How to Make Physical Therapy Irresistible Again

0:10 There we go. We got intro music now. I set my roadcaster back up, and now I feel like we're a radio show again. Welcome to PT Breakfast Club. I am coming to you from the frozen tundra, which is redundant because tundra means frozen ground. But I used to like it when they used to do those... What were those videos? On ESPN, they would update the week and they would always do Welcome to Green Bay on the Frozen. They would essentially turn a football game into a Smithsonian or National Geographic movie. Ken Burns it. Anyway, that's why I'm wearing a winter hat right now because it's cold in my house and I got the fire going in the background.

0:54 I'm Jimmy McKay. That's Tony Maritato. Dave Kittle is in the wild. We've got our grout fit on. Yes, we do. We're going to wait. I have two topics teed up. I'm going to talk about an APTA Facebook post that went sideways and how to make it not go sideways anymore. And did you see, oh, you saw on LinkedIn because you liked it. We mentioned before, I've been doing a series of posts to increase visibility. And I've been sort of doing, quote, the work for free in public, but then giving it away. What I mean by that is I'm on LinkedIn going, hey, if MedBridge hired Jimmy McKay tomorrow, here's the first three things that I would do from a communications visibility standpoint.

1:37 And here, I mean, I'll give you the recipe. I don't care. I go to AI and I have a formula that I want the post to be. And then I go to MedBridge as well. I just have like a little sequence. I go to their website. I make a point where I don't hang out on the website or the socials for more than sixty seconds. And that's probably longer than I should be. And what I'm doing is I'm trying to put myself in the shoes of if I'm just a regular person tripping across MedBridge's website, Instagram, whatever, what do they see, hear, smell, taste, all of it. Because I'm asking, what I want to give AI is, what's the snapshot view? Is someone sticking around?

2:18 What do they think they do? And then I use all these things. So I hang out for about twenty minutes to a half hour, compiling and talking. And then I write this post. And of course I tag the company in it. I've been doing that. And I've gotten four phone calls booked from decent... And people, you know, position wise in these organizations, MedBridge, a couple of the other ones. I'm excited to see where it goes. I had one of them yesterday. It was a really great conversation. It's cool. I did. And you saw the one I did last night, right? Yeah, I did concierge pain relief. So the people who know, know. The people who know, understand what you're doing, why you're doing it. They had great responses to it. My question to you, and I think for the audience watching, listening, how do we apply that to a private practice?

3:05 How do we apply that to a regular therapist, practice owner who wants to do this right now? Do it yourself. Go to your own website, right? And then train the GPT or just start the discussion. Hey, listen, it's really hard to look at ourselves. It's really hard to take stock of what we do, right? It's hard to tell our own story hardest because you have this thing I said before called the curse of knowledge. You know too much. So do that. Do exactly what I just said. Screenshot your own website. Put it in ChatGPT. Go to your own socials. Maybe you can take the screenshot or a couple of videos that you've done. Just break them down. And then explain who your ICP is. Who is the person you're trying to talk to?

3:47 Who is your ideal customer profile? Who is it? And then is it obvious to them based on what I've given you of what they get out of it, why they should pick you, all those things? And then run a self-analysis. And then... Take that information and honestly try to synthesize it. It's simple, not easy. So Dave's here. I want to hear Dave's. Did you see my LinkedIn post about you last night? You're not on LinkedIn at like eleven o'clock at night like I am. I'm actually striving to go to bed closer to ten, ten thirty these days. I think I shared it way before that. But the series of videos I'm doing, if I worked for XYZ, here's the first three things I do.

4:28 I did you last night because I was like, oh, I'll do it, and then Dave will see it, and we'll have something to talk about. But maybe this is better. Maybe we're getting a cold snapshot. Walk me through it. I haven't seen it. Give me a second here while I bring it up because I share a lot. I've turned LinkedIn in the last month into my personal Twitter because Twitter, I've – I got to be honest, I used to be a huge fan of it. And now I think it's a garbage dump. I hope it comes back. But I've sort of started to treat LinkedIn that way. It doesn't really operate that way. People aren't as fast and don't have as many conversations. But here's here it is. So, and I purpose, I'm just going to like reveal the thing. I purposely did things I already know that you're working on, but I needed to talk about it.

5:11 It's all right. If concierge pain relief, uh, is this on the screen? Can you guys say this? Oh no, no, that's not stupid. All right, there we go. If concierge pain relief hired Jimmy McKay, me tomorrow, here are the first three things I do. Yes, I'm saying this publicly. Free ideas. You're welcome, Dave Kittle. It's doing a lot right. New York City House Calls, still the most slept on differentiator in the entire industry. I still believe that. Still a clear three-step process patients actually understand. So do this, do that, get that. And we'll talk about that at the end and how you have that and how you did that. That was a while ago that we talked about that. Been doing it, baby. Here's the truth most PT clinics don't want to hear. Everybody says they're one-on-one, but Dave actually is in New York City.

5:54 And CPR is sitting on something most clinics would kill for. A real New York City concierge PT brand, elite patient results, and a YouTube channel that's already better than ninety five percent of health content online, but still undiscovered. So I said, let's fix that in three step. I, we've talked about this before. I would hire a videographer, a D rock. If your friend, if you're a fan of Gary V, I would just have someone be like, get the right person, invest in it and say, this person is just going to follow Dave around or one of his clinicians around all day. And he's going to follow clinician two on Tuesday, clinician three on Wednesday. And then they're going to turn it into the showing of new real New York apartments, real patients, real problems and solutions that were delivered behind the scenes. I said in this post, this is tick tock crack.

6:37 Kids, don't smoke crack. Kids, this is TikTok crack. Turn the invisible into the unforgettable. I like turn the invisible into the visible. Number two, turn patient transformation into stories, not statements. Even if you just went back through your reviews... You could do those. You don't need the person sitting in front of you. You could have the clinician read the review about them and talk about them. I like that. I like that. And de-identify them. Do you remember who this person was saying these glowing things about you? Oh, my gosh. Yes, that was that person on the Upper East Side, and she had the thing. Oh, my God. Why do you think this resonated? She couldn't do the thing, and now she can go get bagels again, and she couldn't get her newspaper.

7:18 I don't know. Uh, stop patient, stop posting patient had knee pain. Now better start posting a Broadway dancer. Couldn't make opening night. And now we got them to curtain up. A founder couldn't sit for board meetings. Here's how we fixed that in forty eight hours on call. People don't remember improvements. They remember story arcs. New York City is an island full of arcs. And then the last one, I think when you talk about I purposefully left this sort of Easter egg in there. So Dave would have something to pick at. Your YouTube channel is good. You have someone else doing it. Keep doing that. But... Hang on, hang on, hang on. Dave, do you have a YouTube channel for your business? No, no. I just wanted to clarify that. So thank you, Tony, for... That was the thing I left in there that was like, well, actually...

7:59 So your YouTube channel is clinician-facing. And I still think that concierge pain relief... Because I looked and I didn't see one, but that doesn't mean there isn't one. There isn't one though, right? Yeah. No, I have spoken with Nate about it. I actually talked to Nate about this before I ever started the Dave Kittle show. So yes, it's in the works. It's just a lot on my plate. So I need to delegate stuff. But yeah, it's somewhere in the pipeline. You would tell me which one leads to revenue faster, Dave Kittle talking to clinicians or Dave Kittle talking to patients? Well, just to clarify, you guys know this, but for the audience, the owner, the physical therapy practice owner or clinician facing YouTube is meant for off-market deal flow for owners to reach out to me to potentially sell their practice.

8:43 So that's a long-term play. It's not short-term income. Yeah, it's not. Yes, a YouTube, a consumer-facing patient, prospective patient-facing YouTube would be money in the bank sooner and will help with lead gen and marketing and nurturing leads or people over time or all that to get more leads. So that would be sooner or near-term new patients, which would be money in the bank. Yeah. Dave's current YouTube channel is going to pay college tuition. And if there's even a college when his kid is, you know, in, in, in nineteen, in eighteen years, whatever it is, if we're on the move, Mars College is going to be expensive.

9:23 University of Mars is going to be super expensive. I love the fact like Tony's actually just have, he's like, he just had to dip out of the live stream because he's like, I gotta give out, gotta go. It doesn't even say it. Real stuff. I love it. Good morning. So, so this strategy, by the way, before you jumped on, has worked. I have four phone calls with four organizations that I did profiles of. Not bad, right? Like if I'm poking the bear in a good way, I hope people see that, right? Like I'm poking the bear in a good way where I'm like, hey, listen, you're brilliant. You're great. Why don't we do more of this? So that's the idea. I love it. I love it. Okay. I promised I would talk about this topic too. Or do you have it? What do you want to talk about? Because I have other topics that I've teed up. Well, I still haven't even opened LinkedIn as we've been talking.

10:07 Any comments, anything underneath that? Oh, that's a good question. Did anybody comment on that? I don't like how LinkedIn, I've got to like go scrolling and scrolling. Yes, one guy. Oh, yeah, a bunch. You got ten comments. First of all, I read this guy's name. This is a real PT's name. His name is, I'm going to put it back on the screen. This sounds made up. He sounds like the most interesting man. I think I know what name you're talking about. He sounds like the Dos Equis guy. Dr. Freeborn Mondello. Yes. I am not making fun. That is the coolest name I've ever heard. Is that real? Like, that sounds like you're the Joe Sickies guy. That's what the Joe Sickies guy's real name is.

10:49 I think it's real. Freeborn Mondello. That's the coolest name I've ever heard. Right? So he goes, hey, love the advice. He says he's constantly struggling to tell his brand story. And I went to his website, which actually looks very, very good. He says, I'm constantly struggling to tell the story in a way that resonates and hits home. Sure does not come naturally to me, or it seems like most of us in the PT world, far easier to scale up clinical skills. But those sure don't fill the schedule. And here's my response, and I'll say it again. Dr. Freeborn Mondello, two things. One, telling your story is simple, but it doesn't mean it's easy. If you don't have the T's and P's, it can get harder.

11:31 I call the T's and P's, you need the tools, the training, the time, the people, and the process. If you don't have all those five things, everything is like Sisyphus pushing a rock up the hill. It's hard. And it says it's far easier to tell someone else's story than your own because you have the curse of knowledge. You know too much. You're trying to tell forty different aspects. You can't. And the number four, I said, I'm bad at math because in the beginning I said two things. But then I told fourth, I said three things. So, Dr. Freeborn Mondello, you're not off. And this is not a random problem. You are. that you're common what else will boyd said this would make great this is why i did it see i said this he said this would make great breakfast club episode i said i mean because i timed it when did i release this uh last night at i don't know fourteen hours ago i don't can't do math um and then somebody i remember ben galen commented let me see if i can find ben galen's comment He said something along the line of, I would love to see the step counts for his clinicians in New York City.

12:30 And that made me think. A lot of offices do fantasy football leagues to build community. Dude, yours are never... You can't hear me? It's got to be you. I can hear me. Reload. Dave's clinicians are most likely never together in the same office. They're out on their own. They're in the wild of New York City. What are they going to do? They communicate via text. I'm pretty sure he has them come in every once in a while. But my point is Ben Galen had a comment. I'll find it eventually. And he said, wow, I'd love to see the step count on those PTs, you know, up and down subway stairs and, you know, left and right and up and down long avenues. Like, yes, absolutely.

13:11 I think that would be a cooler team building thing than fantasy football. The cooler team building thing would be a step count. Can you hear me now, Dave? I'm back. I can hear you. Thanks. So I was saying, instead of fantasy football, you're clinicians, and you guys should do step count Olympics, like who wins the day, the week, the quarter, the year, because you guys are all over. You're walking. I'm walking here in New York City, right, as Dustin Hoffman would say in that movie with Robert Redford that I can't remember the name. So that would be something, because that's my point. Ben Galen's thing, I want to see what their step count is, proves my point about the stories. He's not from New York City. So to him, you live in like... movie set and you're doing the thing that he does but in a different way people want to see that not just pts patients need to see that pts want to see that you need you need like well ryan sir hand does a good job of that right he does he's got he's he's crushing it well yes when he makes a sale he gets a gajillion dollars and he can just be like give a gajillion dollars to three vote videographers and that's my neck but that's point like I made a post the other day on LinkedIn that said, like, twenty twenty six.

14:22 I don't think I need to convince anybody that content's important anymore. I think I needed to convince people five years ago. We're past that. Now people are at the bottom of the hill going fudge. What do I do? I do a phone. I hire someone. What does that cost? One hundred thousand dollars. Fifty dollars. What? I don't know. It's overwhelming. What was that comment there where you had my logo on the post? That's the that's the post. Okay, I thought it was a comment. No, no, no. So I so what I've also been doing is I'm getting more visibility when I put the logo. So I was just doing a regular post with just text. And then I decided to copy and paste the logo for recognition, because you see how LinkedIn works. It only shows the first two lines of text, which means I need to make the LinkedIn post first two lines really spicy.

15:08 And then I put the logo there because we like visuals. So that's what I was doing. I don't know what happened, but your camera went off, but it's OK because it's a podcast. So anyway, that's what I did there. But I also did I also put that thing in about your YouTube channel because I knew that. But I wanted I wanted you to be able to be like, well, I'm on it. Don't worry about it, bro. I don't know. Dave can't hear anything. That's okay. It's a podcast. All right. We'll stay with the theme of LinkedIn then. And I made another post. I know this shocks people who are fans of the show. I've, again, tried to turn my LinkedIn channel, my LinkedIn page into what Twitter used to be. So I'll bring this one up. And I feel like I need to preface this by saying some things.

15:52 I don't know what's going on. We're having some issues. All right. There we go. So here's what I did last night as well. I'll stay in on LinkedIn, and if you have a topic, we can jump in. I'm waiting for Tony to come back because I have a topic with him, but he's treating a patient right now. From first glance, it looks like I'm taking shots at the APTA, and I kind of am, but I'm doing it like a cousin with love. And here's what I keep, because I talk to so many people who volunteer at APTA in leadership positions so often. And I think sometimes Jimmy comes across like the insane person. And I know Dave can attest because Dave's been on the other side of Jimmy. Sometimes Dave looks at Jimmy and the world looks at Jimmy like this.

16:39 That's just entrepreneurship, by the way. It is, right? That's a lot of days. The problem is I feel like I'm like, I have the answer. How can you not see this? It's very obvious. So here's what I'm talking about with APTA. And again, I'm precocious by saying, and if you're a friend of mine and you work with APTA, you know I'm rooting for APTA. but I will not follow you blindly. I'm not going to do it. I'm not just going to clap if I see you going off the rails. So this whole post, and I had created a video, which is starting to get some steam on Love's YouTube and Instagram. APTA talks about facts. They talk about features. It's an easy way to remember the difference, right?

17:21 Facts and features both start with F, right? Features, facts. People buy things based on benefits. Those are emotion-based. So there was a post. Are you in the Uncaged Clinician Facebook group? I am, yes. Those guys are awesome. Go look for them. They have like sixteen thousand therapists. They do respect. I've known one of the co-creators, David Bailiff, for close to ten years. He's incredible. I suggest to them to turn off the anonymous post. But again, that's just my bias. Dave has I was who cares about let's do anonymous posting. And now I am super anti unless very like in less than one percent of the situations.

18:05 That's a side. Stop getting me off track, David. Um, so my post was physical therapists are smart. Stop pretending they're stupid. When this post that was made by a friend of the show who did it with good intentions, I won't call him out, but if you go to the Facebook group, you can see what it was. He was essentially trying to get people to rally and come to APTA. And he did it the wrong way. Because what he's saying was, and he's right. Here's the funny part. Everybody's right in this situation, except you're doing it the wrong way. My point is, he jumped into the comments or made a post and said, APTA is doing all these amazing things. We do advocacy.

18:46 There's all these behind-the-scenes things that you don't see. We'll get to that. I know what you're going to say about that. You do all these things. Show it. Don't freaking tell me you're doing amazing things by doing it. Don't get me side questing. The person who made this post was factually one hundred percent correct. This person went and had the receipts. Anytime he said something, he posted a link to it. Awesome. Except here was the problem in the comment section. People were talking about their emotions and what they're feeling every day as clinicians or owners. And they are also right. So you just have two people yelling past each other.

19:27 This is like the cliche of every movie where the parents are getting divorced. They're just yelling past each other. You don't take out the garbage. You don't love me anymore. Fact. You don't take the garbage out. Fact. You don't love me anymore. And then all you do, it's just Rottweilers barking at Rottweilers. That's all it is. Just dogs barking at each other. And the funny part is, do you ever see those videos where the dogs are barking at each other through the fence? And then they wheel the fence back and the dogs are just like, Oh, hey, what's up? You're so wrong. That analogy, man, that could fit for a current segment across the country in many ways. Yes. We'll leave it at that. So here's what I went into detail with the post.

20:10 Now, I did some math because I wanted to touch on the fact people. Mandatory cover charge for APTA, you pay two ninety five. Then you have to add in your state chapter. It varies by state between thirty one dollars and two hundred and ten. Now you're up to five hundred and five on the on the high side. add in a section or academy, those are optional, but if you want the details about how to be in private practice or orthopedics or pediatrics, you have to add that on. If you add national, a state chapter, and an academy, you're sitting at about, we're close to seven hundred dollars a year, and that's with one academy, an expensive one. So if you come and you're like, I just wanna be a member and get all the things and the information and the belonging, and also I want you doing the things in the background, like the advocacy, great.

20:54 You paid seven hundred dollars and APT loves to tout. Well, you get CEUs and discounts at Avis car rental and discounts on New Balance sneakers. Cool. Those are also features, not benefits. We can get into the weeds on that. And then I just put it at juxtaposition, because MedBridge is over there at three-fifty a year with, and I gotta take a deep breath, twenty-five hundred CEU courses, fifty live webinars, sixty certificate programs, a hundred and fifty compliance modules, eight thousand exercise videos, a thousand patient education videos, a mobile app, a guided pathway, remote therapeutic monitoring, motion capture, patient portal, full LMS, analytics, integrations, three hundred and sixty thousand members, and sixty million dollars in revenue.

21:39 MedBridge makes sixty million a year? That was my estimate based on how many members they said they had and the average cost. I used AI. Good for them. I've never been, because I'm not a huge CEO taker, I've never been impressed by any of these companies, but if they're doing sixty million, good for them. Right. Because what's your overhead? You're making miniature movies. You fly it. You fly it. IT and labor. Yeah, that's it. That's it. I'm saying that's it with air quotes. That's it. Just do it really well. Do it over and over. Do it for two decades. And then you get to make sixty million dollars. So anyway, we'll get back to my post. Dave is equally getting me off.

22:19 It's not just me. So again, my question after I do that math, why would any smart PT join APT just for CEUs? You wouldn't. They don't. And the data proves it. So the problem and how I try to reframe it is treat membership and your fee like the cover charge. Dave, you ever been to a bar where you got to pay cover? Yeah, you're in New York City, right? You got to pay cover. It's been a minute, but yeah, of course. You're not a bar guy, but when you go, I would even venture out to say if you go to a bar in New York City and there is no cover, you're probably like, this bar sucks. This bar probably sucks. They're not charging ten dollars. This bar probably sucks, right? There's a bell curve, right?

23:00 I like to go to the bars where my feet stick to the floor. If you give me a cover there, I'm not coming. Dime bars. right and the bar dive seventy five on seventy fifth in the upper west side that's a dive bar that's a great bar all right back to this so what i'm trying to do is reframe people don't go to bars for fourteen dollar vodka sodas you can drink cheaper on your couch and you can take your shoes off so why are we nickel and diming pts on the way in here's what i think you do and i'm gonna i'm gonna parallel this with a youtube channel it'll make it real easy dave how much does it cost to join your youtube channel right now if i want to subscribe It's free. Got it. Most of them are.

23:40 Some you can pay, but most of them are free. Ninety nine point nine percent are free. Mr. Beast understands that his product is not videos. His product is his audience. how he gets and builds that audience are videos i'm gonna say this again because it might sound like jimmy is a bit insane wait a minute mr beast's products aren't videos mr beast is a video guy jimmy i've been to mr beast i've seen him he did the weird netflix thing where they you know made them play the weird games i'm gonna say it again The reason Mr. Beast can reach out to any brand on the planet right now and go, hey, I want to do a collab and you're going to pay me ten million dollars.

24:24 And they will say yes immediately without listening to a pitch. They're going to go, yes. Is because he has that many people watching religiously. That is his product. He commands an audience. How he commands the audience is making great video content. Okay, now if we're locked in and you believe me, just have some suspended disbelief. Believe me there. Now go to APTA. Imagine you had a hundred thousand members paying, not being nickel and dimed. Let's say I want to give an objective measure. Just you pay one price like Disney World. Oh, that's probably a better analogy.

25:05 Dave, when you if you bring your kid to Disney World and you pay whatever to get in and then you got to pay every time you get on the teacups and space mount, you're going to feel what nickel and dime. That's what APTA does. I'm sorry. You're the thing that you have is great. How you're how you're selling to me is bad. I a hundred percent agree. I, I respectfully, I know we're live right now, so I'll, I'll, I'll say it nicely, but I think you've tiptoed the line for so long of like, you wanna kind of please like the AP today and the organization, cuz you work with them. Yeah. And also like, you're more okay with poking the bear of like staff therapists. sometimes depending on the topic or whatever uh but i love this i hundred percent agree and i think you should consider the pros and cons of continuing this approach i well i've said on linkedin i've put it in writing and i have a time stamp on it if this continues i don't know there are state chapters that won't be solvent in a few years there are academies that will not be able to continue to keep the lights on and keep in mind none of them have buildings They don't have to pay for building and they can't get the lights on because you're doing it wrong.

26:17 Okay. So again, what I think you should do is make membership number one, reasonable. And when I get in, let me have access to everything. Imagine you pay for Netflix and then you have to pay a quarter every time you push play on something. Dude, you'd feel pissed. Actually, you do, though, because Netflix and Hulu and all these others, they have ads inside. So I believe those platforms are nickel and diming us. Wait, wait, wait. You can pay for ads free. You can pay for ads free. You got to pay a little bit more. Right. Do that. I've said this to leaders at academies. Keep your membership model. Let's beta test this. Let's do membership plus.

26:57 What does that mean? Well, take up all the CEUs that you have in your academy. Right now, people have to pay individually. Offer me an option where I can pay the regular membership cost or door number two, I pay a little more, but I have unlimited access to all the CEUs you provide. Now, you can't charge me what the cost would be if I went around and bought that a la carte. That doesn't make any sense. You got to give me a discount on that. That's Netflix, right? right? And everybody looked at me like I was crazy. And their biggest argument was, we'd lose so much money. And I go, okay, let's math this. Even if five percent of your membership did that, what would that do to your revenue?

27:37 And then the room gets quiet because they know I'm right, but they emotionally can't attach. Show me the last ten years, year over year sales of your CEUs. It's lukewarm at best. You cannot say it's valuable when no one buys it. especially when you're framing it bad, and especially when the math don't math. So I say people don't pay fourteen dollars for a vodka soda. You go for the vibe, the community, the belonging. And yes, maybe to meet someone cute. Winky, winky emoji. That's why you go to a bar. I think you come to APTA for belonging. I think belonging is the product, not CEUs, not newsletters, not journals.

28:18 The real play. Stop trying to compete with the sixty million dollar juggernaut. Stop trying to survive on dues alone. Instead, what does Jimmy suggest? Bring in sponsors, man. Don't think this model works? Go to CSM, walk through the expo hall. Organizations are throwing money at you. They are burning piles of money to get attention to PTs. CSM is only like three or four days a year. Where does this model exist to let sponsors have access in exchange for them funding the awesome the other three hundred and sixty one days a year? It's not. I know. Look, Jimmy sounds crazy because Jimmy, you're just a weird radio DJ turned PT.

29:02 If this if this model worked, somebody would have done it already. They do. It's called NPR. It's called ESPN is a is a model. Audience is the product. Understand that. The audience is the product. That's why ESPN can demand Ford paying a bajillion dollars for an ad during SportsCenter. That's why. Will people accept or reject this, Dave Kittle? Or will I just continue to just scream into the void forever until APTA comes to their senses? Here's the thing. Here's what I think will happen. You tell me and then I'll answer. I think it'll continue. I don't think APTA and any of these sections are going to do anything different with all of these tools, whether it's video, all of the live video that's available, just free Facebook, live video, YouTube.

29:52 They're just not going to change their, they don't, I don't think they... I want them to. I don't think they're being pushed to financially. Say that again. There's no incentive. They're not being pushed to change financially because they're not feeling a big enough drop off of members or whatever. I'm feeling that. Here's my opinion. I think you're onto it. They're not going to push the panic button until they're backed up on their own goal line. Which is what most businesses do. They will not call the right play. And if Will Boyd is still watching live, he was watching earlier, he commented on the live YouTube on PT Pinecast. He will agree a hundred percent.

30:33 He knows that. And as big as these organizations and APTA or any of the sections or whatever, they're not going to hit the panic button until it's too late. Oh, it's too late. And then what? It breaks my freaking heart because I want them to succeed. I do. I'm a stupid joiner. Can we switch topics? Because I think I would love to talk more of... either health, wellness, video, marketing, patient-facing stuff to the audience who will actually take action as opposed to these big old dinosaurs that will not take action. Can I close with one idea and then we move on? Because we're at the halfway mark.

31:14 All right. I can show you how to do everything that you need to do there in three circles. Okay, so we just highlighted what APT is doing wrong. Let me highlight their problems. They need new members, but new members do the math that I just laid out, and they're like, that math don't math. So smart new members don't come. They need to keep their members around. Dave, who's the easiest, cheapest person, most reliable to market to? Current or past patients, right? I've said that before. So to all the clinicians out there, your email list is money and you're not touching it. And good care.

31:55 The third is APTA sections and academies need non-dues revenue. They have none of that. So here's what we do. I'm going to put APTA is a Jimmy is J and then we have money signed. Dave just got excited because Jimmy's got a money sign on the screen. Usually I'm just talking about emotions. There we go. Here's my proposal. Let's say you're, I did a post this morning about APTA Pediatrics. Let's say you're APTA Pediatrics. And you're like, all right, Jimmy, I know I need to communicate more. And the more I communicate, the better that my current members will feel engaged. I communicate externally, new members, and I communicate the right message, which is belonging, not CEUs. Get that right, fix the message, then amp it up.

32:35 Essentially, I want to hire Jimmy full-time. I don't have the money. I know that they're not lying either. They can't hire me full-time. They couldn't do it. But they know they need what me and other people like me. I'm not just saying it's me. I'm not magic. They need communications. So here's my model. Dave, I want you to shoot holes in this. APTA and Jimmy meet and we say, here's what we're going to do. We're going to launch a YouTube channel for your academy. We're going to launch a podcast. And we're going to create ten times the amount of social media content that you're doing now. And you're going to do it with no financial risk. And they're like, okay, sounds shady, but I'm still here, right? It sounds like a used car salesman. And you're not going to have to pay Jimmy.

33:17 Whatever you pay Jimmy, you'll still make money. So not only will you lose money on paying me and then hope the money shows up, you're gonna make revenue. Are you skeptical right now? You should be, because I still sound a little bit like this guy. But low risk, so keep going. If you're a decision maker. So I go to APTA Pediatrics and I go, you had a conference last month, yes? No one knew about it. No, actually, they have a well-attended – well, their people knew about it, but extra. But could you have another thousand people show up and be happy? And they're like, well, of course we could. Exactly. They put on a great one-day event because it's a – here's why. In person, conferences work because that's where the belonging feels most tangible.

33:59 My problem is what are you doing the other three hundred and sixty-four days a year? So hold on, Dave. Don't get me off track. So Jimmy and Pediatrics sit down and I go, we're going to launch the YouTube podcast, social media content. They go, yes, yes, yes. Like we don't have the money. I go, great. Give me your top ten sponsors from your conference last year. We will call them together and we will say we're selling booth space for next year. Do you want it? Of course they do. They will pay you. They will overpay you. And then we give them Dave. Now we're talking Dave's world and upsell. Listen, we have three spots for sponsorship of a YouTube channel, a podcast, and all of our social media content for the next twelve months.

34:40 You just paid ten thousand dollars to be in front of our members in person for two days. We are now offering exposure for the other three hundred and sixty three days of the year. We can start that tomorrow. How does that deal sound? So we make sure they pay enough to cover my costs before I ever pick up a microphone for them. and put non-dues revenue in their bank account so they can go do amazing things with it. And we just raise their external visibility and we raise their internal engagement. Does this math math, Dave? It does.

35:21 I just am under the, I don't want to say bias. If I were you, I just would continue to focus on a practice who has one decision maker or like two or three, but they make decisions together and the speed to decision to deploy money or time or effort in your type of offering is faster in a private practice compared to these committees of associations and they're going to just kick the can down the road they're going oh i got to talk to mary and mary's got to talk to john and john's got to talk to tom and then we got to schedule a zoom and then not everyone comes on the zoom and then one person that you don't even speak with can spoil this and say this doesn't make sense we got to spend money on whatever Long play, short play.

36:07 I'm doing both. By the way, I didn't announce this. I won't say who it is. I signed my first clinic. Quarter two, live on site, two days, video, video, video, audio, audio, audio. And I priced it like Dave would price it. Good enough. Did you close an association? Not yet. Hold on. Wait, wait, wait. Why does Dave have two different YouTube channels? Or actually, why does he have one? Think about this. A clinic is going to be a transaction. What is this? Ongoing. I want to be so damn good for APTA Pediatrics or whoever that this is month over month. I'm making money to do all the things, which means I get to reinvest in my people and they're making money.

36:53 So to me, I'm doing short play, long play. So I agree with you. It will take a long time because that's how committees work. But once they say yes, my goal is over serve them, be so damn good they can never get rid of me because I did what I said, I said what I did, and I brought the money. So I don't disagree with you. You are a thousand percent right. I did get a faster decision from the clinic. It was three emails and one phone call. shocking shocking i mean it's beautiful that's beautiful now i don't want to work for that clinic every month though i want to do a great job for this guy and i'm gonna believe me i'm gonna case report the hell out of it cash pt three locations in a major u.s metro it's not dave's metro dave i'm not coming i'm not coming after i'm not coming you know i'm not competing with dave but i don't think anybody competes with this guy wouldn't compete with dave he's brick and mortar But we have brick and mortar.

37:50 Dude, I keep telling you this. I know, I keep forgetting. I envision you as a backpack, as a scooter bag and just out in the street. We're doing both now. I envision you as like wearing, I envision you like Ryan Serhan just hanging out on the top levels of everything. We're going to have to put out more video in the office to show you over time that we do office visits. That's the only way you have to show Jimmy video proof of what you're doing. We talk to you billions of times in a week and both of us still are like, Dave's just a backpack. He's just a bag and he's over his shoulder. Maybe he's got a massage gun in there. I don't know. He's on a subway. He's in an Uber. He's on the tram thing that goes over the Hudson.

38:30 I don't know. That's what we envision you. Anyway, so that's my two outs. Long play, APTA Academy. Listen, I'm a sucker. I want them to succeed, and I can see them doing the wrong thing. I'm like, I can freaking fix it. And again, it doesn't have to be me. I'm not saying I have magic hands. I have the magic thing. I just mapped it out for you with three circles. That's the way you do it. That's the way you do it. If you want to do it, you call me. But make a damn decision because Dave isn't wrong. All right, we're going to change the topic now. What are we talking about? You wanted to go with what? I wanna just talk about health and wellness in general. And well, like some specific examples. One is like, have you noticed that there, oh, what's the comment? What do we got? That's Katie Sutton saying, in the words of previous Ohio Physical Therapy Association, executive director, membership is personal.

39:16 What others view as benefits, other view as features, and vice versa. Correct. Talk to me about features, and I'm going to snooze. Talk to me about benefits, and you have my attention. Dave has a utility belt like Batman. This is how Ben Galen views you. He thinks you're a utility belt while you walk around the city. Katie says Dave needs proof of brick and mortar. We need photos of the video. Oh, okay. Certificate of occupancy. If you hired me, Drew and I call this video the access granted video. Essentially, it's a music video that walks... Literally, it'd be Dave being like, no sound, just hype music. And Dave waves at the camera, turns around and opens the door and the drone flies in the door.

39:57 And then you have the things that are happening in your clinic. every clinic needs its own music video as the first video on youtube that's why katie is saying i need to see proof of brick and more all right keep going what are we talking about so a couple things about health and wellness across the us that i think physical therapy practices could potentially either learn from or maybe even use but like have you noticed that there's more and more whether it's equinox or lifetime fitness or those are those are big national change or even like the regional ones have you noticed that more and more of them are adding like health and wellness not not just like okay okay so like so like la fitness i used to go to la fitness in cherry hole new jersey when i was like in high school and college and summers and winters home or whatever and they always had like a the dry sauna and some of the other locations had a dry sauna and like the wet sauna like with like moisture and you go in and you get soaked and obviously you have like a bathing suit on or whatever so that but that's that's been in existence for decades Now, a bunch of these different national and regional gyms are adding things like red light therapy and, of course, the cold plunge, which is a little bit easier.

41:05 And they're adding a little bit more of the health and wellness stuff and maybe some massage or chiro or maybe acupuncture and every different – depends on the – They're offering, but there was a, you know, McKinsey, it's one of the largest consulting companies in the US and they come out with a future of wellness report every year. So I have pulled up on Gemini. I have a little bit of their bullet points from the twenty twenty four report and the twenty twenty five report. they talk about things like the like the health like the weight loss injections like the ozempic and we'll go via the glp ones and that type of stuff and you know skin care and all that normal stuff that we all know about um health uh health aging and longevity sixty percent of consumers now rate healthy aging as a top priority this includes spending on supplements that now claim to slow cellular aging and like the test kits and all that type of stuff um and then but also like in the twenty twenty four report the gen z millennial component of the report they're calling them maximalist optimizers maximalist optimizers which oh like they account for the highest spin they are uh experiential they use health tracking tech they're willing to pay a premium for science backed products Yes.

42:21 Let me just pause that for a second. Then the boomers who were apparently termed the health traditionalists, they represent a smaller portion of the wellness spend, thirteen percent preferring simple, practical solutions like standard vitamins and walking and are less likely to experiment with new tech and trends. I want to hear your thoughts on this. I don't know. Like, there's a bunch of this we're talking about. We're talking about at home services, gyms, health and wellness. The one thing that doesn't make sense to me is The Gen Z millennials across the U.S. have had a lot of challenges with not making enough money, not having enough income, not being able to have mortgages, starting families later, all the demographic features.

43:02 And they're right. Then the boomers are folks that are already established, and they're somehow only accounting for thirteen percent of this study. So I can't argue with McKinsey's research and report and i'm sure they pull this in from a lot of data points but to me the folks that i see in new york city the boomers are the people that spend the most with us and the gen z millennials respectfully are not always going to spend two grand, four grand, five grand with us because they're price conscious and they want to use their network insurance and all that. So that's just one way to kind of segue this stuff that I'm just talking about into the physical therapy world, whether it's insurance or out of pocket or whatever.

43:44 So break down what you think, what they're saying versus what you're seeing. Do you lose audio again? That's okay. Ben Galen has a comment. Ben is saying what I was about to say. which is you already have fish in a barrel scenario at a gym. This is like, we go back to the APTA thing. Once you're a member, over-serve the crap out of them. So Ben is saying you already have a fish in a barrel scenario at a gym where these people are inherently invested in their health. Unfortunately, you can't say the same about PT clients because a lot of times PTs will sell, come to us, we fix you. But what about brick and mortar called the recovery zone? I got a friend down the street John Denoyles, great PT.

44:28 You know how you know he's a great PT? Because I would go to, I go to him. That's what, ask your PT who he goes to. Your favorite PT's favorite PT. Your favorite PT's, that's a great freaking line. Imagine you did a favorite. That's what I thought you were getting to right there. That's a great line. Your favorite, you know what? Like do a commercial where the PT is treating patients all day and they're like, oh, PT is hard. And like, oh, the PT is treating someone. They're on the table and they're like, my back. And the PT closes up shop, closes the laptop. They leave their practice and they go to New York. That's your commercial. Your favorite PT. That's smart. Someone steal that. Just tag me in it because I want to see your video when you make it.

45:08 You could make that on an iPhone tomorrow, but you won't. Anyway, so what Ben is saying is I agree, because I want to hear what Dave's question is about all this information. Ben is saying you have a fish in a barrel scenario. People who are in a gym, you can... Pretty well assumed they're invested in health or they're just there to wear spandex and stand around, but they're pretty probably invested in their health. And now you over serve the crap out of them. Dave, a second ago, I was saying this is like the APTA scenario. People want to belong. So when you get there, what do you do? Nickel and dime them. Imagine you're at a gym and every time you want to use the cold plunge, you have to insert a little like a five dollar bill into a slot. You kidding me? Of course, that's ridiculous. That's how it feels to be an APTM. But I will stay off of that.

45:50 So saying, what about a brick and mortar called the recovery zone? Oh, I know why. This is why I brought up John Denoyles. He's doing that down the street for me. He did. He started this like a year ago. He had a clinic started during covid. I mean, not on purpose, but he just started the clinic and then a pandemic happened. He wound up not only surviving, but thriving second location. And he got so big that he was able to the place next door became vacant. He blew out a wall and created one of these. It was a recovery zone. So, yes, all the things. He's got the Norma Tech boots. He's got the this and that. So the answer to Ben Galen is you have to give me a good reason why you wouldn't be doing this.

46:31 That's what I would need. If I was an employee, I would need to say, hey, boss, why aren't we doing this? Because I think we put butts in seats. And that's the goal, isn't it? So what are you, what are you thinking about this data? What is it? Well, yeah, so let's, let's use, so I've just jumped over to resolve new york.com. I found the website. So the, the recovery room, is that a separate, uh, brick and mortar, but it's, but it's next to it. It's just, yeah, it's just another, he blew out, he took over the next place and blew out a wall. And now you just walk into that and you can book sessions. I, I, there's a couple of things about it. I want to take, it's nothing taking shots. Number one, he did the most important thing, the way there, which is doing it. I think you need to communicate better.

47:11 Right? What do you see when you go there? Because you're going cold. So I like, I see infrared sauna, red light therapy, compression therapy. He's got clear and transparent pricing, which I know Jimmy and many other folks appreciate. Recovery light, one session per week. So you get four of these per month, eighty nine bucks a month. Performance recovery. That's where we go. Flag on the play. All right. Why? Here's what I would do. And I know Tony agrees with me. I will go out on a limb and say a hundred percent. I would go to the front door of the recovery zone at Resolve Physical Therapy in Montgomery, New York. I would put a lock on the door that I could program individual codes.

47:54 So Dave has a code and it's different than Jimmy's code. And then I would charge three hundred dollars a month. For twenty four hour, seven day a week access, I would throw some cameras in there. I would lock it off from the rest of the clinic. I would make sure like, hey, listen, if someone can. But that's what I would do. A guy down the street for me built like a he shed, like a little man shed, put like one of those ten thousand dollar golf simulators in there in his backyard. He wanted one. And then he probably had a buddy like me that goes, do you want it to pay for herself? And he goes, how do I do that? I go, you build a website. You give each guy a code. You stock it with water and beer. And then you book it for an hour or two hours. That's what I would do at the recovery zone.

48:35 Stop nickel and diming. Give me unlimited access. Dave, how many times a week do you think the average person would actually come? Twice? Yeah. Make it worth per month. If you use it three times, you're in the positive. And then you will have the problem of you need to expand again. It's my opinion. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe Jimmy is the crazy guy from Always Sunny. Maybe I'm nuts with the red string. I got to tell it. I think you don't charge them per. That feels nickel and dimed. If the recovery zone is high end, do you think high end places like Disney nickel and dime you? get money just just premium pricing that's the only thing i would do differently and i haven't talked to john about it that i would love to hear if anybody else is doing sort of a recovery zone do i think it's a good move to do it brilliant chef's kiss no notes i guess there is notes make it unlimited for x number of dollars per month because what happens to gym memberships dave imagine you had to pay seven dollars every time you went to your gym Gyms are not dumb.

49:40 They're in the behavior change business. We want you to come. We want you to keep coming. And even if you're not coming, we actually don't want you to come. We want you to keep paying. I would make it an offer they couldn't refuse, but don't make them reach into their wallet more than once. And then you auto pay that. I'm very sorry. do you see so this whole recovery stuff the wellness recovery room do you so if let me ask this practice your buddies practice resolve pt are they all are they like in network with every insurance really they're out of network i think i think he'll give you a super bill and i don't want to speak for them but they're i believe they're cash i don't want you if you're not invested in your health and it's hard to message Simple, not easy, right?

50:28 But no, they're not in network. No, he's like, no. And here's why. There's a chain down the street. We have access physical therapy. This is where access, do you know access? Do you know the Albany's? Huge, like, fifty or more locations. Started here. No, I think they're, like, in seventy. They started here. They're down the street. They're everywhere here. And their volume, their insurance. And here's the thing. John and the Albanese's, they see exactly what each other is doing. And they're like, they just nod at each other like, good work. Hey, keep it up. Keep it up. They're not in competition because the Albanese's with AccessPT is going after a certain person. And John conveniently located across the street from my high school. Because he's like, I want to work with active athletes, runners, people who are invested in their health.

51:11 And yeah, it costs money. And then guess what happened? People were like, that's not going to work. And then five years later, John has a second location in Florida, New York. Why is there a Florida, New York? I don't know. Why are we Orange County? There's no oranges here. I don't know. We're the original Orange County, California. And this is where Orange County choppers are from. It's not California. It's Orange County. Oh, wow. Yeah, dude. I went to high school with Mikey. I had no idea. I thought it was California. No, I went to high school with Mike Tuttle. People are like, what's he like? I'm like, did you ever watch the show? And they're like, yes. I'm like, Mikey did no acting in that show. No acting. He was that guy in high school. He was just a big, lovable, crazy guy.

51:53 Awesome. Anyway, right across the street from my high school. And then he expanded to Florida, New York. Florida, probably a half hour to forty minutes away. Because that's how far people are willing to drive for PT. So he's like, boop. The only thing I would change is I would make it unlimited access. I'm going to ask you a couple more questions. And I know that it would be better if we actually had your boy Mike on here. John, excuse me. Mike was the choppers guy. John, so do you know, like with his active population, do you happen to know like his avatar, like his ideal client for the therapy side? Is it on the website? I see runners, active adults.

52:33 That's it. Bing. I designed the website. A long time ago. Someone has now judged it up. But I built the roots and I can't build websites. But I was literally like, if you want active... He's a baseball dude. His kids are insane athletes. Gymnastics and baseball. So he wants... He's a sports guy, right? My former graphic designer from the radio station designed his logo. The circle with a little guy in it. That's my guy, John King. Look him up. That's who he wants. He wants active people. But he'll take anybody who wants to be like a sixty five year old person who wants to be active as John's person. He really he wants a psychographic, not a demographic.

53:14 He wants do you are you willing to invest in your health and get your stuff together and get back to doing? I don't care what you do. Can you do it? Yes. If you work with me. Yes. If you trust me, we can do it. He's the guy I go to. And that's why he has a second location. Simple, not easy. do you do you think and again i know there's a question because if he's here it would be for him but when you have the the red light therapy the sauna this that do you feel like there's always close to consistent crossover of like your ideal client is on the physical therapy side they're a runner they're uh they're an active mom who's you know coming off of uh you know postpartum stuff whoever it is a weekend warrior baseball player ex-baseball player do you think the same subset of those folks do the health and wellness membership.

54:00 Cause then it's a, it's a different, it's a slightly different offering. It's the same, it's at the same brick and mortar location, but it's the service is different. It's more like it's, you know, amenities, but it's kind of like solo and there's no like, and, and of course these two can cross over. These two can refer, you know, clients from one service to the other, which, and that's the beautiful thing. That's why he built it obviously. And so kudos to him. uh i'm always curious like as folks have this and they're rolling it out um what's like the what's the crossover like like for example with all the health and wellness service stuff the red light therapy the sauna all that i'm i would i would love to ask him like is it just folks that are a thirty five year old and plus are they forty or forty five year old and plus to do it is it a lot of sixteen year old baseball players like I would just be curious as to like what he sees with the flow of the demographic going to the sauna compression red light therapy Of all of my friends, John would be the least happy if I spoke for him.

55:03 We should have him on. I'm texting him right now. If he texts me back, I want to be like, call, because I can pipe him in. Here's what I see anecdotally, and then I'll let John answer when we get a response, either today or next live stream. I see the range of people, because I drive by. I drive by all the time, and I peek, and he's smart. He keeps the windows open. You see right in from a very busy highway. Not stupid. Big sign. Um... I see a range. I do see the sixteen year old kid who's playing high school baseball. I see the dude my age who just wants to not stop playing beer league hockey. And I've seen older adults. So it's more psychographic than it is demographic.

55:44 Um, that's my anecdote, but that's also like if you, and that's also who he shares on his socials at which I wish he would share more, which he would just hire my buddy drew and shoot a bajillion things. But, um, you have to, if I don't see me, I don't think it's for me. Um, but people I've seen when I've just walked in to say hi is not one area. It's a more of a psychographic than it is a demographic, I think. I think there's going to be a skew, right? There's going to be less seventy-year-olds who are active, and that's unfortunate. But the ones that want to in this thirty-mile radius, go there. Seth Godin would say, people like us do things like this. But they're also smart. I see what they're doing in public.

56:25 They're starting a run club. They did that a few months ago, and I was like, ding! Moneyball. Even if it, quote, doesn't go anywhere. it's going like, even if you just talked about it, even like they're not lying, but I'm saying, even if your clinic and your, even if you just lied and posted fake videos about the run club that never existed enough juice from that, I'm not advocating lying. Don't lie. But I'm just saying, even just seeing it, even if someone never went to your run club, they'd still be like, Oh, they're for people like active, like me. Oh yeah. I'm like, even if you're not a runner, you're like, well, I'm a beer league hockey guy. So that that's kind of, for me, not the average place with beige walls. See what I mean? Like even in this. And John was the first to say, I will have to call him out.

57:06 People don't make decisions where to go on social media, not in this zip code. And I'm like, because John wasn't a social media guy. He's not. And I'm like, then that is confirmation bias. But now but now he is. I, and here's why I think, or his team have a whole episode. Yes. His team is a little bit younger and, and, and more social. The, his front desk admin is, is quiet. Like John, John's a little, John's not like me. I'm all over the place. I think his front desk person. And I think his staff have chipped away at him and just been like, Hey, listen, why don't we try it? Like Dave, Jimmy would come in and be like blowing everything out tomorrow. We're changing everything. Cause I move fast and break things.

57:48 I think, and this is anecdotally, The change at Resolve Physical Therapy has come because he hired one PT. Then he hired another. Then he hired another. And they've slowly just said, why don't we try this? And when you hear someone like a woodpecker just pecking a little, eventually John's like, all right, fine, fine. Show me. And then a little win. And then another little win. And I think that's how things change. I love it. I was looking on their social media to see if they're showing what type of clients or patients or customers are using the sauna, red light therapy, compression boots, all that.

58:29 And I don't see it. So that also, I was trying to see if I could answer my question that way. And you should be seeing it because if I launched a new product, you know what I would do for the next sixty days? Only that product. I would triple. I would do ninety percent of that product and ten percent of everything else. I would make an insane offer for the first three months. It's a hundred dollars unlimited access. All right, fine. Let's, let's reel it back. You're not going to let someone in there at three o'clock in the morning, but during our open hours, if you walk in and you reserve a time, you have unlimited access to the recovery room as many times as you want. The average person is not going to just pull up. And just live there. And if they are, we'll deal with that problem later. But to kick it off, this is how Walmart got started. Walmart rolled into town and found the high school prom queen and the high school quarterback from thirty years ago.

59:16 And they hired them and made them managers and greeters. Because everybody in town knows Steve, who was the high school quarterback. And then Steve just goes, oh, I'm over at Walmart. See, dude, they got a chainsaw for thirty eight dollars. It's insane. I'm going to buy four of them. That is powerful. Question it. I think they're the richest family in the United States. So maybe Jimmy's just insane, or maybe I think you should just steal the strategy of what these organizations do and adopt it for yourself. So that's the only thing I would give a critique. John never asked for this, but he got it. That's the only thing I would ask, I'll give a critique for, for Resolve, is I do not want to see one session price.

59:56 You know what I would do a one session price for, Dave? A dollar. Your first twenty minutes is a dollar. For a trial? Yeah. Yeah, it's a dollar. It's a dollar. Do it. And then I'd say it's, what would you price that at? Unlimited recovery room access. You can't get that anywhere within a forty-five minute drive of this town. His price for three times a week is one-seventy-nine per month, but most likely... Wait, does he have a monthly price on there? Dude, you cut me off. There were three tiers. Sorry. It's all right. I don't have it up now. Let me see. It was like eighty-nine, a hundred something, maybe a hundred and twenty-five, a hundred and twenty-nine, something like that, and then like one-seventy-nine.

1:00:39 So there were three pricing tiers. I would push John and I would say do one-seventy-nine unlimited. What's it cost you? What's the added overhead for that, Dave? Anything? Other than the electricity, like nothing set up. I mean, you have to have some person set up the compression booths, but you already paint. They're already there anyway. Right. And then, okay. All right, let's go to the extreme. The slippery slope, Jimmy. Great. You have to book a session and there can only be two people. Now it's exclusive. You got to get in early or you could pay five hundred dollars and you could skip the line. If you got a problem, yo, I'll solve it. We can, if you have a good problem, like, Oh, I literally, Oh my God.

1:01:22 Last story. Then we'll do parting shots. When I was in Northeast Pennsylvania working for the radio station, we got called for a new sponsor, a new advertiser. This guy bought an old bowling alley. So Scranton was the Metro and Wilkes-Barre was the Metro. And then in between and around was it's woods, man. I mean, there's some towns, but it's rural. This guy bought an old bowling alley, twenty minutes east of Scranton, Pennsylvania, near Lake Wallenpaupack. And he put like an ungodly amount of money into an old bowling alley. But he did laser tag and batting cages and an arcade and a bar. He's thirty minutes east of Scranton, near Lake Wallenpaupack.

1:02:05 There's no one there. And I'm touring it, and he's like, how are you going to – my job is come in and figure out how to tell the story on the radio. And he's like, bring the staff, and they'll have fun. And I'm like, they're in their thirties. They don't want to come – whatever, but we did. Bowling, laser tag, batting cages. And I go, I got to ask, man, why not do this in Scranton where all the people are? And he goes – how big this parking lot is like i got a lot of parking and i'm like do you know what you don't have and dude hold on here's the clothes he literally looked at me he's like oh shit He realized he done up.

1:02:54 He did. Welcome to business. Welcome to business. All right, party. Oh, man. Well, I'll go. I'll go one A, one B, one A. I want to see you continue to have your offering more to private practices. I know. Speed to customer, speed to delivery. Testimonials will come faster. Results come faster because of the decisions are faster. totally understand the long-term play of all these, uh, agencies, associations that you already have a lot of connections with. I get it. You want to squeeze the juice out of the association fruit.

1:03:37 I get it. And then just the health and wellness stuff. I always love riffing on this stuff. So I think it's part of the future of physical therapy, whatever you want to call the future of physical therapy with the self-paced stuff. And the beautiful thing that we kind of... know what we talked about but like the red light the sauna the compression boots whatever people are paying out of pocket for those things and they're like yeah of course that makes sense like they're of course that makes sense like it's twenty bucks one seventy nine whatever like people so you're finding spenders you're finding people that are opening their wallet for the health and wellness amenities or offerings. And that's why it's so genius by John and so many other people that are doing it, where it crosses over like, oh, and then also like when you're trying to run and now you have aches and pains, we have physical therapy.

1:04:26 And oh, by the way, like, yeah, it's a higher dollar amount. Maybe it's one seventy nine a visit or whatever he charges. whatever they charge out of pocket but it's like they already have found spenders or you have the patients on that are already spenders and now they're like i don't need the one-on-one pt anymore but i i do like this health and wellness stuff and you keep them in your ecosystem on emails and they stop in you know in person and then when a new ache or pain pops up they sleep wrong one night and they wake up with a stiff neck or like a dead shoulder or whatever They're like, oh, I was already going to go for the red light. And now it's like, let me... So both those two offerings are just so synergistic just to have like a stupid business term. But like the synergies between those two make sense.

1:05:08 I would need someone to give me a very good explanation of why they wouldn't do things the way we're talking about them. And again, maybe we're both wrong and we're crazy, but Dave's the guy out there doing it. Jimmy is the guy in front of the dry erase board looking like a crazy person. But... Where are they? Where are they? I need you to convince me I'm wrong for this one. I would say understand what business you're in. APTA academies are in the belonging business, not the CEU business. Clinics are in the can you guide me business, not the intervention business. So for John, having PT next to a recovery room shows me he understands what business he's actually in. We're back on Thursday. We'll have more of this. Follow Dave on the Dave Kittle Show on YouTube.

1:05:48 Tony Meritato, Total Therapy Solutions. I'm on PT Pinecast and Concierge. Pain relief, CPR. I got to get new hats. Get a little dirty from baseball. I never noticed it was CPR until I started doing the post and I wanted to shorten it. CPR is good. That's a thing. Oh, get better. Emergency. Emergency. People alive. Four hours. We're back on Thursday.