 --> 00:58:00.059
conciergepainrelief.com and on YouTube at

00:58:00.079 --> 00:58:01.360
The Dave Kittle Show.

00:58:01.581 --> 00:58:04.481
And follow Jimmy McKay at PT Podcasts on

00:58:04.621 --> 00:58:05.882
YouTube, the socials,

00:58:05.981 --> 00:58:07.762
and wherever you binge podcasts you

00:58:07.782 --> 00:58:09.463
pretend are for CEUs.

00:58:09.764 --> 00:58:11.164
And hey, just a reminder,

00:58:11.684 --> 00:58:12.985
none of this was for advice.

00:58:13.025 --> 00:58:14.485
This was for entertainment only.

00:58:14.786 --> 00:58:16.166
Our lawyers say that counts.

00:58:16.246 --> 00:58:17.126
Thanks, Keith.