How Merging Virtual and In-Person Care is Shaping PT

WEBVTT

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trick.

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I'm going to record your big

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fancy intro last because this way,

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whenever I say in the intro, like,

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how did he know he was

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going to talk about that?

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Well, like I recorded the intro last.

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So, so I never miss.

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Well, Steven, welcome to the podcast, man.

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Yeah.

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Thanks for having me on Jimmy.

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Pleasure to be here.

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I like to start with

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something not necessarily on topic,

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but like topic adjacent.

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So like, first off, your mom was a PT,

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licensed PT, thirty years before you.

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How would that shape your

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view of the profession growing up?

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And maybe how does it

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influence the way you sort

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of innovate in physical therapy today?

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Good family connection.

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Yeah, exactly right.

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So my mom was a PT.

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She was a bachelor's level PT.

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She graduated from Georgia State.

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So when I was coming through,

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I actually went up to Georgia State.

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She got me the inroads.

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I chose not to go there.

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But yeah,

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my mom charted my course in

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physical therapy really in

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the way that that

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played a role as a child is

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I always was amazed that

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whenever anything was going

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on with me or something hurt,

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she knew exactly what to do to help.

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Now, as a PT here in twenty twenty four,

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after being a PT for ten plus years,

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I recognize that's probably

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more influential of her

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being a mom rather than a PT,

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but certainly helpful as well.

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And so the way that really

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helps in how I innovate is

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having fast access to a

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physical therapist and being my mom.

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really did pave pathways for

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me to get better and and do

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things have things taken

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care of quickly so I really

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think that when I think

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about innovation and

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physical therapy and how we

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get better access to

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patients it's really about

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that quick ability to see a

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PT and and that's what I

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had as a kid that's what I

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had all throughout you know

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growing up and even now now

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these parallels was she did

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she like was she like

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guiding you to being a PT

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or was she just sort of

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motivationally interviewing

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you to go wherever she you

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wanted to go yeah that's it

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for sure yeah she I don't I

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don't even remember really

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that she ever was like you

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should be a PT that was never really a a

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pressure that I felt.

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Um, but she was my mom.

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So I looked up to her, um,

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saw what she did every day.

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When, when we were younger,

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we would get to go into the

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clinic with her and,

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and see her working on patients.

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So when we were really young,

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she would work in,

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in places that she could care for us,

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but also have a job where, you know,

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she could provide for our family.

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Um,

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And alongside my dad.

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So my dad was really the breadwinner.

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He was the one that was making money,

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but mom was helping.

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And so we would go into

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skilled nursing facilities

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with her at times and she

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would be seeing patients.

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And when you walk in the

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front door and everybody

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knows physical therapists.

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And so there was this

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rah-rah of who Tracy is and her kids.

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And then we got to go into

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the clinic when we were older

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uh and then I had a shoulder

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injury in high school and

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actually was able to rehab

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with some of her co-workers

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and so really influential

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just in my life and being

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around it uh really like

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the camaraderie and the

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atmosphere and and just

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really seeing people going

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from some of the depths of

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what they had going on in

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case of a stroke or even

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musculoskeletal injury to

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being better and my mom did

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a really good job of

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keeping that relationally

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focused and so that was a

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huge opportunity that I saw

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to really leverage

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you know,

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the skill that she had as a

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physical therapist,

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but also the kindness that

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she had just as a person to

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develop those relationships.

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Yeah.

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And before we get into your

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role at Confluent,

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because I think it's pretty unique.

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That's why I reached out.

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Before we get to what you do now,

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you've already worked

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across diverse settings,

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college athletics, startups,

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large practices.

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How have those experiences

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shaped your approach to

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problem solving innovation at Confluent?

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We'll get into what you get to do now.

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Sure.

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Yeah.

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I think a lot of the reason

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that I am where I am is

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because I've done different things.

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And those different lenses

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is really what helps guide

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you into understanding how

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you can solve problems.

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And so if we get, you know,

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so narrowly focused or only

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in view of what we see or

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what we have seen,

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it really restricts what

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the opportunities are for

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innovation and improvement.

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And so, you know,

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being in college athletics and seeing

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direct access.

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We didn't have to worry about referrals.

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You patient, you know, athlete goes down,

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you help them, um, you know, in,

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in small practices or startups,

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you're gritty.

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You got to get stuff done.

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You, you worry about things a lot less, um,

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down the road when you have

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somebody in front of you

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that you can help.

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And you,

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you just go do that big practices.

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You,

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develop an acumen for

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business and developing

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priorities and making sure

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you're keeping your eyes on

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the right thing and making

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sure your impact is in the

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right place and so when you

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combine all those things

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together you really get a

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much more broad view of how

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problems can be handled and

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I think that goes outside

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of the pt profession too I

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think one thing that we do

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ourselves a favor in is is

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adapting and understanding

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what goes on outside of our

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very narrow focused in the

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PT as broad as that is right.

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PT is a great, so much you can do.

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Um, you know,

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I saw this past week you mentioned, uh,

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on LinkedIn, I think just neuro-based PT,

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like even in that there's so much,

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there's so much of musculoskeletal space,

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just what a profession, man,

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you have so many options,

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so many opportunities.

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Um, but still we gotta,

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we gotta be more broad and

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think outside of,

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outside of what our narrow lane is.

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Well, your job title,

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your official job title, right?

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The one that you put on the resume,

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it says Clinical

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Innovations Director at Confluent Health.

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What's that mean?

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Because again,

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like LinkedIn will sort of

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suggest job titles because

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it wants to sort of be able

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to track us across.

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Like these are all directors of rehab.

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These are all VPs of whatever.

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But sometimes a job title

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innovates itself.

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So what do you get to do?

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What's your job like?

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And don't tell me it's

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different every day.

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Everybody's job is different every day.

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What's your job title mean

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to you or how do you

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describe it at a dinner party?

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Yeah, it really is different every day,

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but I won't give you that

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as the cheap answer.

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I will say also that when

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this was the job title that

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I was really applying for

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and being teed up for,

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clinical innovations

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director isn't something

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that pops up as a

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catchphrase on LinkedIn or

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Indeed or any of those.

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It is unique in that what I

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get to do every day is be

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the PT subject matter

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expert on any of the

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innovations that we're

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building or designing or deploying.

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I get to be the PT in the

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room when there's a tech

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guy and a business guy and

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a product lead and all

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sorts of people working

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together to come to a solution.

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I really get to be the PT

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subject matter expertise.

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know designing from the

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ground up uh implementing

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and informing how people

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build systems and processes

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within and then and really

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being the face of what

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we're designing in terms of

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how we're going to impact

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our patients how we're

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going to impact our pts and

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support our therapist pts

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and ots um and so

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really an exciting role and

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a role that changes but but

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in a lot of ways it's

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really focused on the very

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basics of providing the

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best service we can to our

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patients but also to our

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our entire business

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including our physical

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therapists in our front

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office and and the people

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that support the pts as well

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Now I'm a little bit of a

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dork because I have a

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favorite type of diagram.

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I don't know how many people out there.

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Mine's a Venn diagram.

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I just like the simplicity

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and you're sort of

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highlighting where you get

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to sort of have this innovations,

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which is still like,

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I feel like it's a buzzword

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in the last three or four years, right?

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We've always want to be innovative, right?

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But you get to sort of cross

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like your job or your role

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is to how do I make this

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thing when a business or IT person says,

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we're going to implement this technology.

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We're going to add AI to

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some part of our business.

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You get to come in with that

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second circle and say, great.

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How is this going to touch our clinicians?

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How is this going to help

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them affect change with our patients?

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My mom put it because mine

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was communications and innovation, right,

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in terms of clinic.

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And she just said it simply, oh, I get it.

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You speak both languages.

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You get to translate for one

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side and the other.

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I said, see, you explained it best.

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Moms just always know the way.

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That's right.

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Yeah,

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that Venn diagram really in my role

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where I see it is exactly that, right?

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specific thing for our

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purposes to the PT side of

00:08:43.379 --> 00:08:45.081
it as well but also really

00:08:45.120 --> 00:08:46.062
the intersection of

00:08:46.263 --> 00:08:47.624
effectiveness and

00:08:47.644 --> 00:08:49.206
efficiency right because if

00:08:49.225 --> 00:08:50.047
you're efficient but you're

00:08:50.067 --> 00:08:51.548
not effective or you're

00:08:51.568 --> 00:08:52.830
you're effective but you're not efficient

00:08:53.279 --> 00:08:54.561
So it's really trying to

00:08:54.581 --> 00:08:55.961
figure out how you blend

00:08:56.022 --> 00:08:58.202
those together with all of

00:08:58.503 --> 00:08:59.443
the challenges that come

00:08:59.464 --> 00:09:02.284
with using new software and, you know,

00:09:02.325 --> 00:09:03.725
some of the archaic systems

00:09:03.765 --> 00:09:06.067
that we as a PT profession use,

00:09:06.128 --> 00:09:08.028
which none of us are,

00:09:08.828 --> 00:09:09.990
that's not lost on any of us,

00:09:10.029 --> 00:09:11.990
but the change is hard, right?

00:09:12.110 --> 00:09:14.972
Even in the most innovative companies,

00:09:15.013 --> 00:09:16.053
change is not easy.

00:09:16.254 --> 00:09:17.835
And so how you,

00:09:18.695 --> 00:09:20.115
how you present that effectiveness,

00:09:20.135 --> 00:09:21.797
how you communicate that effectiveness,

00:09:22.615 --> 00:09:23.554
and match that with the

00:09:23.575 --> 00:09:25.076
efficiency that we're going

00:09:25.115 --> 00:09:26.535
for is really paramount.

00:09:26.735 --> 00:09:28.417
And so really being the face

00:09:28.976 --> 00:09:31.538
and not only just about being a face,

00:09:31.577 --> 00:09:33.498
but showing and working and

00:09:33.658 --> 00:09:34.979
building relationships

00:09:35.219 --> 00:09:37.419
based on trust really help

00:09:37.500 --> 00:09:38.220
make that easier.

00:09:38.946 --> 00:09:41.629
Whether it's technology or clinical care,

00:09:42.791 --> 00:09:44.653
the strength and difficulty

00:09:44.732 --> 00:09:46.434
is at the beginning and end, it's people.

00:09:46.554 --> 00:09:47.836
People are messy, right?

00:09:48.236 --> 00:09:49.357
But we don't want people to,

00:09:49.398 --> 00:09:50.298
we want people to be messy

00:09:50.339 --> 00:09:52.120
because that's what makes people, people.

00:09:52.861 --> 00:09:54.563
But you still need to be effective.

00:09:54.923 --> 00:09:55.784
And you've actually said

00:09:55.845 --> 00:09:58.427
that you see inefficiencies

00:09:58.668 --> 00:10:00.029
as opportunities for improvement.

00:10:00.610 --> 00:10:01.772
Walk us through a challenge

00:10:01.792 --> 00:10:02.832
you faced at Confluent

00:10:02.873 --> 00:10:04.434
Health and how you turned

00:10:04.475 --> 00:10:07.258
that into a successful innovation.

00:10:07.298 --> 00:10:09.159
Because if there's not a pain point,

00:10:09.240 --> 00:10:10.741
you really can't be innovative.

00:10:10.761 --> 00:10:12.403
Or it's harder, I should say,

00:10:12.423 --> 00:10:13.284
to be innovative there.

00:10:13.325 --> 00:10:14.245
So what's the situation that

00:10:14.265 --> 00:10:17.249
you took that pain point of

00:10:17.470 --> 00:10:18.730
inefficiency and brought

00:10:18.770 --> 00:10:20.013
something successful out of it?

00:10:20.457 --> 00:10:20.557
Yeah,

00:10:20.577 --> 00:10:21.960
so I'll talk about one that we

00:10:22.019 --> 00:10:23.000
recently did.

00:10:23.321 --> 00:10:25.303
And this is helpful because

00:10:25.344 --> 00:10:26.585
we'll be able to draw from

00:10:26.605 --> 00:10:27.326
people that have been in

00:10:27.346 --> 00:10:29.187
the industry since COVID at

00:10:29.227 --> 00:10:30.328
least and understanding

00:10:30.349 --> 00:10:31.490
that virtual care became

00:10:31.510 --> 00:10:32.451
this thing overnight.

00:10:33.253 --> 00:10:34.794
And then people abandoned it

00:10:34.855 --> 00:10:36.216
pretty quickly on the other side of it.

00:10:36.255 --> 00:10:37.597
Some people took it up and

00:10:37.857 --> 00:10:40.240
made entire business models off of it.

00:10:41.610 --> 00:10:43.371
But also we're at a place in

00:10:43.392 --> 00:10:44.312
physical therapy where we

00:10:44.373 --> 00:10:46.313
understand that access is

00:10:46.333 --> 00:10:47.033
hard to come by.

00:10:47.114 --> 00:10:49.414
We have a shortage of PTs,

00:10:49.654 --> 00:10:50.735
at least in the outpatient

00:10:50.775 --> 00:10:51.836
musculoskeletal space.

00:10:51.956 --> 00:10:54.496
Larry Benz has been hugely

00:10:54.537 --> 00:10:56.899
effective at showing us how

00:10:58.019 --> 00:10:59.679
and where and what those numbers are.

00:11:00.220 --> 00:11:02.181
And so when you hit the intersection of,

00:11:02.461 --> 00:11:03.902
you know that patient

00:11:03.981 --> 00:11:04.942
access is critically

00:11:04.961 --> 00:11:06.663
important to the outcome of our patients,

00:11:06.702 --> 00:11:06.842
right?

00:11:06.883 --> 00:11:08.683
When we can get them in early,

00:11:09.264 --> 00:11:10.684
we can be a whole lot more effective.

00:11:11.172 --> 00:11:12.212
but you have wait lists that

00:11:12.352 --> 00:11:13.974
don't allow that threshold

00:11:14.033 --> 00:11:15.195
of early to happen.

00:11:15.695 --> 00:11:17.035
How can we be effective at

00:11:17.076 --> 00:11:19.317
getting that patient in or

00:11:19.336 --> 00:11:20.418
at least on the right

00:11:20.477 --> 00:11:22.578
pathway so that they can get in?

00:11:22.658 --> 00:11:24.159
So what we did at one of our

00:11:24.220 --> 00:11:25.441
partner clinics was,

00:11:25.821 --> 00:11:28.523
was provided a evaluation,

00:11:28.562 --> 00:11:30.224
a virtual evaluation to any

00:11:30.264 --> 00:11:31.804
patient that wanted to take us up on it.

00:11:32.706 --> 00:11:33.846
They were Medicare patients.

00:11:33.865 --> 00:11:35.187
So we thought, you know,

00:11:35.386 --> 00:11:39.570
who could we prove this with that would,

00:11:40.240 --> 00:11:42.142
be pretty applicable across the board.

00:11:42.182 --> 00:11:43.384
So who's the hardest person

00:11:43.423 --> 00:11:46.827
to get to adopt virtual care, right?

00:11:47.028 --> 00:11:48.850
So Medicare was the one that came out,

00:11:48.909 --> 00:11:49.071
right?

00:11:49.571 --> 00:11:50.773
There's restriction and

00:11:50.832 --> 00:11:54.576
payer rules that reduce their access.

00:11:54.998 --> 00:11:55.958
The clinics are busy.

00:11:56.259 --> 00:11:57.620
We don't have enough PTs to

00:11:57.660 --> 00:11:59.143
service the people that want to come in.

00:12:01.160 --> 00:12:01.721
these people aren't

00:12:01.761 --> 00:12:03.102
generally going to want virtual care.

00:12:03.143 --> 00:12:04.344
At least that's what we tell ourselves.

00:12:04.384 --> 00:12:05.203
The truth is the,

00:12:05.244 --> 00:12:06.946
the age gets older and older, right?

00:12:06.985 --> 00:12:07.405
The,

00:12:07.566 --> 00:12:09.467
the ability for a patient to manage a

00:12:09.528 --> 00:12:10.568
virtual environment gets

00:12:10.629 --> 00:12:13.331
better and better every year, right?

00:12:13.471 --> 00:12:14.192
Older every year.

00:12:14.251 --> 00:12:14.491
Right.

00:12:14.552 --> 00:12:16.572
So, so let's go prove it with them.

00:12:16.633 --> 00:12:17.833
Let's go see how this works.

00:12:18.855 --> 00:12:20.176
And what we were told from the outset is,

00:12:21.297 --> 00:12:23.938
you know, fine, you can eval them,

00:12:24.220 --> 00:12:25.561
but when they come into the clinic,

00:12:25.681 --> 00:12:26.701
the PT is going to have to

00:12:26.741 --> 00:12:27.741
do another evaluation.

00:12:28.462 --> 00:12:29.364
The, the,

00:12:30.282 --> 00:12:31.201
patient is not going to be

00:12:31.221 --> 00:12:32.082
real thrilled about having

00:12:32.123 --> 00:12:33.243
to see somebody different.

00:12:33.982 --> 00:12:35.623
And are you really changing

00:12:35.682 --> 00:12:37.384
any of the problems that we have?

00:12:37.504 --> 00:12:37.884
Like, well,

00:12:37.903 --> 00:12:39.384
let's just try it and see what happens.

00:12:39.965 --> 00:12:40.345
And so we did.

00:12:40.384 --> 00:12:41.245
We offered every single

00:12:41.264 --> 00:12:43.326
Medicare patient a virtual visit.

00:12:44.645 --> 00:12:46.306
And we had patients that took us up on it.

00:12:46.326 --> 00:12:47.106
And, you know,

00:12:47.126 --> 00:12:47.947
what we found on the other

00:12:47.966 --> 00:12:49.027
side is that patients loved

00:12:49.067 --> 00:12:50.366
it because they knew they

00:12:50.407 --> 00:12:51.447
were where they needed to be.

00:12:51.508 --> 00:12:51.707
Right.

00:12:52.107 --> 00:12:53.447
Jimmy's got a shoulder problem.

00:12:53.727 --> 00:12:54.969
I don't need to go see ortho.

00:12:54.989 --> 00:12:55.969
I really just need to start

00:12:55.989 --> 00:12:57.249
working on this thing.

00:12:57.308 --> 00:12:57.970
And here's a couple of

00:12:57.990 --> 00:12:59.529
things that I can be doing in the interim

00:13:00.457 --> 00:13:01.818
that when I finally get in

00:13:01.859 --> 00:13:04.139
the clinic to see Dr. Nelson,

00:13:04.620 --> 00:13:06.260
my shoulder is going to be

00:13:06.400 --> 00:13:07.441
on the way and then he's

00:13:07.480 --> 00:13:08.160
going to be able to help me

00:13:08.181 --> 00:13:09.121
the rest of the way, right?

00:13:09.142 --> 00:13:10.142
So they're on the right

00:13:10.462 --> 00:13:11.082
pathway and they're

00:13:11.102 --> 00:13:13.004
confident about their pathway.

00:13:13.423 --> 00:13:14.624
We then found that the

00:13:14.663 --> 00:13:16.125
virtual evaluating therapists,

00:13:16.245 --> 00:13:17.166
when they speak the same

00:13:17.225 --> 00:13:19.066
language and we make an

00:13:19.125 --> 00:13:21.307
intentional effort to offload,

00:13:21.326 --> 00:13:22.508
both offload the therapist

00:13:22.548 --> 00:13:25.269
and do a really good job of relationship,

00:13:25.288 --> 00:13:26.870
what we call relationship-based care,

00:13:26.889 --> 00:13:27.049
right?

00:13:28.014 --> 00:13:29.154
at PT in the clinic some

00:13:29.195 --> 00:13:30.475
information about who this

00:13:30.515 --> 00:13:31.755
patient is more than just

00:13:31.796 --> 00:13:32.416
their shoulders.

00:13:32.496 --> 00:13:35.157
We call it a relationship nugget.

00:13:35.538 --> 00:13:37.378
What do I need to know about

00:13:37.418 --> 00:13:38.759
Jimmy when I pick up this patient?

00:13:38.778 --> 00:13:39.719
I've never seen him before

00:13:40.038 --> 00:13:41.158
that I can crack a joke at

00:13:41.178 --> 00:13:43.299
the beginning of the episode, right?

00:13:44.120 --> 00:13:46.640
The only way that the

00:13:46.721 --> 00:13:48.302
patient or that the

00:13:48.422 --> 00:13:49.341
in-clinic therapist would

00:13:49.361 --> 00:13:50.783
have known that is if they

00:13:50.822 --> 00:13:52.623
had a conversation or communicated with,

00:13:52.663 --> 00:13:53.082
whether that's

00:13:53.102 --> 00:13:54.744
synchronously or asynchronously,

00:13:55.568 --> 00:13:57.149
with the therapist that evaluated them.

00:13:57.629 --> 00:13:58.370
And you're talking about,

00:13:59.390 --> 00:14:00.030
you're hitting on

00:14:00.051 --> 00:14:01.272
therapeutic alliance right now.

00:14:02.032 --> 00:14:02.912
And when we have a strong

00:14:02.951 --> 00:14:03.873
therapeutic alliance and we

00:14:03.893 --> 00:14:04.952
get to our patients quickly,

00:14:05.133 --> 00:14:06.274
I like those odds.

00:14:06.874 --> 00:14:08.835
And we're starting to make change quickly.

00:14:09.335 --> 00:14:10.056
So what we found was the

00:14:10.096 --> 00:14:11.096
therapist absolutely loved it.

00:14:11.135 --> 00:14:12.057
They didn't have to do the

00:14:12.076 --> 00:14:13.336
evaluation documentation.

00:14:14.238 --> 00:14:15.957
They had the basic outline.

00:14:16.979 --> 00:14:18.359
We made quick snippets.

00:14:18.379 --> 00:14:19.440
We call it a two minute drill.

00:14:19.460 --> 00:14:20.780
They knew what we did,

00:14:21.400 --> 00:14:22.541
what we were proposing as

00:14:22.581 --> 00:14:23.802
the hypothesis for their treatment.

00:14:24.538 --> 00:14:25.658
And then what we weren't

00:14:26.340 --> 00:14:28.942
able to evaluate in a virtual environment,

00:14:28.961 --> 00:14:30.263
they might want to look at, right?

00:14:30.403 --> 00:14:32.985
So I can't hit a DTR,

00:14:33.544 --> 00:14:34.605
but I can suggest somebody

00:14:34.666 --> 00:14:36.307
does if I think that needs to be done.

00:14:37.048 --> 00:14:37.967
And so we found that

00:14:37.988 --> 00:14:39.129
therapists loved it because

00:14:39.188 --> 00:14:39.970
they didn't have to do the

00:14:39.990 --> 00:14:41.510
documentation and they were a leg up.

00:14:41.551 --> 00:14:42.851
They could get in and treat the patients.

00:14:42.871 --> 00:14:44.714
That's exactly what we as PTs want to do.

00:14:44.734 --> 00:14:46.154
We want to treat our patients.

00:14:47.576 --> 00:14:49.756
And so patients loved it.

00:14:49.777 --> 00:14:50.538
They were a step ahead.

00:14:50.638 --> 00:14:52.960
They knew where they needed to be.

00:14:53.395 --> 00:14:54.236
And then the patients that

00:14:54.277 --> 00:14:55.116
weren't appropriate for

00:14:55.157 --> 00:14:56.298
care got to where they

00:14:56.337 --> 00:14:57.298
needed to get right.

00:14:57.399 --> 00:14:58.458
And it didn't bog down the

00:14:58.499 --> 00:15:00.139
clinic with another eval

00:15:00.581 --> 00:15:01.780
that didn't necessarily

00:15:02.081 --> 00:15:04.082
need to be seen in the clinic.

00:15:04.582 --> 00:15:05.644
And so, you know,

00:15:05.724 --> 00:15:06.464
you really start getting at

00:15:06.484 --> 00:15:07.585
the triple aim there, right?

00:15:07.605 --> 00:15:08.365
You there's some cost

00:15:08.405 --> 00:15:09.426
efficiencies in there.

00:15:09.446 --> 00:15:09.866
There's some,

00:15:10.147 --> 00:15:11.307
there's a ton of patient

00:15:11.347 --> 00:15:12.347
benefit that's in there.

00:15:12.748 --> 00:15:14.229
There's provider benefit in there.

00:15:14.570 --> 00:15:16.110
And then the out it's outcome bearing,

00:15:16.150 --> 00:15:16.370
right?

00:15:16.410 --> 00:15:17.932
We've got that through your clients.

00:15:17.951 --> 00:15:19.972
We've got those things built

00:15:20.113 --> 00:15:22.595
in that the patient has fast access to.

00:15:22.634 --> 00:15:22.754
So.

00:15:23.836 --> 00:15:24.697
So you opened the door there

00:15:24.738 --> 00:15:26.299
for this idea of a team

00:15:26.320 --> 00:15:27.301
because you said it might

00:15:27.341 --> 00:15:28.402
not be the same person

00:15:28.642 --> 00:15:29.482
providing the virtual

00:15:29.523 --> 00:15:30.604
evaluation versus the

00:15:30.644 --> 00:15:31.605
person they see in clinic.

00:15:31.644 --> 00:15:32.605
That person might be

00:15:32.846 --> 00:15:34.128
somewhere far across the country,

00:15:34.168 --> 00:15:35.589
but they were the first person available.

00:15:36.049 --> 00:15:39.052
So what does it take to

00:15:39.133 --> 00:15:41.034
truly foster an innovative

00:15:41.075 --> 00:15:42.035
team in healthcare?

00:15:42.096 --> 00:15:44.458
Because while it excites some,

00:15:44.879 --> 00:15:45.860
everybody wants different.

00:15:47.222 --> 00:15:48.604
but not everybody wants to change, right?

00:15:48.683 --> 00:15:50.043
Difference nice, difference fun,

00:15:50.604 --> 00:15:52.764
but change can sometimes be scary.

00:15:53.065 --> 00:15:55.485
But to get it to work or to

00:15:55.524 --> 00:15:57.145
figure out if it's gonna work,

00:15:57.385 --> 00:15:58.785
you've gotta get that team

00:15:59.166 --> 00:16:01.947
to truly try this and to truly buy in.

00:16:02.246 --> 00:16:03.488
So how do you get that buy in?

00:16:03.508 --> 00:16:05.447
How do you keep that momentum?

00:16:05.827 --> 00:16:06.107
Yeah,

00:16:06.128 --> 00:16:07.849
the team-based approach really is

00:16:07.928 --> 00:16:08.389
based on,

00:16:08.548 --> 00:16:09.828
it's gotta be built off of trust.

00:16:10.028 --> 00:16:11.889
So we know team building principles.

00:16:11.929 --> 00:16:13.330
We know how important it is

00:16:13.389 --> 00:16:15.610
for the collaboration of,

00:16:16.383 --> 00:16:18.484
whether it's within the same team, right?

00:16:18.524 --> 00:16:19.825
So a bunch of PTs come in

00:16:19.845 --> 00:16:21.586
together to talk about a

00:16:21.645 --> 00:16:23.527
patient or to manage a patient together,

00:16:23.547 --> 00:16:24.866
what we call hybrid care.

00:16:24.886 --> 00:16:25.908
We don't do handoffs.

00:16:25.947 --> 00:16:27.609
We co-manage, we work together.

00:16:27.649 --> 00:16:29.009
It's an extra set of years

00:16:29.710 --> 00:16:31.191
or we're in some integrated

00:16:31.650 --> 00:16:32.711
care environment, right?

00:16:32.750 --> 00:16:34.851
So I did some work with

00:16:34.893 --> 00:16:36.533
Walmart Health alongside Walmart Health,

00:16:36.974 --> 00:16:38.193
which was super exciting, right?

00:16:38.234 --> 00:16:39.495
We were able to sit down and

00:16:39.534 --> 00:16:40.975
have conversations and

00:16:41.015 --> 00:16:42.275
build trust provider to

00:16:42.316 --> 00:16:43.537
provider to understand

00:16:44.147 --> 00:16:45.027
how I might be able to

00:16:45.067 --> 00:16:46.567
leverage that primary care

00:16:46.607 --> 00:16:47.788
doctor much more effectively,

00:16:47.868 --> 00:16:48.748
how they might be able to

00:16:48.807 --> 00:16:50.427
leverage my set of

00:16:50.488 --> 00:16:51.788
expertise and skill set.

00:16:52.889 --> 00:16:53.889
And sometimes that looks

00:16:53.928 --> 00:16:55.009
like very specifically

00:16:55.049 --> 00:16:56.789
talking through patient cases,

00:16:56.850 --> 00:16:58.309
but sometimes that's the

00:16:58.350 --> 00:16:59.311
confidence to know that I

00:16:59.331 --> 00:17:00.270
can just hand this off.

00:17:00.370 --> 00:17:00.630
Right.

00:17:01.150 --> 00:17:02.410
So, you know, in Walmart,

00:17:02.431 --> 00:17:03.451
we saw lots of

00:17:03.511 --> 00:17:04.511
opportunities with

00:17:04.692 --> 00:17:05.771
uncontrolled hypertension

00:17:05.811 --> 00:17:07.112
and we saw lots of just

00:17:07.673 --> 00:17:09.692
primary care needs that were just unmet.

00:17:10.426 --> 00:17:11.307
And when I can send them

00:17:11.347 --> 00:17:12.709
next door and I know that

00:17:12.729 --> 00:17:13.469
they're gonna be cared for

00:17:13.489 --> 00:17:14.670
and I know that they're

00:17:14.690 --> 00:17:15.790
gonna be managed and then I

00:17:15.830 --> 00:17:19.953
can follow up on that,

00:17:20.013 --> 00:17:20.934
provides a whole nother

00:17:21.015 --> 00:17:23.517
opportunity and it changes

00:17:23.576 --> 00:17:25.679
the lens in which I see

00:17:25.699 --> 00:17:27.039
that and manage that patient.

00:17:28.441 --> 00:17:29.141
Now we can talk about

00:17:29.161 --> 00:17:29.981
lifestyle intervention.

00:17:30.021 --> 00:17:31.643
Now that your blood pressure is controlled,

00:17:31.702 --> 00:17:32.463
we can work on

00:17:32.963 --> 00:17:34.164
cardiovascular exercise

00:17:34.184 --> 00:17:35.046
that's gonna make a huge

00:17:35.125 --> 00:17:36.926
long-term impact in how you

00:17:36.946 --> 00:17:38.228
manage your shoulder pain

00:17:38.248 --> 00:17:38.949
and your back pain.

00:17:40.028 --> 00:17:42.309
And so so trust is really

00:17:42.329 --> 00:17:44.310
the groundwork that that

00:17:44.351 --> 00:17:45.932
everything else is built upon.

00:17:46.992 --> 00:17:48.433
And then and then ongoing

00:17:48.473 --> 00:17:50.035
relationship really helps

00:17:50.075 --> 00:17:51.996
that because when when you

00:17:52.036 --> 00:17:53.116
come in as a patient and

00:17:53.156 --> 00:17:54.116
you see Stephen as your

00:17:54.136 --> 00:17:56.538
physical therapist and you see, you know,

00:17:56.558 --> 00:17:57.660
your primary care and

00:17:57.700 --> 00:17:58.940
they're referencing each

00:17:58.980 --> 00:18:00.060
other and talking to each

00:18:00.101 --> 00:18:01.382
other and they're all on the same page.

00:18:03.931 --> 00:18:06.894
in integrated care is about is,

00:18:07.193 --> 00:18:08.214
is making sure that that

00:18:08.595 --> 00:18:10.537
patients need are met with

00:18:10.576 --> 00:18:11.738
the trust of the providers

00:18:11.758 --> 00:18:12.679
that are working together.

00:18:12.759 --> 00:18:13.318
And excitingly,

00:18:13.358 --> 00:18:14.839
there's a lot of that going on in,

00:18:15.201 --> 00:18:16.541
in healthcare today.

00:18:16.602 --> 00:18:18.943
I imagine finding the right people helps.

00:18:19.364 --> 00:18:19.463
Yeah.

00:18:19.483 --> 00:18:20.704
Yeah.

00:18:20.724 --> 00:18:22.126
Because if I'm the PT and I

00:18:22.166 --> 00:18:23.047
should see everything and

00:18:23.086 --> 00:18:26.509
nobody's expertise matters, then yeah.

00:18:26.529 --> 00:18:27.431
So humility is huge.

00:18:27.550 --> 00:18:27.830
Right.

00:18:27.971 --> 00:18:30.513
And you know, the primary care is,

00:18:31.593 --> 00:18:34.215
a provider's ability to say, you know, hey,

00:18:34.695 --> 00:18:35.717
I noticed this thing.

00:18:35.737 --> 00:18:37.378
Did you check that is not

00:18:37.398 --> 00:18:38.839
going to happen if, you know,

00:18:39.119 --> 00:18:40.241
Stephen's arrogant and

00:18:40.281 --> 00:18:40.741
doesn't want to hear

00:18:43.165 --> 00:18:44.226
musculoskeletal because I'm

00:18:44.266 --> 00:18:44.747
the pt and I know

00:18:44.807 --> 00:18:45.807
everything there is to know

00:18:45.886 --> 00:18:47.488
right so yep yeah so

00:18:47.528 --> 00:18:48.607
humility is huge in that as

00:18:48.667 --> 00:18:50.888
well right person uh movie

00:18:50.909 --> 00:18:52.169
health revolutionizing

00:18:52.249 --> 00:18:53.430
virtual and in-person

00:18:53.490 --> 00:18:54.670
musculoskeletal care an

00:18:54.710 --> 00:18:56.530
innovative way to get back

00:18:56.570 --> 00:18:57.590
to the things you love

00:18:57.711 --> 00:18:59.632
whenever and wherever you

00:18:59.652 --> 00:19:01.291
need it I'm reading the the

00:19:01.311 --> 00:19:03.073
website from uh from from

00:19:03.133 --> 00:19:05.713
movie health which is movie msk.com like

00:19:06.253 --> 00:19:06.894
It's live.

00:19:07.174 --> 00:19:07.855
It's out there.

00:19:08.655 --> 00:19:09.236
What is it?

00:19:09.316 --> 00:19:10.356
How would you explain it?

00:19:10.537 --> 00:19:11.477
Because I think a lot of

00:19:11.517 --> 00:19:13.038
these things are similar,

00:19:13.057 --> 00:19:14.358
but not the same popping up.

00:19:14.679 --> 00:19:15.558
How would you explain what

00:19:15.598 --> 00:19:17.279
you guys are doing with Moby Health?

00:19:18.060 --> 00:19:18.240
Yes.

00:19:18.280 --> 00:19:19.721
So it really depends on if

00:19:19.781 --> 00:19:22.542
I'm talking to a table full of PTs,

00:19:22.702 --> 00:19:25.704
which is likely this conversation.

00:19:26.448 --> 00:19:27.788
Or if I'm talking to a patient.

00:19:27.909 --> 00:19:29.269
And so if I'm talking to a patient,

00:19:29.630 --> 00:19:30.690
we're talking a lot more

00:19:30.730 --> 00:19:32.131
about how effective getting

00:19:32.151 --> 00:19:34.011
to a PT quickly is, right?

00:19:34.352 --> 00:19:35.372
What is the diagnostic

00:19:35.551 --> 00:19:37.073
accuracy of a PT and how

00:19:37.113 --> 00:19:38.213
that measures up against

00:19:38.594 --> 00:19:40.394
who they might go to see instead.

00:19:42.175 --> 00:19:43.076
So that's really the lane

00:19:43.096 --> 00:19:44.896
that we talk to about in

00:19:44.957 --> 00:19:46.478
patients is how effective

00:19:46.678 --> 00:19:47.698
physical therapists can be,

00:19:48.179 --> 00:19:49.558
how much money it can save them,

00:19:49.598 --> 00:19:51.079
how much trouble it can save them.

00:19:51.828 --> 00:19:53.009
what's the broad impact

00:19:53.029 --> 00:19:54.030
physical therapy has not

00:19:54.090 --> 00:19:55.010
only on their shoulder pain

00:19:55.030 --> 00:19:55.711
or their back pain,

00:19:55.731 --> 00:19:56.913
but their whole life really.

00:19:57.972 --> 00:20:00.755
But when I get in conversations with PTs,

00:20:00.954 --> 00:20:02.276
we talk a lot about what

00:20:02.316 --> 00:20:04.778
we've touched on previously

00:20:06.138 --> 00:20:07.118
is an innovative way to

00:20:08.039 --> 00:20:10.582
doing PT where a patient

00:20:10.622 --> 00:20:12.522
has fast access to me,

00:20:12.982 --> 00:20:18.047
regardless of geography, schedule.

00:20:19.448 --> 00:20:20.749
And we're really going about

00:20:21.743 --> 00:20:23.284
overcoming the burdens the

00:20:23.324 --> 00:20:24.585
traditional burdens of

00:20:24.625 --> 00:20:26.805
physical therapy access and

00:20:26.825 --> 00:20:28.204
so if we if we broadly

00:20:28.244 --> 00:20:29.845
define those we would say

00:20:30.306 --> 00:20:32.046
cost major virgin burden

00:20:32.905 --> 00:20:34.445
geography and schedule a

00:20:34.486 --> 00:20:35.705
major burden and we see

00:20:35.727 --> 00:20:36.547
some of this pushback I

00:20:36.567 --> 00:20:38.626
mean in startups one of the

00:20:38.646 --> 00:20:39.727
things that I focus on is

00:20:39.787 --> 00:20:42.607
being open when people are

00:20:42.627 --> 00:20:44.167
available that means you

00:20:44.188 --> 00:20:45.127
know between the hours of

00:20:45.228 --> 00:20:46.807
nine and five people have

00:20:46.847 --> 00:20:47.749
jobs and they're gonna have

00:20:47.769 --> 00:20:49.648
to take pto to get out of

00:20:50.577 --> 00:20:50.917
you know,

00:20:50.978 --> 00:20:52.900
being at work to take care of

00:20:52.920 --> 00:20:54.161
whatever they've got going on.

00:20:54.201 --> 00:20:55.421
So I need to be open outside

00:20:55.441 --> 00:20:56.922
of those hours to make it

00:20:56.961 --> 00:20:57.823
as easy as possible.

00:20:58.483 --> 00:20:59.223
Well, with Moby Health,

00:20:59.284 --> 00:21:00.744
when we have a virtual environment,

00:21:00.785 --> 00:21:01.566
somebody doesn't even need

00:21:01.605 --> 00:21:02.506
to leave their job.

00:21:02.526 --> 00:21:04.448
They can take a call on

00:21:04.728 --> 00:21:07.509
lunch or on a break or a

00:21:07.569 --> 00:21:08.651
mom that's just given birth.

00:21:08.691 --> 00:21:10.051
We know how important

00:21:10.211 --> 00:21:11.952
physical therapy care is postpartum.

00:21:13.653 --> 00:21:15.555
Putting a baby down for a nap.

00:21:15.615 --> 00:21:15.895
In fact,

00:21:15.935 --> 00:21:17.297
my two-year-old's napping right now.

00:21:18.518 --> 00:21:19.117
I can take

00:21:19.741 --> 00:21:21.083
podcast recording I can take

00:21:21.103 --> 00:21:22.143
a physical therapy call and

00:21:22.163 --> 00:21:23.604
not leave the house and not

00:21:23.663 --> 00:21:25.284
burden my schedule by doing

00:21:25.304 --> 00:21:26.164
that and those are things

00:21:26.184 --> 00:21:27.184
that we don't inherently

00:21:27.224 --> 00:21:29.006
think of as as pts because

00:21:29.766 --> 00:21:30.885
we think of what happens in

00:21:30.905 --> 00:21:31.787
our clinic and how those

00:21:31.826 --> 00:21:32.866
patients are in our clinic

00:21:32.906 --> 00:21:34.548
and and yeah we get so

00:21:34.607 --> 00:21:35.468
narrowly focused on

00:21:35.827 --> 00:21:37.528
geography is huge what if

00:21:37.548 --> 00:21:39.250
somebody had to travel even

00:21:39.309 --> 00:21:40.369
forty five minutes to give

00:21:40.390 --> 00:21:41.211
you that's an hour and a

00:21:41.250 --> 00:21:42.510
half of travel time just in

00:21:42.530 --> 00:21:44.571
travel time and so

00:21:45.503 --> 00:21:46.484
The virtual environment

00:21:46.744 --> 00:21:49.707
provides an opportunity to to do that,

00:21:49.747 --> 00:21:51.228
to overcome those burdens.

00:21:52.067 --> 00:21:53.449
But we know that it's not

00:21:53.528 --> 00:21:54.789
sufficient in isolation.

00:21:55.210 --> 00:21:55.871
Not only that,

00:21:55.911 --> 00:21:57.412
but we know that patients

00:21:57.491 --> 00:21:58.491
actually prefer to be in

00:21:58.511 --> 00:22:00.594
clinic sometimes and a lot of times.

00:22:01.213 --> 00:22:02.095
And so we don't want to

00:22:02.115 --> 00:22:02.795
remove that burden.

00:22:02.835 --> 00:22:03.134
In fact,

00:22:03.194 --> 00:22:05.777
we got to that crossroads where we

00:22:05.797 --> 00:22:06.778
were deciding whether we

00:22:06.798 --> 00:22:07.577
were going to do all

00:22:07.617 --> 00:22:09.058
virtual initial evaluations

00:22:09.098 --> 00:22:09.699
or if we were going to

00:22:09.719 --> 00:22:11.359
allow somebody to go into the clinic.

00:22:13.304 --> 00:22:14.404
And we're so focused on

00:22:14.444 --> 00:22:15.345
making sure that the

00:22:15.565 --> 00:22:17.105
patient be the driver of

00:22:17.145 --> 00:22:18.425
their healthcare is that we

00:22:18.465 --> 00:22:19.086
remove that burden,

00:22:19.125 --> 00:22:20.446
allow the patient to decide

00:22:20.467 --> 00:22:21.767
if they wanna get into the clinic,

00:22:22.488 --> 00:22:23.607
let's let them get into the

00:22:23.627 --> 00:22:25.909
clinic for their first evaluation.

00:22:26.509 --> 00:22:27.729
We're not gonna let them do

00:22:27.769 --> 00:22:28.690
that without understanding

00:22:28.750 --> 00:22:30.210
they can have faster access

00:22:30.230 --> 00:22:31.371
by going virtually,

00:22:32.330 --> 00:22:33.250
but it really is about

00:22:33.771 --> 00:22:36.952
relieving those burdens of care.

00:22:36.992 --> 00:22:37.932
Cost is another one.

00:22:37.972 --> 00:22:39.094
So within Moby Health,

00:22:39.114 --> 00:22:40.554
what we do is we contract

00:22:40.594 --> 00:22:42.674
with employers to offer this as a benefit

00:22:43.671 --> 00:22:45.653
And so this is offered at a

00:22:45.732 --> 00:22:48.015
benefit at the cost to the employees.

00:22:48.355 --> 00:22:49.655
There's no out-of-pocket cost.

00:22:49.715 --> 00:22:52.038
It's another huge burden to

00:22:52.097 --> 00:22:53.219
seeing physical therapy care.

00:22:53.239 --> 00:22:54.500
That was one thing that I

00:22:54.539 --> 00:22:55.882
saw in Walmart glaringly.

00:22:55.922 --> 00:22:57.722
I don't think anybody in the

00:22:59.023 --> 00:23:02.727
claims-based space is missing that.

00:23:02.767 --> 00:23:03.988
But in Walmart in particular,

00:23:04.028 --> 00:23:04.868
where you're talking about

00:23:04.888 --> 00:23:05.829
an employee that's making

00:23:06.492 --> 00:23:07.113
you know, eleven,

00:23:07.173 --> 00:23:08.294
twelve dollars an hour and

00:23:08.314 --> 00:23:09.795
has a seventy five dollar copay,

00:23:10.336 --> 00:23:12.477
a seventy five dollar copay per visit it.

00:23:12.958 --> 00:23:14.398
What it does is it expedites

00:23:14.939 --> 00:23:16.900
care into those less conservative,

00:23:16.960 --> 00:23:21.083
lower valuable channels

00:23:21.103 --> 00:23:22.384
because it becomes less expensive.

00:23:22.703 --> 00:23:22.865
Right.

00:23:23.085 --> 00:23:23.684
Right.

00:23:23.724 --> 00:23:24.665
One point when you're

00:23:24.826 --> 00:23:25.445
talking one hundred and

00:23:25.465 --> 00:23:26.267
fifty dollars visit,

00:23:26.307 --> 00:23:27.167
people aren't choosing

00:23:27.228 --> 00:23:28.288
between physical therapy

00:23:28.327 --> 00:23:29.308
and seeing the ortho.

00:23:30.049 --> 00:23:31.049
They're they're choosing

00:23:31.089 --> 00:23:32.451
between physical therapy and dinner.

00:23:32.671 --> 00:23:33.711
And that was a recollection

00:23:33.731 --> 00:23:34.952
that really hit me upside

00:23:34.972 --> 00:23:36.094
the head pretty hard.

00:23:36.909 --> 00:23:37.308
Um,

00:23:37.368 --> 00:23:39.570
and just understanding that side of the

00:23:39.631 --> 00:23:40.290
fence, like it's,

00:23:40.411 --> 00:23:42.571
it's not just about not

00:23:42.613 --> 00:23:44.493
going to orthopedic surgeon

00:23:44.634 --> 00:23:47.295
or not going to, um, you know,

00:23:47.394 --> 00:23:47.976
urgent care.

00:23:48.476 --> 00:23:50.416
It might be about dinner or, you know,

00:23:50.457 --> 00:23:51.917
feeding kids or feeding yourself.

00:23:52.598 --> 00:23:54.019
So, so that that's,

00:23:54.118 --> 00:23:55.099
that's another huge burden

00:23:55.119 --> 00:23:56.340
that we overcome, um,

00:23:56.381 --> 00:23:58.241
by directly contracting with employers.

00:23:59.451 --> 00:24:00.692
Now, we've spoken a few times,

00:24:00.751 --> 00:24:01.613
but I don't know you too well.

00:24:01.633 --> 00:24:02.874
But what I have taken away

00:24:02.933 --> 00:24:04.496
is you're a pretty optimistic guy.

00:24:04.596 --> 00:24:05.676
I don't know if you have to

00:24:05.717 --> 00:24:07.798
be optimistic to be an innovation,

00:24:07.818 --> 00:24:09.000
but I'm pretty sure it helps.

00:24:09.540 --> 00:24:10.642
And you're optimistic really

00:24:10.682 --> 00:24:11.382
about the future of

00:24:11.422 --> 00:24:12.303
healthcare or else you

00:24:12.323 --> 00:24:13.344
wouldn't be doing what

00:24:13.364 --> 00:24:15.205
you're doing and physical therapy,

00:24:15.226 --> 00:24:16.126
that nice crossroads.

00:24:16.406 --> 00:24:17.627
So even at a time when many

00:24:17.667 --> 00:24:18.828
are feeling uncertain,

00:24:18.989 --> 00:24:20.711
I feel like I'm getting

00:24:20.851 --> 00:24:22.353
optimism from you.

00:24:22.413 --> 00:24:23.513
But what gives you hope?

00:24:23.913 --> 00:24:25.636
And what role do you see PTs

00:24:25.676 --> 00:24:26.398
playing in the broader

00:24:26.419 --> 00:24:29.124
healthcare landscape moving forward?

00:24:29.263 --> 00:24:30.226
I feel like movie health is

00:24:30.486 --> 00:24:31.969
a great way of saying, hey,

00:24:32.490 --> 00:24:33.612
geography matters.

00:24:34.284 --> 00:24:35.605
we could remove the pain of

00:24:35.644 --> 00:24:37.106
geography and speed and

00:24:37.186 --> 00:24:39.068
time which sounds like

00:24:39.088 --> 00:24:40.029
something crazy if we had

00:24:40.049 --> 00:24:40.809
said that fifteen years ago

00:24:40.849 --> 00:24:41.810
I'm gonna bend time we're

00:24:41.830 --> 00:24:42.892
gonna remove time from the

00:24:42.951 --> 00:24:43.833
equation how are you gonna

00:24:43.853 --> 00:24:45.213
do that but we've shown

00:24:45.394 --> 00:24:46.315
necessity is the mother of

00:24:46.435 --> 00:24:49.018
invention uh that if we had

00:24:49.057 --> 00:24:52.280
to do that we could so in a

00:24:52.320 --> 00:24:53.001
role like yours with

00:24:53.041 --> 00:24:54.303
innovation what are you

00:24:54.343 --> 00:24:56.164
excited about in terms of the future

00:24:57.613 --> 00:24:57.692
Yeah.

00:24:57.712 --> 00:24:58.613
PT in particular.

00:24:58.792 --> 00:25:01.035
So I'll focus in on PT

00:25:01.075 --> 00:25:02.776
because I don't think that

00:25:02.816 --> 00:25:04.277
there's a more exciting

00:25:04.436 --> 00:25:06.317
time to be in physical therapy.

00:25:06.338 --> 00:25:07.179
And, you know,

00:25:07.199 --> 00:25:08.859
I think Larry does a really

00:25:08.900 --> 00:25:09.721
good job of this.

00:25:09.740 --> 00:25:10.781
You know,

00:25:11.241 --> 00:25:12.682
amongst some of the challenges

00:25:12.722 --> 00:25:13.644
that face us,

00:25:14.124 --> 00:25:15.164
it really is the best time

00:25:15.484 --> 00:25:17.846
to be in PT and necessity

00:25:17.885 --> 00:25:18.747
breeds innovation.

00:25:19.086 --> 00:25:19.186
Well,

00:25:19.207 --> 00:25:20.929
that's happening on the broader

00:25:20.969 --> 00:25:21.689
healthcare space.

00:25:21.868 --> 00:25:22.750
And another, you know,

00:25:22.789 --> 00:25:25.070
real focus of Movi is cost savings,

00:25:25.131 --> 00:25:25.852
not only to the

00:25:27.204 --> 00:25:28.704
to the employer or to the

00:25:28.744 --> 00:25:29.746
patient but to the health

00:25:29.766 --> 00:25:31.586
plan as well and we know pt

00:25:31.846 --> 00:25:33.686
is where that happens and I

00:25:33.727 --> 00:25:34.646
remember specifically

00:25:34.686 --> 00:25:35.747
having a conversation when

00:25:35.767 --> 00:25:37.606
I was taking the role at

00:25:37.646 --> 00:25:39.968
walmart health was we don't

00:25:40.028 --> 00:25:41.268
have to go do anything

00:25:41.307 --> 00:25:42.588
different than what we do

00:25:43.449 --> 00:25:45.749
to be effective so if pts

00:25:45.769 --> 00:25:47.130
are only access ten percent

00:25:47.250 --> 00:25:49.690
of what they need to be we

00:25:49.710 --> 00:25:50.750
we have a ninety percent

00:25:50.790 --> 00:25:51.770
upside we don't have to cut

00:25:51.871 --> 00:25:53.431
anything out we just have

00:25:53.471 --> 00:25:54.590
to go reach more people

00:25:54.632 --> 00:25:56.432
which has its challenges that's not easy

00:25:57.307 --> 00:25:59.008
But what a time to be alive.

00:25:59.269 --> 00:25:59.729
Are you kidding me?

00:25:59.769 --> 00:26:01.569
What a time to be a physical therapist.

00:26:01.990 --> 00:26:03.612
We get to go be effective by

00:26:03.672 --> 00:26:05.794
being what we are because

00:26:06.674 --> 00:26:07.955
controls or costs have

00:26:07.976 --> 00:26:09.896
gotten so out of sorts, right?

00:26:10.397 --> 00:26:11.759
So where other people might

00:26:11.778 --> 00:26:13.599
have to cut out their intervention,

00:26:13.660 --> 00:26:14.881
the health care system is

00:26:14.921 --> 00:26:16.663
looking to us to step up.

00:26:16.883 --> 00:26:17.844
We've got to step up and

00:26:17.884 --> 00:26:19.704
take the opportunity to

00:26:20.065 --> 00:26:21.105
recognize our value,

00:26:21.886 --> 00:26:23.268
recognize our value in cost,

00:26:23.307 --> 00:26:25.910
recognize our value in life, like

00:26:26.496 --> 00:26:28.157
people are better when

00:26:28.178 --> 00:26:29.460
they've seen a physical therapist.

00:26:29.880 --> 00:26:31.602
I'm certainly the beneficiary of that,

00:26:31.642 --> 00:26:34.185
having a mom who's a PT, right?

00:26:34.246 --> 00:26:35.247
It's easy for me to see.

00:26:35.948 --> 00:26:38.090
So I think it's easy to be optimistic.

00:26:38.310 --> 00:26:40.453
And when I find myself pessimistic,

00:26:40.574 --> 00:26:42.455
I start to look at, what am I consuming?

00:26:43.076 --> 00:26:43.978
What am I looking at?

00:26:44.578 --> 00:26:45.519
And I get pessimistic.

00:26:45.979 --> 00:26:47.799
yeah exactly right turn in

00:26:47.839 --> 00:26:49.381
the wheel and and narrow

00:26:49.661 --> 00:26:51.060
and so if I can zoom out of

00:26:51.101 --> 00:26:52.942
that and recognize where we

00:26:53.001 --> 00:26:54.482
are as a profession how far

00:26:54.502 --> 00:26:56.804
we've come you can is it

00:26:56.864 --> 00:26:59.305
two states I think now um

00:26:59.384 --> 00:27:00.566
that have some kind of

00:27:00.586 --> 00:27:02.467
restriction on direct

00:27:02.567 --> 00:27:04.007
access beyond the first

00:27:04.047 --> 00:27:05.587
visit but forty-eight

00:27:05.627 --> 00:27:06.729
states you can walk in and

00:27:06.749 --> 00:27:08.849
be treated um now you know

00:27:08.869 --> 00:27:09.750
there's there's some

00:27:10.130 --> 00:27:11.750
changes based on state but

00:27:13.060 --> 00:27:13.701
I remember, I mean,

00:27:13.761 --> 00:27:14.561
I graduated in twenty

00:27:14.622 --> 00:27:16.022
sixteen and the number was

00:27:16.063 --> 00:27:18.904
definitely it was like ten or twelve.

00:27:19.105 --> 00:27:19.846
And it was like I remember

00:27:19.865 --> 00:27:20.767
looking at the map they

00:27:20.787 --> 00:27:22.548
used to put online and they'd be like,

00:27:22.607 --> 00:27:23.689
well, eventually we'll get there.

00:27:23.769 --> 00:27:25.490
People being like, I'll never get there.

00:27:26.070 --> 00:27:27.392
And it wasn't overnight,

00:27:27.592 --> 00:27:29.393
but someone had to keep

00:27:29.432 --> 00:27:31.214
pushing that and be optimistic about it.

00:27:31.255 --> 00:27:32.134
Now it's twenty, twenty four.

00:27:32.154 --> 00:27:34.497
And we're we're at, you know, forty,

00:27:34.596 --> 00:27:35.738
forty eight, as you mentioned,

00:27:36.178 --> 00:27:40.942
you've unrestricted, unrestricted, right?

00:27:40.961 --> 00:27:42.182
You can see them as long as you want.

00:27:42.643 --> 00:27:43.282
Right.

00:27:44.403 --> 00:27:45.345
It's a good time to be a

00:27:45.365 --> 00:27:45.984
physical therapist,

00:27:46.005 --> 00:27:46.826
which is good because this

00:27:46.846 --> 00:27:48.166
is the only time you have a choice.

00:27:48.287 --> 00:27:49.606
This is the only time there's an option.

00:27:50.048 --> 00:27:51.008
You can say you wanted to go

00:27:51.028 --> 00:27:52.028
back to the good old days

00:27:52.189 --> 00:27:54.130
and it would be nice, but you can't.

00:27:54.509 --> 00:27:55.010
So you might as well be

00:27:55.050 --> 00:27:56.471
optimistic of what you have now.

00:27:56.912 --> 00:27:58.053
When I think if we went back

00:27:58.073 --> 00:27:58.952
there and really looked at

00:27:58.992 --> 00:28:02.255
the landscape there, you know,

00:28:02.375 --> 00:28:03.756
it would be a different

00:28:03.796 --> 00:28:04.936
conversation maybe,

00:28:04.977 --> 00:28:06.617
but a lot of the same

00:28:06.657 --> 00:28:07.659
problems and even more

00:28:07.699 --> 00:28:08.499
challenging problems, right?

00:28:08.519 --> 00:28:08.699
We're,

00:28:09.019 --> 00:28:10.160
we're not where we are today because

00:28:10.180 --> 00:28:11.320
we haven't overcome anything.

00:28:11.340 --> 00:28:11.480
Sure.

00:28:11.912 --> 00:28:14.532
And so there's a ton that's been overcome.

00:28:15.134 --> 00:28:16.634
And in that, there's a ton of opportunity,

00:28:16.654 --> 00:28:17.694
which is super exciting.

00:28:18.234 --> 00:28:19.016
Yep.

00:28:19.056 --> 00:28:19.135
Now,

00:28:19.155 --> 00:28:20.817
you've mentioned that your success in

00:28:20.836 --> 00:28:22.397
your career, personally, professionally,

00:28:22.557 --> 00:28:24.818
often comes down to saying yes.

00:28:25.318 --> 00:28:26.299
Can you share a time when

00:28:26.339 --> 00:28:27.921
taking a leap of faith paid

00:28:27.980 --> 00:28:29.080
off for you professionally?

00:28:29.121 --> 00:28:31.423
What'd that look like?

00:28:31.502 --> 00:28:34.203
Yes, there's a couple of times,

00:28:34.223 --> 00:28:35.085
and maybe that's not

00:28:35.144 --> 00:28:37.105
surprising given the things

00:28:37.125 --> 00:28:38.185
we've already talked about here.

00:28:38.246 --> 00:28:41.288
But think about the first time

00:28:42.412 --> 00:28:44.773
I really the second job I took.

00:28:44.794 --> 00:28:45.914
So I took a job right out of

00:28:45.954 --> 00:28:48.518
PT school at a small clinic

00:28:48.538 --> 00:28:50.058
called Core Physical Therapy in Bonair,

00:28:50.098 --> 00:28:50.479
Georgia.

00:28:50.578 --> 00:28:51.820
Fantastic first job.

00:28:51.961 --> 00:28:52.922
I couldn't have been in a

00:28:52.981 --> 00:28:54.103
better place for my first

00:28:54.143 --> 00:28:56.365
job to to be nurtured in a

00:28:56.525 --> 00:28:57.746
in a clinical environment,

00:28:58.807 --> 00:28:59.847
have co-workers that really

00:28:59.867 --> 00:29:00.989
cared about me as a new

00:29:01.009 --> 00:29:03.750
grad and clinically supported me.

00:29:03.770 --> 00:29:05.972
But very quickly, I I knew that I needed,

00:29:06.374 --> 00:29:07.815
you know, sort of the next step.

00:29:08.964 --> 00:29:10.346
So my wife is a PT as well.

00:29:10.646 --> 00:29:12.409
I guess unsurprising, my mom, my wife.

00:29:13.609 --> 00:29:15.852
And so she was graduating.

00:29:15.971 --> 00:29:17.233
It was time to look for

00:29:17.493 --> 00:29:18.694
somewhere to go together

00:29:18.734 --> 00:29:19.476
where we were going to have

00:29:19.496 --> 00:29:20.196
a job together.

00:29:20.237 --> 00:29:22.699
We were dating and engaged at the time,

00:29:22.719 --> 00:29:23.279
but not married.

00:29:23.740 --> 00:29:24.221
So we're going to get

00:29:24.260 --> 00:29:25.541
married and we need to go find a job.

00:29:25.582 --> 00:29:27.183
And we got a connection with

00:29:27.703 --> 00:29:29.746
to John Childs through my

00:29:30.326 --> 00:29:31.268
wife's brother-in-law.

00:29:32.317 --> 00:29:33.718
And so I interviewed him.

00:29:33.798 --> 00:29:34.578
I'll never forget it.

00:29:34.878 --> 00:29:35.019
Um,

00:29:35.358 --> 00:29:36.679
he took the call coming home from the

00:29:36.699 --> 00:29:37.519
lake with his family,

00:29:37.539 --> 00:29:39.319
which I was just beside

00:29:39.359 --> 00:29:40.361
myself that he would take

00:29:40.381 --> 00:29:41.721
his personal time to talk to me.

00:29:42.621 --> 00:29:44.142
Um, anyway, they offered me the job.

00:29:44.281 --> 00:29:45.902
So I talked to John Childs on the phone.

00:29:45.922 --> 00:29:47.522
I'm going to San Antonio, Texas.

00:29:48.202 --> 00:29:48.623
Um,

00:29:48.643 --> 00:29:50.963
the only time I had been in San Antonio,

00:29:51.003 --> 00:29:53.005
Texas was a layover to my

00:29:53.045 --> 00:29:53.845
honeymoon in Hawaii.

00:29:54.384 --> 00:29:56.705
So I didn't know who these guys were.

00:29:56.986 --> 00:29:59.507
Uh, I had never been to Texas.

00:30:00.338 --> 00:30:01.539
And we loaded up at U-Haul

00:30:01.579 --> 00:30:04.001
and drove to Texas with no place to live.

00:30:04.221 --> 00:30:08.265
So said yes and landed us there.

00:30:08.746 --> 00:30:10.106
Can't say enough good things

00:30:10.126 --> 00:30:11.748
about my time at TexPTS and

00:30:11.788 --> 00:30:13.288
what I learned and the

00:30:14.009 --> 00:30:15.130
opportunities that I was

00:30:15.150 --> 00:30:16.310
given through mentorship

00:30:16.351 --> 00:30:18.192
and through just the

00:30:18.232 --> 00:30:19.493
immense opportunities that

00:30:19.973 --> 00:30:21.394
TexPTS and Confluent Health

00:30:21.414 --> 00:30:23.116
just provided and leadership training.

00:30:23.277 --> 00:30:25.438
And really the next step was

00:30:25.577 --> 00:30:26.940
always super easy because

00:30:26.960 --> 00:30:27.500
it was right there.

00:30:27.519 --> 00:30:30.061
I just had to say yes and go do it.

00:30:31.142 --> 00:30:32.002
which then led me to the

00:30:32.022 --> 00:30:33.182
Walmart Health Opportunity.

00:30:33.202 --> 00:30:36.065
So COVID hit, Georgia's home,

00:30:36.184 --> 00:30:37.345
Texas is where I was.

00:30:39.086 --> 00:30:39.527
But there was this

00:30:40.126 --> 00:30:41.867
opportunity that popped up in Noonan,

00:30:41.907 --> 00:30:42.407
Georgia.

00:30:42.708 --> 00:30:43.528
And well,

00:30:43.568 --> 00:30:45.288
Noonan is where my PT school

00:30:45.308 --> 00:30:45.890
roommate lives.

00:30:46.829 --> 00:30:48.391
Two of my wife's classmates are there.

00:30:49.751 --> 00:30:51.232
My wife was looking to get back home.

00:30:51.252 --> 00:30:51.732
We had some health

00:30:51.772 --> 00:30:53.334
challenges in our family.

00:30:53.354 --> 00:30:55.634
And we've got two kids now.

00:30:56.275 --> 00:30:57.195
We want them to be around

00:30:57.215 --> 00:30:57.955
their grandparents.

00:30:57.976 --> 00:30:59.876
So hey, maybe there's an opportunity here.

00:31:01.251 --> 00:31:04.252
So I talked to the recruiter like, man,

00:31:04.732 --> 00:31:06.653
Walmart, I just don't know about Walmart.

00:31:07.493 --> 00:31:07.973
The next day,

00:31:08.294 --> 00:31:09.375
Bridget Finley gets on the

00:31:09.394 --> 00:31:10.355
phone and calls me.

00:31:10.375 --> 00:31:11.515
We really need you to do this.

00:31:11.976 --> 00:31:13.976
And so I said, Danielle,

00:31:14.016 --> 00:31:14.977
I think we got to do this.

00:31:15.037 --> 00:31:15.876
I think we got to do it.

00:31:16.836 --> 00:31:17.257
And they said,

00:31:17.518 --> 00:31:19.077
so took the job and she said, great,

00:31:19.097 --> 00:31:20.317
we need you there in six weeks.

00:31:21.019 --> 00:31:22.638
So with a,

00:31:22.659 --> 00:31:23.539
with a three-year-old and a

00:31:23.579 --> 00:31:25.440
one-year-old we sold our

00:31:25.480 --> 00:31:26.400
house in two days,

00:31:27.221 --> 00:31:30.142
we flew to Georgia to find a house that,

00:31:30.201 --> 00:31:30.682
you know, we,

00:31:31.499 --> 00:31:32.900
got an off put in an offer

00:31:32.920 --> 00:31:34.300
and got got the house that

00:31:34.320 --> 00:31:36.782
we live in now um literally

00:31:36.843 --> 00:31:38.884
loaded up a u-haul with two

00:31:38.904 --> 00:31:40.266
kids and moved back to

00:31:40.326 --> 00:31:42.146
georgia uh waiting to close

00:31:42.186 --> 00:31:43.688
on our house so we kind of

00:31:43.708 --> 00:31:45.309
homeless in the interim so

00:31:46.049 --> 00:31:47.270
yeah I lived with my pt

00:31:47.290 --> 00:31:48.791
school roommate um and his

00:31:48.832 --> 00:31:50.874
family I stayed on they had

00:31:50.894 --> 00:31:52.414
a spare bedroom so it's not

00:31:52.454 --> 00:31:53.635
like the days of pt school

00:31:53.655 --> 00:31:54.916
where you lay on the couch but

00:31:55.760 --> 00:31:55.881
yeah,

00:31:55.901 --> 00:31:57.821
they were super gracious to take me in.

00:31:57.862 --> 00:31:59.182
My family stayed with family

00:31:59.343 --> 00:32:01.644
until we were able to close on our house.

00:32:01.684 --> 00:32:02.904
But, but just again,

00:32:02.944 --> 00:32:05.126
it was just an intuition

00:32:05.166 --> 00:32:06.548
and opportunity to say yes.

00:32:06.607 --> 00:32:07.907
And then again, with,

00:32:08.189 --> 00:32:10.529
with Movi came up is really

00:32:10.569 --> 00:32:11.570
exciting opportunity.

00:32:11.611 --> 00:32:14.632
Things with Walmart were, they were going,

00:32:15.452 --> 00:32:15.653
but,

00:32:15.833 --> 00:32:17.874
but at a snail's pace and we kind of

00:32:17.913 --> 00:32:18.934
saw the writing on the wall

00:32:18.974 --> 00:32:20.096
that that's come full circle.

00:32:20.135 --> 00:32:21.395
Now we understand, you know,

00:32:21.435 --> 00:32:22.477
what happened with Walmart, but

00:32:23.188 --> 00:32:24.269
But again, like, oh man,

00:32:24.328 --> 00:32:26.569
I don't know virtual care,

00:32:27.211 --> 00:32:28.510
but it's exciting and it's

00:32:28.611 --> 00:32:29.892
new and it's different and

00:32:29.932 --> 00:32:30.833
it's an opportunity.

00:32:30.873 --> 00:32:31.933
So I think I should do it

00:32:33.714 --> 00:32:34.555
and just went for it.

00:32:34.694 --> 00:32:36.476
And so that's paid dividends,

00:32:36.516 --> 00:32:38.337
but obviously not outside

00:32:38.397 --> 00:32:40.519
of developing relationships

00:32:40.578 --> 00:32:41.619
and knowing people and

00:32:41.640 --> 00:32:43.621
making sure that what

00:32:43.701 --> 00:32:46.403
builds me as the people

00:32:46.462 --> 00:32:47.323
that I'm with and the

00:32:47.343 --> 00:32:48.624
people that I'm working

00:32:48.644 --> 00:32:49.605
with on a daily basis.

00:32:49.644 --> 00:32:51.645
So the exciting part now is that

00:32:52.743 --> 00:32:52.903
You know,

00:32:52.963 --> 00:32:54.085
three of the clinicians that I

00:32:54.105 --> 00:32:55.226
work with every day on the

00:32:55.266 --> 00:32:57.727
virtual team were all

00:32:57.767 --> 00:32:59.949
connected back to being a new grad,

00:33:00.249 --> 00:33:03.171
like one year in residency at TexPTS.

00:33:03.371 --> 00:33:05.932
So one I worked directly with in residency,

00:33:06.112 --> 00:33:07.032
one I actually hired to

00:33:07.073 --> 00:33:08.034
work in my clinic.

00:33:09.273 --> 00:33:10.535
And then our other one, Linda,

00:33:11.035 --> 00:33:12.415
was in Austin area,

00:33:13.037 --> 00:33:14.156
but was brought up in sort

00:33:14.176 --> 00:33:15.317
of the TexPTS residency.

00:33:15.377 --> 00:33:16.479
So it was really full circle.

00:33:16.499 --> 00:33:17.338
We kind of all went our

00:33:17.378 --> 00:33:18.480
different ways and then

00:33:18.519 --> 00:33:20.340
came back and landed on the same team.

00:33:20.748 --> 00:33:22.130
not by any doing of my own,

00:33:22.630 --> 00:33:24.672
we just all ended back in the same spot,

00:33:24.711 --> 00:33:24.872
right?

00:33:24.912 --> 00:33:26.134
I didn't rehire them.

00:33:26.794 --> 00:33:27.634
They had just developed

00:33:27.654 --> 00:33:28.936
their expertise in an area

00:33:28.957 --> 00:33:30.659
that was back intersecting

00:33:30.679 --> 00:33:31.439
with my expertise.

00:33:31.459 --> 00:33:34.583
So it's been a ton of fun to see how,

00:33:34.643 --> 00:33:34.843
you know,

00:33:35.669 --> 00:33:37.191
Faithful steps have resulted

00:33:37.270 --> 00:33:39.112
in where I'm at today.

00:33:39.132 --> 00:33:40.693
Looks like just like a road full of yeses.

00:33:41.374 --> 00:33:42.115
It is key though.

00:33:43.256 --> 00:33:43.415
Just yes.

00:33:43.435 --> 00:33:44.336
Saying yes to everything.

00:33:44.396 --> 00:33:44.938
Yes, man.

00:33:45.157 --> 00:33:46.419
That movie did highlight

00:33:46.459 --> 00:33:47.160
where saying yes to

00:33:47.220 --> 00:33:48.340
everything can get you in trouble,

00:33:48.401 --> 00:33:49.682
but really it's, it's,

00:33:50.242 --> 00:33:52.285
it's understanding what

00:33:52.325 --> 00:33:53.445
might drive the yes.

00:33:53.746 --> 00:33:54.487
That's exactly right.

00:33:54.507 --> 00:33:55.327
So understanding like,

00:33:56.561 --> 00:33:58.625
this is a good opportunity to say yes,

00:33:59.045 --> 00:33:59.826
but also, I mean,

00:34:00.165 --> 00:34:01.288
I'm guilty of this as well,

00:34:01.667 --> 00:34:03.529
which is understanding what to say no to,

00:34:03.549 --> 00:34:04.511
because if you say yes to

00:34:04.531 --> 00:34:07.434
something for the reason to say yes,

00:34:07.674 --> 00:34:08.777
you actually are saying no

00:34:08.797 --> 00:34:09.556
to something else that

00:34:09.677 --> 00:34:11.719
might be a better opportunity.

00:34:11.780 --> 00:34:13.963
So, and this is the worst part is I get to,

00:34:14.402 --> 00:34:16.264
I have to say that my PT school

00:34:16.846 --> 00:34:17.527
professors knew what they

00:34:17.547 --> 00:34:18.347
were talking about when it

00:34:18.367 --> 00:34:19.807
was like time to be self-reflective.

00:34:19.867 --> 00:34:20.369
And I had never,

00:34:20.389 --> 00:34:21.750
I didn't want it to do this

00:34:21.809 --> 00:34:23.331
much reflection in PT school.

00:34:23.831 --> 00:34:24.532
And then the more you

00:34:24.592 --> 00:34:26.152
actually do it in big opportunities,

00:34:26.193 --> 00:34:27.074
that's where the answer is.

00:34:27.114 --> 00:34:28.034
The answer isn't Google.

00:34:28.275 --> 00:34:28.994
It's not AI.

00:34:29.615 --> 00:34:30.056
The answer,

00:34:30.436 --> 00:34:31.856
the answer might be talking to

00:34:31.916 --> 00:34:32.697
someone else,

00:34:33.217 --> 00:34:34.498
but if they just ask good questions,

00:34:34.559 --> 00:34:35.099
you're going to talk

00:34:35.119 --> 00:34:36.360
yourself into or out of the

00:34:36.400 --> 00:34:37.822
thing that you knew was right all along.

00:34:37.842 --> 00:34:38.561
Yeah.

00:34:38.641 --> 00:34:39.063
And every,

00:34:39.262 --> 00:34:40.923
every opportunity to say yes

00:34:40.963 --> 00:34:42.505
really has been more than

00:34:42.545 --> 00:34:44.586
just a narrow view, right?

00:34:44.606 --> 00:34:46.088
It's, it's not just my career.

00:34:46.128 --> 00:34:46.327
Like,

00:34:46.965 --> 00:34:47.666
the first one was an

00:34:47.706 --> 00:34:48.646
opportunity for me and my

00:34:48.686 --> 00:34:50.588
wife to move away from

00:34:50.648 --> 00:34:51.668
family and sort of charter

00:34:51.688 --> 00:34:52.269
our own territory.

00:34:52.289 --> 00:34:54.411
So there, you know, we talk about this,

00:34:54.670 --> 00:34:56.072
you know, work-life balance.

00:34:56.092 --> 00:34:58.092
I think it was Daphne Scott

00:34:58.132 --> 00:35:00.574
that taught more of a

00:35:00.614 --> 00:35:02.096
work-life harmonization, right?

00:35:02.155 --> 00:35:03.396
Like I'm not a different

00:35:03.436 --> 00:35:04.818
person at work than I am at home.

00:35:04.858 --> 00:35:07.719
And so making decisions, you know,

00:35:07.739 --> 00:35:08.940
for your career in light of

00:35:08.981 --> 00:35:10.681
your personal situation is

00:35:10.762 --> 00:35:11.541
super important.

00:35:11.842 --> 00:35:13.563
And every step that we have

00:35:13.603 --> 00:35:16.666
taken has been both helpful for,

00:35:17.358 --> 00:35:18.878
you know, my career, but,

00:35:18.978 --> 00:35:19.800
but that was the biggest

00:35:19.820 --> 00:35:22.202
thing at risk where, you know, personally,

00:35:22.242 --> 00:35:22.581
they were,

00:35:22.762 --> 00:35:24.222
they were good moves for me and

00:35:24.262 --> 00:35:24.903
my family.

00:35:25.204 --> 00:35:26.144
And, and, you know,

00:35:26.184 --> 00:35:27.525
the career was the add on and,

00:35:27.766 --> 00:35:29.588
and has been absolutely

00:35:29.608 --> 00:35:31.509
helpful and I wouldn't change anything,

00:35:31.648 --> 00:35:32.650
any step along the way.

00:35:33.891 --> 00:35:35.152
So, so yeah, yeah.

00:35:35.192 --> 00:35:35.371
Don't,

00:35:35.692 --> 00:35:38.213
don't say yes for nothing and make

00:35:38.233 --> 00:35:39.175
sure that you're saying yes

00:35:39.195 --> 00:35:40.896
to the right things for sure.

00:35:40.996 --> 00:35:43.697
And introspection is huge.

00:35:43.778 --> 00:35:45.500
If I went into something where I had to

00:35:46.239 --> 00:35:47.541
you know, be quiet and get in line.

00:35:47.601 --> 00:35:49.161
It probably wouldn't go so well for me.

00:35:49.181 --> 00:35:49.402
Right.

00:35:49.463 --> 00:35:51.043
I wouldn't be.

00:35:51.764 --> 00:35:52.545
Last thing we do on each

00:35:52.565 --> 00:35:53.565
episode is the parting shot.

00:35:53.585 --> 00:35:54.206
It's your chance.

00:35:54.326 --> 00:35:55.286
You can repeat something you

00:35:55.306 --> 00:35:57.188
said before or something like, Oh yeah,

00:35:57.329 --> 00:35:58.670
that's a, that's a new idea or a,

00:35:58.789 --> 00:36:00.210
or a soapbox statement.

00:36:00.231 --> 00:36:01.311
A lot of people in education

00:36:01.391 --> 00:36:01.911
usually have their,

00:36:02.273 --> 00:36:03.434
their typical soapboxes.

00:36:03.793 --> 00:36:05.094
What's a, what's your parting shot?

00:36:05.494 --> 00:36:05.675
Yeah.

00:36:05.695 --> 00:36:07.577
You don't have three hours for a soapbox.

00:36:07.617 --> 00:36:08.637
So I'll leave you with a

00:36:08.677 --> 00:36:11.039
parting shot as see

00:36:11.099 --> 00:36:12.721
challenges as an opportunity.

00:36:13.856 --> 00:36:14.579
Yeah, love that.

00:36:14.920 --> 00:36:15.400
Stephen Clark,

00:36:15.440 --> 00:36:16.081
clinical innovations

00:36:16.101 --> 00:36:16.983
director at Confluent Health.

00:36:17.003 --> 00:36:17.626
Appreciate your time, man.

00:36:17.646 --> 00:36:20.371
Yeah, thanks for having me, Jimmy.

00:36:20.693 --> 00:36:20.893
All right.